15 réponses à ce sujet

[ElofValant]

I am wondering what graphics options / settings in DAI  use mainly CPU power rather than GPU power.

 

I'm not sure if this should be posted in "Technical Support" or not. Please feel free to move if incorrectly posted.

 

I'm asking because I'm finding DAI is heating my CPU up a lot more than other games I play (games such as Alien Isolation, WoW, GW2, Skyrim (with texture mods), STO, etc) - and this is a concern for me, as I live in a hot climate and have to rely on fan/air cooling rather than water cooling. Air cooling in an hot environment doesn't work that great (blowing hot air onto hot metal ... lol)), but it works decently enough for most of my other games since they seem to push the gpu more - ie the gpu gets hot, but the cpu doesn't.

 

I have a Phenom IIx4 965 running at default speed (3.4) and in most games the highest it goes is 55-56^c, which is fine. However playing DAI it goes up to 61^c on all 4 cores... which means I have to stop playing as the cpu's tolerance max is 61^c...so DAI is threatening to burn-out my CPU, unlike other games I play. And the thing is, my GPU in the same stretch is only getting to 68-69^C...while in other games it's going as high as ~85^ (so is obviously being worked more).

 

So this has lead me to wonder what graphical settings/effects/stuff are being pushed onto the CPU rather than GPU...so I can set them down/lower/off and keep playing the game - else I'm going to have to wait till winter to actually be able to play the game. And yes, I have cleaned the fans & cpu cooler of dust and made sure there's good air-flow.

 

 

[ElofValant]

Sorry for the bump, but wondering if anyone has any thoughts on this?

 

- Should I post this on technical support?

 

- I have tried lowering settings for Tessellation, water, vegetation, effects & post-processing AA... but none of these seem to have any effect on CPU cores/usage/heat.

 

- I am using Mantle rather than DirectX, as I have a AMD R9 270x

- I am using the latest beta drivers (14.11.2)

 

Is it possible that none of the 'graphics' settings will affect the CPU usage, and it's just because the game is hard-coded to use the CPU more than the GPU?

[DemGeth]

Games got some cp heavy use yeah. I know my fans run and that's in a cool room.

My feeling is while recent past has put most the burden on the gpu the trend now is for cpu-gpu sharing the burden.

I'm sure there's people here more experienced with mantle that can answer your question in more detail.

[ElofValant]

I managed to get in an hour of gameplay today and kept an eye on cpu usage - it was constantly sitting on 90+% total usage, with each core close to max usage. It seems this game is extremely heavy on cpu usage.

 

I think what I'm going to test next is lower all settings and see if that changes anything. If it doesn't... then I'm going to be sad as it'll mean I'm going to have to wait ~6 months to be able to play this game - as I do not want to play when my cpu is sitting constantly on 61^C (it's max threshhold) and threatening to burn out.... when this is the only game that does so. And the only time I can afford to do anything that push's my cpu is in winter, when the ambient max temperature is ~8-12^C cooler and thus cpu doesn't heat up nearly as much.

 

Edit - well, looks like I'm waiting 6 months to be able to play the game due to it's crazy cpu intensiveness.

 

- I set all graphic options to the lowest they could go (off, very low or low respectively)

- I tried both DirectX 11 and Mantle

 

With everything set as low as possible I was still getting 90-95+% cpu usage and sitting on 60-61^C CPU core temp's. Which means the graphic settings do nothing regarding cpu usage, this game is just hardcoded to focus on cpu usage rather than gpu.

 

Edit #2 - Well, I'd post in Tech support in a pre-existing thread... but I am unable to actually log on and do so. It logs me on... but still act's and shows as if not logged on (ie sign in link/button, sign's me in if I click reply, etc). So can't even post in Tech support that I'm having same issue as other's... pfft! I've tried FireFox, Opera and IE... can't post there on all 3 browser's.

 

http://answers.ea.co...g/td-p/4040109/

 

And pfft @ last post's saying "If you have an over-heating issue it's your fault". Bloody whiteknights. It's not our fault if the game is coded poorly and isn't optimized properly (ie push's graphic's stuff on the cpu instead of the gpu, which is what seems to be happening).

