32 réponses à ce sujet

[Kimarous]

If you ask Fiona about the invitation to speak with the mages at Val Royeaux, she denies that she ever met with you and it's heavily implied that some impressive imposter did so instead. Do they ever explain this in-game? The closest explanation that comes to mind is that the Envy Demon impersonating the Lord Seeker doubled back and played the role of Fiona to send you into Alexius' grasp, but WHY it would do that makes little sense to me. So, is there any explanation given, or is it a minor plothole?

[Sardoni]

Time travel.

 

 

Siding with the mages makes it more obvious.  Seems like you sided with the Templars.  It was her but then Alexius went back and time and scooped her up right after the temple of sacred ashes exploded at the moment they were most vulnerable and well before they knew of your existence to ally.

 

So the Fiona you met was different than the one you meet later.  If you follow all the red dialog options in the initial meet and greet before picking a side even Fiona picks up on how convenient the Alexius' timing was.

[Todd23]

My guess why she doesn't remember it after the time change, but you do could be due to The Anchor.

[Link37]

We learned that Alexius used time magic to make it to Redcliff so quickly. So perhaps the Fiona who invited you in Val Royeaux was the Fiona in the version where Alexius didn't arrive in time and so she chose to ally with the inquisition instead of Tevinter? Not really sure, just  theory. But this is why I hate time travel stories. So many plotholes...

[Kantr]

We learned that Alexius used time magic to make it to Redcliff so quickly. So perhaps the Fiona who invited you in Val Royeaux was the Fiona in the version where Alexius didn't arrive in time and so she chose to ally with the inquisition instead of Tevinter? Not really sure, just theory. But this is why I hate time travel stories. So many plotholes...

Alexius creates a new timeline. So probably when we encounter the time fade rift at Redcliffe we still remember the old one. Or something.

[Kel Eligor]

I don't really like this because if Alexius altered the timeline, we would have no recollection of meeting her since she would have never been in Val Royaux to begin with. If there had been a strange "Glitch in the Matrix" esque scene where the Inquisitor thought he met Fiona, but then everyone didn't remember/noticed her, it would have been much more obvious that something was wrong or at least alluded to time magic. Even playing through it again it seems random. 

[Ashagar]

Its likely has something to do with the anchor and connection to the fade.

[Laterali]

Fiona comes to you in Val Royeaux to invite you to meet her in Redcliffe. Shortly after this, Alexius uses his time magic to go back in time two days earlier and offers to protect the mages. The mages in desperation agree. This means that Alexius technically creates a new timeline after you meet Fiona. Now the only part that is questionable is how Fiona still manages to invite you after the timeline has been created. This all depends on if the timeline split would be the initial point when Alexius goes back in time, after you meet her, or when he arrives in the past. that's something for temporal physics nerds to argue over.

 

I think the reason the Inquisitor is able to remember the invitation when Fiona can not is because: 1, The mark is uses the same kind of magic, likely making the Inquisitor at least somewhat immune to its effects. 2, The Inquisitor's timeline wasn't altered, only Fiona's.

[lady8jane]

The explanation may be much easier: When the inquisitor talks to her in Redcliff there are a lot of people around and they already have made the pact with the Tevinters. So naturally she is like "What are you talking about, I totally didn't do that!" to save face and protect her ass.

 

But I guess time magic is more fun as an explanation.

[Taleroth]

I don't really like this because if Alexius altered the timeline, we would have no recollection of meeting her since she would have never been in Val Royaux to begin with.

The rift is what makes it possible. The anchor could prevent the Inquisitor from being swept up in changes.

I'm pretty sure the time travel explanation is intended. Fiona goes to Val Royeaux, then Alexius travels to before Fiona left. Issues of time travel consistency to be sussed out later.

[Kantr]

The rift is what makes it possible. The anchor could prevent the Inquisitor from being swept up in changes.

I'm pretty sure the time travel explanation is intended. Fiona goes to Val Royeaux, then Alexius travels to before Fiona left. Issues of time travel consistency to be sussed out later.

Could be the fade rift outside of Redcliffe protected us from the timeline re-write. The only way to clear that up would be if the inquisiton is confused as to why you went there.

[ASDF0716]

more importantly- in my case, I was a non-templar / non-mage, minor noble of a family from the Free Marches... WT total F was I doing at the Conclave?

[Knight of Dane]

I thought it was Dorian conjuring an illusion. No reason why though, that was just my initial guess before the time travel stuff was revealed.

[Ashagar]

more importantly- in my case, I was a non-templar / non-mage, minor noble of a family from the Free Marches... WT total F was I doing at the Conclave?

 

The game makes that clear at the beginning that your family has very deep ties to the chantry and are intend on you joining the chantry regardless of your personal feelings on the mater. You can note later how devote your family and parents are as well as the sheer numbers of family members who are members and ranking members of the chantry.

[ralphfromdk]

The timeline (You getting an invite that you shouldn't be getting) is a little borked because the magic used isn't quite perfect just yet.

 

Alexius isn't fully in control of it. His main reason for using it, is to go back in time to before his son was attack by darkspawn and infected.

But no matter how hard he tries, he can't fix it.

Chyripho*insert fart sounds*-what's-his-name also want's Alexius to do a bit of timemagic to fix the player not being at the conclave, and borking up the ritual.

This he also fails at doing.

 

So yeah, the whole time travel thing is less than stable, so it kinda makes sense that you still remember getting the mage invite without it actually happening.

It's all a bit wibbely-wobbely.

[OdanUrr]

[Wulfram]

I'd say the change in timeline was limited to Redcliffe and vicinity, not to the whole world.

