289 réponses à ce sujet

[sunnydxmen]

when have companions in dragon been in danger of dying  for real by the story even dao all companions dont get hurt by the darkspawn,

[Larryboy_Dragon]

I disagree - I think it's about par for previous games. In fact, only ME2 has the core team in real risk.

In fact, I think this game has a more active bad-guy than most other Bioware RPGs. In DAO Logain stays in his tower, in DA2 there is no real baddie, in ME1 you don't contact the baddie much and in ME2 the baddie is hidden most the game.
DA:I is the only one I can think of where the villain attacks your base directly.

[KaiserShep]

when have companions in dragon been in danger of dying  for real by the story even dao all companions dont get hurt by the darkspawn,

 

Hawke's remaining sibling was in very real danger of dying. The game does kind of drop a big hint with Leandra's interruption of the expedition briefing, though.

[Bethgael]

Firstly, I really liked this game. The Dragon Age series is great and this game didn't disappoint(much better than DA2 IMHO). However, I felt an empty feeling from ending as well. Enough people died, though. I think it had more to do with the way the exposition would jump ahead seemingly at random, with no explanation of the in-between whatsoever. That last boss fight, for instance, went all:

 

Corypheus is heading to Skyh... BAM!!!! Now we're fighting on a floating castle in the sky.

 

I still have no idea what happened there, though I assume it was the ruins of Haven. That kind of thing happened throughout the whole game, and it gave it an awkward, disjointed feeling.

 

It was so sudden I actually thought I'd done a quest or something that had allowed me to skip parts of the fight (like, for example, if you do Cullen's Samson quest line you get to break his armour).

Apparently not, though.

I also had no idea exactly where we were. The balcony looked like my bedroom balcony at Skyhold. But... wait... didn't they send me back to the Temple of Ashes? Couldn't be Haven, because no castles there...

 

It was distracting, even before the end fight.

I, also felt the Actual Story was too short (everything else was lots of busywork that acted as extend-a-game and don't get me started on the companions post-game--seriously, there's absolutely no point at all playing after you've done the main story. It's all just busywork and one-liners after that). The pacing is terrible. The climax is Haven.

Playing on th mage side does, I feel, give the whole thing more gravitas, but, even so. I partly agree with the OP.

But I also... didn't mind Cory being "easy". I kind of felt that was the point. His hubris had built him up to be more than he was, and those who opposed him did the same. I think that, this may have been the point, all up. Building him up to be more than he was, only to find that he was actually a Great Big Nothing?

The Nightmare was the loose end, though. Sure, someone stayed behind... bodily... in The Fade... to keep it off us, but... then, nothing. I suspect that's going to show up again.

[StrangeStrategy]

I agree, somewhat. Knowing that you might lose a companion makes every decision so much more important: We could lose a few NPCs at Haven, but even if we did (or didn't) they get replaced at Skyhold by new ones. We could have horrible manners at the Orlesian Ball and still successfully succeed at whatever we want, playing the game or not... I didn't feel like the Nobles were as threatening as Josephine said they were, unless you actually imagine they are.

And the final mission, damn, slightly disappointing. In DAO and especially DA2, companions can die. You know someone won't come back from the Archdemon without the ritual, you know the landsmeet is going to shake things up, you can lose companions on Sacred Ashes/Broken Circle too. It makes your choices have immediate, harsh consequences. In DA2, siding with the wrong side without a companion's respect makes the oppose you, resulting in their death.

In DAI... Everything is fine. No matter how poorly you play or how blind you are to the machinations of the court or how slowly you advance through an area during a mission... Every one of your companions makes it through. Sure, Hawke/Warden can die, and Bull's Chargers can die... But not our companions. That lowers the stakes so much, because we don't actually suffer any consequences besides feeling bad for a dead NPC.

 

Bottom line, I would have liked it if companions could die as a result of our poor choices... And stay dead. In Redcliffe they all die, but that's a time-erased alternate universe thing... I think. So it doesn't stick with us... Sort of lame. I would have liked it if the game didn;'t hold our hand and made it possible to fail.

[Massa FX]

I don't understand why some main characters have to die in a game for the game to be interesting.  I went through some grieving with ME3 while I watched someone I love slowly pass away IRL. 

 

Grieving isn't "fun" and I play games to have FUN. My real life is full of enough pain as it is. I don't want my virtual gaming experience to repeat life's lessons that I've already learned and will  experience. Because no-one gets a pass on death IRL.

 

Watching someone you care about die isn't FUN. Trust me, I know firsthand. Death isn't fun. Or humorous. Or entertaining. If you think it is... please seek help. 

 

Please Bioware don't listen to these people. Make games Fun, not painful.