[Eldial3los]

Not sure you can do anything that will result in drastic temp drop. Just like Battlefield 4, Dragon Age Inquisition uses the Frostbite Engine which is heavily multi threated which means it will max out or use all CPU cores versus other engines (ex: StarCraft 2, source engine, Call of duty )

 

Bf 4 on my i7 3770k @ 4.7 GHz uses like 80% of the CPU, this game is like the same. If I recall right, frostbite does the sound processing on one core alone, physic calculation on another 2 other and the rest on the left over cores.

 

This is the reason why temp will be hotter  using the Frostbite engine because it taxes your CPU a lot. Lowering the setting means that the workload will be off loaded to the CPU more as it becomes the most demanding part, increasing the setting will off load some of the work to the GPU and generally lower the CPU work load. (at the cost of FPs if you do not have a powerful card)

 

Get a heatsink with a 120mmm fan on it.

[ElofValant]

Not sure you can do anything that will result in drastic temp drop. Just like Battlefield 4, Dragon Age Inquisition uses the Frostbite Engine which is heavily multi threated which means it will max out or use all CPU cores versus other engines (ex: StarCraft 2, source engine, Call of duty )

 

Bf 4 on my i7 3770k @ 4.7 GHz uses like 80% of the CPU, this game is like the same. If I recall right, frostbite does the sound processing on one core alone, physic calculation on another 2 other and the rest on the left over cores.

 

This is the reason why temp will be hotter  using the Frostbite engine because it taxes your CPU a lot. Lowering the setting means that the workload will be off loaded to the CPU more as it becomes the most demanding part, increasing the setting will off load some of the work to the GPU and generally lower the CPU work load. (at the cost of FPs if you do not have a powerful card)

 

Get a heatsink with a 120mmm fan on it.

 

I'm not using stock cooling. Already upgraded to a good heatsink with 120mm fan on it, in a decent enough case. As I said - my issue is high ambient temperatures (my summer day's are 32-35^C) that I can't do anything about.... due to no airconditioning. I could only improve my cpu cooling by going water-cooling and/or air-conditioning... neither of which is affordable and/or practical for me right now.

 

This game is the ONLY game I run where my cpu core temp's go over 57^c, and most games the highest I ever see is 56^C ( and even then it's exceptional to see 57^). So this game is exceptional in regards to what it does to my CPU - and I play other games like SC2, GW2, STO, Skyrim, etc with settings maxxed and no over-heating issue's.

 

Fact is, game is just badly optimized. Either that or it's just that Frostbite 3 is terrible for PC's. I say this as I checked gpu usage - and when my CPU is sitting on 95% usage, with cpu cores burning away at 61^C, my GPU usage is sitting at a lazy 55%... and this is with my settings back on mostly high/ultra again. So the game is way over-utilizing the CPU for graphics over the GPU...if it was better optimized it should be sitting on 90+% GPU usage instead of the 55% it does.

 

I know with my older cpu I do expect it to bottleneck modern games, but I still wouldn't expect it to max usage on my cpu and hardly touch the gpu. *shrugs* Guess my fears of bad port are actually correct - dodgy tactical camera (that's obviously designed for controllers.. ie consoles), dodgy PC controls... and now obvious bad optimization (ie optimization is to try and get graphical stuff to use the gpu rather than cpu, which would be shown by high gpu usage. bad optimization is generally shown by low gpu usage but high cpu usage).

[DemGeth]

Sorry white knight?

Lol

Hey was just trying to help. The trend in high performance games is to push towards using more cpu. We got spoiled by the market being dominated by older dual cores and that's starting to change. Youre going to have issues with the witcher 3 also by the looks of things from their dev blogs.

Good luck though.

[NRieh]

Why is 61C under stress load even a problem? Throttling issues usually start at 85-90C, and even those temperatures are not lethal per se.

[ElofValant]

Yes white knight - basically someone who defends a company/thing to death irrespective of whether the company/thing is at fault or not. In this case saying things like "Any issue's must be the person's PC and is not the game" = white knighting IMO.

 

The trend towards more cpu usage is because of consolization - as consoles cpu's actually have less to do than PC's, and in respects are more powerful than the gpu's, thus more graphically intense things can be pushed on the cpu rather than the gpu. Whereas it's the other way around with PC's - gaming PC's generally will tend to have more powerful gpu's than cpu's (at least for use in gaming), thus it's better to push graphical stuff on the gpu rather than the cpu.