Though that would leave the interesting prospect that if Fiona hadn't returned to Redcliffe there'd now be two of her

[MissOuJ]

The explanation may be much easier: When the inquisitor talks to her in Redcliff there are a lot of people around and they already have made the pact with the Tevinters. So naturally she is like "What are you talking about, I totally didn't do that!" to save face and protect her ass.

 

But I guess time magic is more fun as an explanation.

 

Yeah, I totally thought this was the case, until

 

Spoiler

in Cassandra's personal quest it is mentioned that apparently the Lord Seeker was in two places at the same time as well. I haven't completed a Templar playthrough, so I have no idea what's going on there, but something iffy is certainly going on, and I doubt it's just "Of course I didn't go to the Inquisitor to save us from this Tevinter Magister nonsence, no ser!" Then again in Cassandra's quest they just mention he used magic to dupe people, so it might as well be a charm or some other kind of spell, maybe.

 

But I guess time-magic generated dobbelgängers are as good an explanation as any other...

[sylvanaerie]

I'd say the change in timeline was limited to Redcliffe and vicinity, not to the whole world.

Though that would leave the interesting prospect that if Fiona hadn't returned to Redcliffe there'd now be two of her

 

Why must there be only one?  Bodies are such limiting things...

 

I thought initially it was blood magic, Alexius using Fiona to lure the Inquisitor to Redcliffe with a proposed alliance to trap her.  Time magic explanation technically makes sense, but if it were, and limited to the area of Redcliffe, technically everyone (except maybe the Inquisitor because of her anchor) would have 'adapted' to the new timeline when the entered it's confines--which would have definitely explained the whole time travel thing a little more plainly.

 

Possibly rewriting when they leave...I dunno.  Time travel paradox gives me a splitting headache.

[MissOuJ]

A Demon @MissOuj

 

Ooh, that makes sence. Thanks for the clarification!

 

So it could just as well be Fiona covering her butt and trying to free her people from Alexius after she found out about the Inquisition - no time travel necessary.

[Evil Asch]

If you ask Fiona about the invitation to speak with the mages at Val Royeaux, she denies that she ever met with you and it's heavily implied that some impressive imposter did so instead. Do they ever explain this in-game? The closest explanation that comes to mind is that the Envy Demon impersonating the Lord Seeker doubled back and played the role of Fiona to send you into Alexius' grasp, but WHY it would do that makes little sense to me. So, is there any explanation given, or is it a minor plothole?

I always assumed it was Dorian. If memory serves he says something snarky about how quickly Alexius arrived at Red Cliff. Granted, Dorian already knew about Alexius' work on time travel magic but we also don't know where Dorian was prior to the destruction of the conclave. He's certainly powerful enough to have worked that type of magic.

[leaguer of one]

God I'm super late with this...

.

 

This as awkward as this...

[Dai Grepher]

If you ask Fiona about the invitation to speak with the mages at Val Royeaux, she denies that she ever met with you and it's heavily implied that some impressive imposter did so instead. Do they ever explain this in-game? The closest explanation that comes to mind is that the Envy Demon impersonating the Lord Seeker doubled back and played the role of Fiona to send you into Alexius' grasp, but WHY it would do that makes little sense to me. So, is there any explanation given, or is it a minor plothole?

 

Two options.

 

1. That was her, and afterward Alexius used time travel to go back to just after the conclave and convince the mages to join with Tevinter. In which case, Fiona did not go to Val Royeaux to meet the Herald.

 

This has problems because time travel should have made it appear to you that Fiona did not speak with you at all. Also, this might create two of Alexius, one that goes back in time, and one that doesn't need to. Unless he simply goes back in time within himself, like returns to an earlier point in time with knowledge of the future.

 

The game makes it seem to me like the timeline does not change until after Alexius used time magic to alter history. Meaning, the change is not instant and unnoticeable. Rather the change only happens the moment Alexius leaves to travel back in time. So think of it this way. The Fiona from your timeline would not disappear from it until after she meets you in Val Royeaux. And she reappears in a different location with different memories of the timeline that she lived (where Alexius went back in time and convinced her to join). In this case, I think it would be the same with all the mages under her command, regardless of where they were, since her decision affects all of their fates. If so, then there would be a lot of people witnessing mages suddenly disappear.

 

The second option is this, it's mine, and I prefer this because it makes the most sense.

 

2. The Fiona you met in Val Royeaux was the envy demon, while the Lucius you met in Val Royeaux was the real Lucius. We know from Cassandra's personal quest that Lucius and Envy were working together. And we also know from Fiona that the templars suddenly showed up to attack them and Alexius suddenly showed up to save them from these templars.

 

So my theory is this. Alexius used time travel to go back to before the Inquisition could meet with Fiona at Redcliffe and even Val Royeaux. This means that meeting at Redcliffe actually happened, but Alexius' time travel prevented it and overwrote it with a new timeline. Namely, the timeline we experience in the game. In other words, there was a timeline that you did not experience because of time travel. Alexius also allied with Lucius through Corypheus and Envy so that Lucius' templars would show up and threaten the mages. This would scare Fiona into the service of Tevinter. Next, Lucius had to make sure that the Herald would not interfere with the corruption of the templars. So Alexius allowed Envy to study Fiona's appearance and speech for the purpose of impersonating her and luring the Herald to Redcliffe where Alexius would be waiting to spring his trap. Meanwhile, Lucius made a very public condemnation of the Herald to make it appear that the Inquisition would get no help from the templars. This way the mages seem like the more attractive ally.

 

And that was the whole point, get the Herald to go after the mages where Alexius would be ready with his time magic trap, and Lucius could teach Envy to impersonate him so that it could corrupt the templars without the Herald interfering.

 

That's my personal theory, and it's what I go with. Far superior to the mage arc, and actually improves it in my opinion.

[BSpud]

It's time travel in a different universe. We don't need to worry about paradoxes and causality on a cosmic scale.