[Il Divo]

I don't understand why some main characters have to die in a game for the game to be interesting.  I went through some grieving with ME3 while I watched someone I love slowly pass away IRL. 

 

Grieving isn't "fun" and I play games to have FUN. My real life is full of enough pain as it is. I don't want my virtual gaming experience to repeat life's lessons that I've already learned and will  experience. Because no-one gets a pass on death IRL.

 

Watching someone you care about die isn't FUN. Trust me, I know firsthand. Death isn't fun. Or humorous. Or entertaining. If you think it is... please seek help. 

 

Please Bioware don't listen to these people. Make games Fun, not painful.

 

Gonna have to say, this post is too emotionally charged. Games are meant to provide for a diverse range of the human experience. The idea that they exist solely to make us feel warm and fuzzy inside is extremely limiting. 

 

And this is coming from someone who thinks DA:I's story is great as is. 

[Ashagar]

You mean getting kicked out of the winter court allowing the empress to be assassinated and the grand duke to be arrested for it causing a game over isn't failing?

[Massa FX]

Gonna have to say, this post is too emotionally charged. Games are meant to provide for a diverse range of the human experience. The idea that they exist solely to make us feel warm and fuzzy inside is extremely limiting. 

 

And this is coming from someone who thinks DA:I's story is great as is. 

 

having someone die in a game shouldn't happen because of popularity vote. death of characters shouldn't be trivial or common. there's enough desensitizing horror in the world as it is. 

 

just my opinion. i'm sure there will be more than a handful of people that will disagree. i'm just hoping Bioware respects all opinions and considers the consequence of making games with lots of death just because it's popular to do so. people make demands on game dev's to do any number of things. it's up to the devs to decide what makes sense and what is ... can't come up with a good word for trivializing death and saying it's art/entertainment. 

 

note: Bioware is a gaming company I can count on for certain things. If I want to experience that range of emotion you mention, I'll go buy a horror genre game, or that new thing that's out... mass murderer video games, or a GTA style game that's full of gratuitous violence. But Bioware... it's better than that. At least, I hope it's better.

[Bethgael]

It's not the matter of getting a good ending that's the issue here, it's the matter of it feeling earned; which it does not, considering that you get the same exact result no matter what your choices are in the game. Where are the forces I enlisted at Redcliffe's refugee camp, leading the charge against the temple? Where are the Chevaliers? The Avaar? Why could I not have seen my forces that I worked through quests to obtain actively fighting? Why could I have not seen them lost if I placed them in the wrong areas? In addition to this, I recall there being a system in place in the alpha where one could choose to save the inquisition's keep or a village in an area, similar in some ways to Awakening's finale. What happened to this system?

 

No matter what you work to achieve, you will always face Corypheus in the same, straightforward manner and his forces will have the same size no matter if you actively thwart them outside of story events or not. There is no impact, positive or negative otherwise, that makes one feel triumphant when they finally come to face him. All your choices feel meaningless in the grand scale of things, hence the victory feeling hollow.

 

I completely agree with this. The apparent antagonist is not the issue (as I said earlier, maybe his ease was the point), but all of this, really is. Nothing I did mattered in any sort of real sense. The story plays out the same way no matter what you do (epilogue slides--what there were of them--change a wee bit, but that's all).

I actually agonised over sending my forces to a War table darkspawn raid because I'd exiled the Wardens. I thought I'd lose them all. I thought endgame would be different, maybe harder, because I'd weakened Cullen's numbers. Would taking Cullen with me on his quest put him in real danger? Was Josephine ever really in any personal danger of being assassinated? If oyu ignore her quest, can she actually die?

Nope. Didn't matter one whit.

DA:I is clearly a mid-story game. It's not done.

And... by "apparent" antagonist... Corypheus wasn't. It's very clear that

Spoiler

Solas is the actual Tragicly Aligned Bad Guy, here.

Corypheus was just the trigger to set the Inquisition going. The entire game is a 150-hour setup for the next game and/or its own DLCs, along with hints and in-game story hints from minor NPCs (like Cole-Rhys, Fiona-Alistair, the Orlesian court) which are there to wrap up/point to other DA content--but also to promote it (want to know WTF Fiona was talking about? Read The Calling! Don't know Morrigan's angle? Buy DA:O, cause we ain't gonna explain it here--this isn't no silly stand alone game or something ).

Is kinda cheap, story-telling-wise. Product placement always is, even if it's the franchise's own products.

[Imryll]

Playing a character whose whole clan could easily be killed, I'm finding the game quite "edgy" enough. The whole game is played in the shadow of the conclave and is populated by grieving NPCs. There's quite enough sadness to go around.

