289 réponses à ce sujet

[SomeoneStoleMyName]

*Spoilers*

 

One of the things that made victory in this game kinda cheap, implausible and sour... was the fact that there was no real loss. Cory attacks haven, sure. But the damage was minimal.

No companions ever in real danger of injury or death
No feeling of true opposition and danger

Hate to use the old FF7 metaphor, but the reason Sephiroth was such a great villain was because it was personal. Because he took someone you loved away from you. It doesent need to be a romance option that he kills (DA: I), it doesent need to be someone close, and ofcourse it should be possible to avoid it with the right choices and such.

But Cory? There was no real personal emotional aspect in hating him or wanting to stop him. Sure he wanted to become a god, and he attacked haven after you stole his anchor... but he never really did any damage to you or yours in any way. He killed Inquisition soldier 146 and Inquisition soldier 558 along with civillian 16 and the grumpy alchemist you had known for 3 hours.

The game lacks an emotional drive and personal agenda. The opposition in the game feels weak. The Inquisition is too strong, too safe, and you and your Inquisition never ever experience any loss, tragedy or sorrow.

These things are key ingredients in a story IMO. There was no real feeling of opposition either, so the victory felt cheap, easy and unsatisfying. 

 

Feel free to disagree/agree and why.
 

[SofaJockey]

Hmmm - so a downbeat ending would be better for you, full of sacrifice?

A bit like ME3 ?

 

BioWare wouldn't live it down...

[Proposition_Joe]

I agree with op, up until the Haven attack the game feels exciting, after that it feels easy and there no real danger to companions or the nations as a whole.

Some more dramatic events , some tragedy on the way would have lead to that the victory would feel more satisfying. Now its just undramatic, no really big feels, no sense of loss,no real urgency.

[SomberXIII]

They aren't the only forces that can define gaming. Games can be created without these elements. As said multiple times in DAI, there's no time for mourning.

 

I agree with some points. The Inquisition felt safe and the victory was cheesy.

[Proposition_Joe]

Not much reason to mourn either after Haven

[celestialfury]

eh, I remember people saying that about the ME2 mission being ''too easy'', and then look what happened with ME3! I don't think people are as down with grimdarkness and everyone dying as much as they say they are...

[Proposition_Joe]

yeah but everyone lives doesnt define danger either, its like disney, one or two losses on the way to victory would only heighten the emotional impact.

[RGC_Ines]

Hi

Maybe main plot is little weak ( and I expected someone different as a main enemy, I will not discuss it here. But I don't need personal drama, to have motivation to defeat main antagonist. There were a lot of ppl that died in a Haven and in whole game, You see them only as numbers, but I see them as alive as my companions are..Of course my PC havn't relationship with them, don't know theirs stories, etc but still I want to protect them. I was really sorry to see Roderick death, or two lovers who where on a date in a wrong place and in wrong time,and I found theirs bodies, or a scholar who tried to get knowledge about rifts. Or poor servant in a Ville.  There are a lot of little pieces of drama becouse of Red Lyrium Templars, Cory and a Rifts in a game world. Maybe they don't have too much impact on yours emotions, becouse You need to have something more personal but for me it's ok.

[Proposition_Joe]

Yeah, taste differs, it doesnt need to be personal but then it could be in my face more for a more dramatic effect. Maybe its just me but the story and its effect just doesnt get to me at all.I do all things and i just feel deattached from it all.

[Lianaar]

It would have been exciting to see something more risky, where you could have experienced the feeling of imminent threat.
There were enough tragedies in the game, scattered in letters and npcs you stumbled into. There were in the companion quests. Though not in the sense of feeling fear for the companions.

[Maconbar]

Looking back at things, I have the feeling that the Inquisitor manages to disrupt every move by Cory. In the end Cory has been totally isolated and then is easily defeated. In with the setback at Haven, Cory is still foiled in his real goal.

[Linkenski]

While the ending is not good, it's not the core problem. As OP points out, the victories in DAI don't feel earned when there aren't any low-points of the story. Haven could've been one, if maybe an important character had died there, of if there had been a point of no return before the final battle where Corypheus partly succeeds.

Take a moment like the game of Wicked Grace with your entire squad. It doesn't feel earned because you and your crew hasn't been through enough hardship. Maybe you've spent 100+ hard earned hours doing side quests, and unlocking keeps, but the main story never reached a point for me where I felt like "man, these guys could really use some rest now"

Now ME3 might have had a terrible ending, but in that game, all the smaller moments felt earned because Shepard goes through so much ****. He loses an important companion to ME1's villain, he potentially loses several in the suicide mission, and if anything he's gained distrust from working with a somewhat rogue organization. In Mass Effect 3 he's forced to be the front man in an impossible war. There was some real wear and tear there.

All the characters experience in Inquisition is victory, victory, victory. Corypheus is like that cartoon villain who spoils his plans to his nemesis, failing each and every one of them, because he sucks.

[KiwiQuiche]

Eh, I'm just glad it's not another "No matter what u suck" end like ME3. About time we had a game where you can get a crapload of allies and armies and actually succeed. Unlike other people, I do not want a game where my progtaongist constantly fails and complains and angst like Shepard does in ME3. That got annoying hella quick.

[Kulyok]

My own ending was extremely sad, I think. Loss and tragedy all around.

