2858 réponses à ce sujet

[Vyndral]

Wait, are we seriously comparing killing a noble who could potentially be helpful to the Inquisition with killing extremist cultists who want to make Corypheus a God?

How do you know! You didnt stop to talk to them! Just kill kill kill! Maybe they were a squad of Dorians ex's run away to join the Inquisistion and you slaughtered them like dogs! You Heartless cad! Or maybe Dorian is using the Inquisition to further his own goals and he wants them killed to silence them before they tell you! You never ever tried to talk to them! Just fire ball to the face! It makes me sick! Sick I say!

An i doin it rite?

[Demon Velsper]

My personal reasons for hating Sera are that she's talks and acts like an idiot. She's also extremely annoying whenever she opens her mouth.

 

Plus she says "innit" and if I had my way there'd be a pogrom against people who do.

[Shelidon]

The option to kick Sera out is always there, nobody is saying you can't do it. We are just calling out the blatant hypocrisy in claiming that Sera is somehow less moral because she kills on her own terms instead of on the Inquisitior's terms.

Really really really the morality of Sera has never been the point of my argument. I could care less if she eats baby qunaris for breakfast. The point is precisely what Hazegurl said, as far as I'm concerned, and I couldn't have explained that better myself. The Inquisitor is not tagging along, this is not DA2 and Sera is not the Inquisitor friend. We just used the Inquisition resources for her quest, we exposed ourselves: this has become an operation and the Inquisition is not something Sera (or anybody else) can use. While I appreciate companions bringing in their personal quests and insights for the common good, Sera had just a "too personal" angle on the matter. Hence she had to go. And please try to see another point: the option to kick her out after that quest is not the random "Get out of here" option but a special two way choice you have to make. The whole situation is supposed to be upsetting, the confrontation is part of the way the scene is written. It's not preposterous or made up by people who hate Sera for personal meta-game reasons.

[NWN-Ming-Ming]

Wait, are we seriously comparing killing a noble who could potentially be helpful to the Inquisition with killing extremist cultists who want to make Corypheus a God?

Said noble already has a bad reputation, further damaged by interference with the Red Jenny.

That same noble also tried to kill the Quizzie.

That self-same noble also murdered an unarmed man in cold blood right in front of the Quizzie.

Any potential help that noble could provide is immediately negated upon the first conversation tree answers you get out of him, when he reveals he's only interested in saving his own skin. 

 

As the Inquisitor, I immediately weighed the potential harm that noble could bring to the Inquisition, either through his own unilateral actions, or by association with the Inquisition, and I found that the gains of his death and preventing further harm outweighed any potential gains from leaving him alive or having associations with him.

 

So yea, I'm more than happy to make that comparison.

[Barathos]

I did not say it was the same. The issue is all the people suggesting Sera killing that murderous noble set her Beyond the moral Pale, yet Dorian killing ten times that many Venatori goes completely without comment.
 
Except for Sera. Sera kills a noble and CLUTCH MY PEARLS! WHAT A PSYCHO!, right? You can't have it both ways. If murder is how things get done in Thedas than what Sera does to that noble is not something to get all bent out of shape about.

Because they're actually a huge threat vs some random noble who is inconsequential in comparison to what's going on. You're killing psychos vs something that happens every day in the ranks of nobility. Thedas is at war with the Venatori and Coryphesus, not the nobility of thedas. Two different animals, and no you're not saying they're the same, you're just making a very bad comparison.

And also, the way she KILLS him is ... no. I get it, he's a bad guy, but he's not THE END ALL BAD GUY that deserves to get a knife kicked into his head a couple times. 

[Steelcan]

Said noble already has a bad reputation, further damaged by interference with the Red Jenny.

That same noble also tried to kill the Quizzie.

That self-same noble also murdered an unarmed man in cold blood right in front of the Quizzie.

Any potential help that noble could provide is immediately negated upon the first conversation tree answers you get out of him, when he reveals he's only interested in saving his own skin. 

 

As the Inquisitor, I immediately weighed the potential harm that noble could bring to the Inquisition, either through his own unilateral actions, or by association with the Inquisition, and I found that the gains of his death and preventing further harm outweighed any potential gains from leaving him alive or having associations with him.

 

So yea, I'm more than happy to make that comparison.

The noble called it off as soon as he realized the Inquisitor was working with Red Jenny, he assumed that the Inquisitor was in a similar boat as himself in being manipulated.

 

Letting that man be beaten to death by a raving moron is cruel and unnecessary

 

Yes, working with him is going to soil the Inquisition forever, like working with demon using Wardens, or apostate mages, or templars....... right

[Hazegurl]

Tevinter is part of the continent of Thedas.....

I did not need the lesson as I am referring to the Venatori not Tevinter. It doesn't matter if it's personal for Dorian. They are key Venatori targets that helps us both. There is no comparison other than a weak attempt to throw Dorian under the bus for Sera's sake.