[Bethgael]

I remember DA:O having a big sacrifice at the ending...Something to do with the Archdemon

 

In DA II Hawke's sibling can die at the Deep Roads.

 

But I'm not saying DA:I didn't have it's tragic moment. If I had to choose between Alistair and Hawke, I would probably stare at that conversation wheel for 30 minutes.

 

I did.

Re: companion kills. For people saying that DA:O and 2 didn't do that either.

Erhm.

 

okay. Off the top of my head:

DA:O:

 

If you go to Kinloch Hold and agree with Cullen to kill the mages, Wynne attacks you. Wynne dead.

If you leave Sten behind in the cage at Lothering. Sten dead.

You can kill Zevran  couple of times: 1. When he tries to assassinate you, 2. If he turns on you when Taliesin attacks. In the second instance, that can happen really easily, you just have to forget to speak to him. As a side note, you can kill him again in DA2.

Alistair can die in at least 2 ways: Anora can try to execute him, and if you don't have a high persuade/don't ask for a boon, Alistair dead. Or, he can sacrifice himself.

Loghain, likewise, can sacrifice himself.

Leliana can die if you poison the Ashes and she attacks you for it. I never had Wynne in that instance, so I'm not sure if that's death possibility # 2 for her.

A non human noble can kill Dog.

Awakening: you can kill Nathaniel right off the bat. Velanna, too, iirc. Turn Anders over to the Templars in 2 different ways (before DA2, the presumption is that he dies). Endgame choices: if you don't properly upgrade your Keep, and then choose to save Amaranthine, whoever you leave behind? Dies. (Again, ignoring the Anders DA2 retcon).

DA2:

Aside from the sibling death in the DRs possibility:

Depending on your choices, at endgame the following companions can die, at Hawke's hand:

Anders (kill him off the bat), Fenris (if you don't have a high enough rivalry/friendship and side with mages--even romanced) and Merrill (same but side with Templars--even romanced).

Sebastian doesn't die, but he turns on you if you spare Anders. Isabela can be handed to the Arishok.

That's on top of all of the companions, bar one, in DA:O having a "break point" where they can leave or you sending them off or not taking them on (the only one who absolutely refuses to leave, no matter what, pre-Landsmeet, is Alistair).

DA:I nothing like these. They can be sent off, but no impactful choices.

ETA: I am not necessarily a fan of "dark side" and companion death. No thanks, usually. But I am a fan of the choices we make actually having an effect. As all the leadup to the game promised we would.

[dragondreamer]

My Hawke died, and my Lavellan's boyfriend ran out on her.  Let's just say I don't agree with the thread in a big way.

[Nightdragon8]

Hawke's remaining sibling was in very real danger of dying. The game does kind of drop a big hint with Leandra's interruption of the expedition briefing, though.

Here is my story about that... First time though I took her, and its also forshadowed by Varic as well before you in the mission. I got done with the section and she died... and honestly I was battling myself to not just reload and picking a different choice.

 

I have to say tho, by act 3, what reason did Hawke really have to be there? I mean about the only thing going for him was, free food and people calling him "The champion" I don't know about you, but after losing my sister (Because of my own arogance) And then losing your mother to a crazy blood mage that was piecing together there dead wife... Just really what was left there for Hawke to do... At that point, I would more than likly have sold or do some sort of a lease arangment with the Uncle (who I hated) and sailed on with Isabela right on the spot, I would be like, "Yea lets go, let me stop by my house and grab some stuff and lets get out of here."

 

Sadly the tragedy didn't sink in after Haven after you hear that X person or Y person died... because at the time I didn't know there where other people TO save other than the guy in the burring building and quartermaster.  but my second playthough I ended up saving them, (yes though save scumming) and while I saved them, now tey just hang out in Skyhold still replaced by the other people... Its like umm... ok..

 

And my first playthough I honestly thought, Cory was going to attack again... never happened... not even small fights... he completely leaves you alone... so Cory is a big ****** for allowing that to happen.

[jellobell]

My Hawke died, and my Lavellan's boyfriend ran out on her.  Let's just say I don't agree with the thread in a big way.

Yep.

 

I think there are certain choices you can make if you want a more bittersweet ending. the HLtA choice is one of them. And if you play a female elf and romance Solas that ending is a real punch to the gut, lemme tell you. Not just because he leaves. If you're care for him, then his obvious grief at the destruction of the orb makes you feel a real sense of loss. And then there's the post-credits scene. Even if you don't romance him, and just care for him as a friend, that scene is pretty heartbreaking.

 

I guess what I'm saying is that for me the real emotional core of the ending wasn't Cory, but Solas. Though I agree that the ending felt unsatisfying, if only because it just doesn't feel like it's over yet.