 

Solas romance, plus the entire clan dead, and she herself caught in the Inquisition as a gilded cage - as there's no option to disband it immediately and probably no option to escape Leliana's scouts, either.

[Icinix]

I think it's pretty good, and while there isn't anything really crushing, I don't mind that.

 

As much as it's in vogue right now for people to want games to push the wallow in misery angle, Dragon Age 2 was just depressing after depressing and was incredibly emotionally draining.

 

Inquisition - for search of a better more impacting word - is fun.

 

While there was very little tragedy and misery directed directly at the Inquisition as a whole, there were numerous times throughout in other aspects of the game that had some gut wrenching moments, and some points in personal quests that were hard hitting. More than enough to pluck those feel strings, and done in a way that didn't leave you reeling.

[Realyn]

Eh, I'm just glad it's not another "No matter what u suck" end like ME3. About time we had a game where you can get a crapload of allies and armies and actually succeed. Unlike other people, I do not want a game where my progtaongist constantly fails and complains and angst like Shepard does in ME3. That got annoying hella quick.

 

I don't agree with all your posts on this forum, but damn I agree with this one so much.

 

Granted, it's probably not the best ending to a game ever (not bad either mind you), but it beats playing 140+ hours,and seeing what can only be described as a glorified Game Over screen popping up. Tragedy is one thing, feeling like you just wasted your time is another.

[Wulfram]

Excluding the ending I think ME3 is probably the best balanced as far mixing failure and success. Shepard can achieve some really big things, but he's not quite the invincible mary sue of Origins and Inquisition nor does he fail at everything like Hawke.

[Corto81]

All the characters experience in Inquisition is victory, victory, victory. Corypheus is like that cartoon villain who spoils his plans to his nemesis, failing each and every one of them, because he sucks.

 

Rings true.

You even have the option as an answer to say to one of Corypheus' minions about how he must be used to disappointment because he's failing at everything.

[sylvanaerie]

Frankly, there was plenty of death to go around in my Dalish elf's story. 

 

First, there was the loss of Justinia, the hope for peace shattered by Cory's actions.  For the first time in a Bioware game I actually saw death being treated in a realistic fashion as the people mourned their loss.  I found Leliana's and Cassandra's pain to be especially poignant.  It wasn't mine, but I don't need to feel something like that personally to feel it.  

 

I found small stories to be immediately impactful as I discovered more and more of the world.  The suffering and death of refugees and soldiers in Crossroads, Haven and Skyhold.  My Dalish's clan, wiped out by human racists, leaving her alone in the world among shems who saw her not as a person but a symbol.  Lots of people lost (the drowned victims in Crestwood, the occasional corpse of this or that brother lost in the war, the loss of all the mages or templars if you pick one side over the other, the loss of Grey Wardens who were sacrificed by their brothers all because of Cory's trick, choosing between Hawke and her GW friend, the Seekers, betrayed from within and all killed).  And other losses impacted me as hard as death.  The loss of her culture hit keenly at the Well, and realizing to those who were the beginnings of her people, she was unworthy.  Morrigan's loss of free will (in regards to Flemeth) after drinking--the only time I actually cried in the game.  Cried tears.

 

As far as I'm concerned these losses were as cutting as killing off any companion, more so because companions are with you out of choice.  These others are just innocent people caught up in a clash of titans they aren't prepared for.  Well, maybe not Morrigan but the average Joe's caught in the crossfire.

 

One of the most heartwrenching things I heard in a dialogue was it was the workers in the Inquisition who first came to the defense of Haven and Cory squashed them like ants.  Just regular people who's hearts were too big for their own good.  No matter how many I saved, I would lose another, and I was running around trying to save them all.

 

And watching Leliana, (and your two companions who accompany you) die to buy you time for the ritual to send you back in Redcliffe, not knowing if what Dorian was doing would even work was heartbreaking.

 

There was plenty of death to evoke emotions if you got invested in their stories and their loss.  Technically, it's a game.  They aren't real to begin with.  You can only get as emotionally invested in imaginary lives as you can convince yourself they are a loss to begin with.  I found even the little, behind the scenes stories to be emotionally impactful.

[Chaos17]

Awekening was better in someway if you didn't upgraded your fort well, you will loose companions and I even discovered that you can be able to save the city of amaranthide+the fort ! I guess they can be both saved if you've a high companion rating ?

[Icinix]

Awekening was better in someway if you didn't upgraded your fort well, you will loose companions and I even discovered that you can be able to save the city of amaranthide+the fort ! I guess they can be both saved if you've a high companion rating ?

Yeah - and if you did the upgrades and a few other things by memory.

I love Inquistion, but DAO is still the pinnacle (for myself obviously) of modern RPGs. It got so much right.

 

Except playing as Darkspawn.

 

There was never any need for that. Ever.

[Jaron Oberyn]

I'm actually glad the game wasn't too tragic. Kind of had my fill of that for a while with Mass Effect 3. It's good to get something a bit different. I enjoyed this game for what it is. 

[Teddie Sage]

I agree with you OP. The rest of the game is awesome in my opinion, but that finale is disappointing. I figure ME2 spoiled us a lot with the epic Suicide Mission.

[Vanth]

I agree with the OP.

[pottman]

Nah, had enough of tragedy, likes happy ending.