[NWN-Ming-Ming]

And also, the way she KILLS him is ... no. I get it, he's a bad guy, but he's not THE END ALL BAD GUY that deserves to get a knife kicked into his head a couple times. 

I really have no idea why people find the way Sera kills the noble to be any more disturbing than the numerous ways we as players burn, freeze-shatter, wormhole, skull-cleave, eviscerate, or bloody-pulp any of our enemies.

 

I actually found the wine-making sound-effects to be quite satisfying and soothing. 

[OG Swift]

Sera is lesbian, immature players don't approve that

[Nathair Nimheil]

The Inquisitor is not tagging along, this is not DA2 and Sera is not the Inquisitor friend. We just used the Inquisition resources for her quest, we exposed ourselves: this has become an operation and the Inquisition is not something Sera (or anybody else) can use.

I guess I just don't have an officious enough outlook. Hell, I didn't even make her fill out an RFK-19 Request for Official Resource Outlay form.

 

The whole situation is supposed to be upsetting, the confrontation is part of the way the scene is written.

It certainly didn't upset everyone. In fact many of us took it as a perfect case in point of Sera and the Jenny's raison d'etre.

[Steelcan]

Sera is lesbian, immature players don't approve that

you have got to be joking

[NWN-Ming-Ming]

The noble called it off as soon as he realized the Inquisitor was working with Red Jenny, he assumed that the Inquisitor was in a similar boat as himself in being manipulated.

I had at least two companions point out that the noble didn't call it off as soon as he recognized the Quizzie, he called it off after his mercenaries were killed by the Quizzie and company.  Claiming otherwise was pure BS prevarication on the part of the noble.

[OG Swift]

And also, the way she KILLS him is ... no. I get it, he's a bad guy, but he's not THE END ALL BAD GUY that deserves to get a knife kicked into his head a couple times. 

 

Sera kills Corypheus? Or who does she kill (other than anyone else does)?

[Barathos]

Sera kills Corypheus? Or who does she kill (other than anyone else does)?

Depending on how you handle her personal quest, she'll kill the noble in quite the gruesome manner.

 

I really have no idea why people find the way Sera kills the noble to be any more disturbing than the numerous ways we as players burn, freeze-shatter, wormhole, skull-cleave, eviscerate, or bloody-pulp any of our enemies.

 

I actually found the wine-making sound-effects to be quite satisfying and soothing. 

Yeah, but again, they're actually the bad guys that are aiming to sow chaos everywhere...

 

Now, just outright killing a noble is bad mojo. Why? Nobles have heirs. You kill one, another one pops up to take his place. If you could relinquish all his belongings AND execute him (Like head chop off, not mangle a corpse psycho-clown style) then sure! I'd be ok with this!

[Nathair Nimheil]

Because they're actually a huge threat vs some random noble who is inconsequential in comparison to what's going on.

You know, that noble was a pretty consequential threat to the unarmed servant he murdered right in front of us and then waved away as insignificant. Sera thinks that matters. It seems that is the crux of the thing, Sera actually gives a rodent posterior about that servant like he mattered or something.
 

And also, the way she KILLS him is ... no. I get it, he's a bad guy, but he's not THE END ALL BAD GUY that deserves to get a knife kicked into his head a couple times.

I see. It's OK to set someone on fire and then fill them full of arrows or knock them unconscious, freeze them solid and then smash them to flinders from behind but kicking them? OMFG THAT'S OUT OF CONTROL!

[Zeroth Angel]

Sera is lesbian, immature players don't approve that

I still don't understand that there are seriously people who think this.

[NWN-Ming-Ming]

Nobles have heirs. You kill one, another one pops up to take his place. If you could relinquish all his belongings AND execute him (Like head chop off, not mangle a corpse psycho-clown style) then sure! I'd be ok with this!

Everybody needs a hobby!  I like the repetitive tasks, noble-farming is quite soothing.  Bring me more!  It's better than moving-to-click-pick Elfroot!  LOL! 

 

Imagines that soothing relaxing sound... *squish squish pulpy crunch squish squish*

[OG Swift]

Depending on how you handle her personal quest, she'll kill the noble in quite the gruesome manner.

 

Oh does she? I have put that fool under Inqusition which made her laugh - I even did pranks with her and ate cookies. She's a bit awkward but I like her in overall. Cole or Solas are much worse.

[Barathos]

You know, that noble was a pretty consequential threat to the unarmed servant he murdered right in front of us and then waved away as insignificant. Sera thinks that matters. It seems that is the crux of the thing, Sera actually gives a rodent posterior about that servant like he mattered or something.
 

I see. It's OK to set someone on fire and then fill them full of arrows or knock them unconscious, freeze them solid and then smash them to flinders from behind but kicking them? OMFG THAT'S OUT OF CONTROL!

After the Inquisition puts resources into some vague "threat" that she wants, sure he's a threat to us! And the servant, if I understood it right, was actually a traitor. So killing him isn't actually THAT big of a "Oh look at her! Looking out for the 'little people'!" The noble finished up a possible judgement on the Inquiisitor's / Sera's part.

 

Context is everything, my dear. Killing somebody who's just standing there while you have all the power in the world at your finger tips to deal with him in a gruesome manner is... very poor on a head leader's part. Killing somebody who's coming at you with swords, spells, knives and who knows what else in a gruesome manner BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO KILL YOU RIGHT THERE is different.

Again with the bad comparisons! Yeesh!

 

Everybody needs a hobby!  I like the repetitive tasks, noble-farming is quite soothing.  Bring me more!  It's better than moving-to-click-pick Elfroot!  LOL! 

 

Imagines that soothing relaxing sound... *squish squish pulpy crunch squish squish*

*The Trevallen (sp?) mage steps away very, very slowly*

[KillTheLastRomantic]

 

I see. It's OK to set someone on fire and then fill them full of arrows or knock them unconscious, freeze them solid and then smash them to flinders from behind but kicking them? OMFG THAT'S OUT OF CONTROL!

 

You are comparing gameplay content to story content. You know they are not the same. I KNOW you know they are not the same, but it serves your argument so you are using it anyway. Be willing to concede points in an argument.

 

If I chose to stridently roleplay a pacifist and just IGNORE all trash mobs coming at the party I would not be able to progress through the game. Comparing that with the (excessively violent) killing of a named story NPC you're in conversation with is willfully ignorant. They are NOT comparable. Now if you were talking about a cutscene in the game where, say, the Inquisitor brutally butchers Briala because of her polotical machinations, THAT is comparable. Of course, talking about the Inquisitors story related actions is difficult because they are influenced by the player. I didn't execute anyone during judgement, for example. If I had, that would be potentially comparable to Sera's actions. Random trash mob enemies that you must kill to progress as a basic gameplay requirement is not relevant.

[Shelidon]

It certainly didn't upset everyone. In fact many of us took it as a perfect case in point of Sera and the Jenny's raison d'etre.

Yes, of course. There are both options: the game is designed that way. That's why the thread is "why do a lot of people hate Sera" and not "why are you supposed to say Sera". It is about finding out other people's point of view. Or, since we're going French, am I being naive?

[Hazegurl]

The thread was created to hear the pov of those who aren't fond of Sera. Then Sera fans came in, read things they knew they weren't going to like..and then not liked it. LOL!! Ah BSN. I love it here.

[dekarserverbot]

Plus she says "innit" and if I had my way there'd be a pogrom against people who do.

 

Totally unrelated as my "she is not barefoot" complain... however not meta-gaming with her had made most inquisitors to kick her off just after "inquisition needs bees!" mission, seems that only Anders could bear with her. I know she was created to be the "troll trolling troll" but ended being the ubber stupid memetic troll cliche and this makes many people to think she is poorly written. A good example of a well written "troll trolling troll" is Godot from Ace Attorney Trials and tribulations, abusing of cliches and trying to make the square fit in the circle is not the way to create a character...

 

 

Sera is lesbian, immature players don't approve that

 

Are you stupid or you just don't know how to read? NONE hates her for that reason. Also I wanted Lelianna to be full les in origins so everyone could had just one LI instead of "straight people gets 2 and gay people gets only 1 that is not  completely gay"

[Nathair Nimheil]

After the Inquisition puts resources into some vague "threat" that she wants, sure he's a threat to us! And the servant, if I understood it right, was actually a traitor. So killing him isn't actually THAT big of a "Oh look at her! Looking out for the 'little people'!" The noble finished up a possible judgement on the Inquiisitor's / Sera's part.

I don't really know what you thought happened there but this does not seem to describe the actual events. To whom was the servant "a traitor"? How was the noble a threat "to us"? Could you recap how you saw the story, I think we'll find fundamental differences in perception here.
 

Killing somebody who's just standing there while you have all the power in the world at your finger tips to deal with him in a gruesome manner is...

...exactly what the noble did to his servant?
 

Killing somebody who's coming at you with swords, spells, knives and who knows what else in a gruesome manner BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO KILL YOU RIGHT THERE is different.

OIC! So when I, for example, poison my arrows and Full Draw some bandit standing oblivious and way outside engagement range that's "fair" but when 45kg Sera goes bare handed and one-on-one against that noble it's completely horrible! And when that same noble has an unarmed servant shot in the back a couple of times thats... what? Not worth worrying about?

 

How... pragmatic.

[skotie]

That guy was actively attacking the Inquisitor when Sera shot him. It's not like she just up and shot a guy minding his own business.

He was? I never got the memo, perhaps she might have left the decision of his death to you then? O wait nope! Arrow in my face!