 

Games that are badly/poorly/lazily ported to PC tend to have the problem of bad optimization for PC - in that they still push things to the cpu instead of the gpu, which causes bottlenecks and performance issue's. These games tend to have high cpu usage & low-to-mid cpu usage (along with various other issue's.. such as terrible KB&m controls, etc). This appears to be DAI problem - it's not really well optimized for PC and is still pushing graphics to the cpu rather than the gpu, which is a sign it's just yet another lazy pc port with the console as the main focus (which is evident in virtually everything else).

 

And I'm sad to hear that Witcher 3 is going the same path, as those dev's were one of the few/last remaining companies which were still putting high priority on PC development. Seems they are following the money trail and abandoning PC in favor of consolization and console gaming 1st with PC players given the scraps (ie bad/poor/lazy ports with bad controls, controller focused gameplay, bad pc optimization, etc).

 

Edit to add:

 

Why is 61C under stress load even a problem? Throttling issues usually start at 85-90C, and even those temperatures are not lethal per se.

 

Because AMD's chips have a lower max temp than Intel's - at least older chips like mine anyways. AMD Phenom IIx4's have a max temp of 62^C, not 85-90+^C. They also have a hard shutdown temp of 70^C. Having the temp constantly over 62^C will damage it and reduce it's lifetime... and I'm not in a position to replace it if it dies due to over-heating.

[DemGeth]

No cdpr has always used the cpu a fair amount....Source engine uses mainly cpu. Total war engine is a cpu hog. Company of heroes engine. Etc Etc.

[Zippy72]

Do you have any control over your cpu fan speed? Is the fan running 100% under 90% CPU load? You could try a higher fan speed or you could try a new fan with higher CFM and static pressure.

 

You could try reducing your CPU loading through windows power settings. Under win 7: Go to control panel / power options / <your power plan> / change advanced power settings / processor power management / maximum processor state - then reduce the state setting down from 100% to 90% (or lower) and see if that effects the temps.

 

You could try underclocking the processor in bios if that's even possible with your processor?

 

As for graphic settings maybe try the highest texture and AA settings. If your GPU becomes the bottleneck it might slow down the entire game including the the demands on the CPU.

 

Failing that open up the side and top panels on your case and remove any dust filters. This will usually give you at least a couple of extra degrees. Maybe you can afford a cheap desk fan to blow air into the open case?

[Deamo]

I am wondering what graphics options / settings in DAI  use mainly CPU power rather than GPU power.

 

I'm not sure if this should be posted in "Technical Support" or not. Please feel free to move if incorrectly posted.

 

I'm asking because I'm finding DAI is heating my CPU up a lot more than other games I play (games such as Alien Isolation, WoW, GW2, Skyrim (with texture mods), STO, etc) - and this is a concern for me, as I live in a hot climate and have to rely on fan/air cooling rather than water cooling. Air cooling in an hot environment doesn't work that great (blowing hot air onto hot metal ... lol)), but it works decently enough for most of my other games since they seem to push the gpu more - ie the gpu gets hot, but the cpu doesn't.

 

I have a Phenom IIx4 965 running at default speed (3.4) and in most games the highest it goes is 55-56^c, which is fine. However playing DAI it goes up to 61^c on all 4 cores... which means I have to stop playing as the cpu's tolerance max is 61^c...so DAI is threatening to burn-out my CPU, unlike other games I play. And the thing is, my GPU in the same stretch is only getting to 68-69^C...while in other games it's going as high as ~85^ (so is obviously being worked more).

 

So this has lead me to wonder what graphical settings/effects/stuff are being pushed onto the CPU rather than GPU...so I can set them down/lower/off and keep playing the game - else I'm going to have to wait till winter to actually be able to play the game. And yes, I have cleaned the fans & cpu cooler of dust and made sure there's good air-flow.

 

Your CPU is actually rated for max safe temperature of 65 degrees celsius. Keep in mind, that's SAFE temperature. Running at that temperature WILL NOT burn out or shorten your CPU's life span. Exceeding it by even a few degrees wont damage it either (it will however shorten it's total lifespan if it sustains that temperature for lengthy, regular periods).

 

I had an old quad core 6700 that ran at 76 degrees for years under heavy load. It was only rated for a safe temperature of 72 degrees. CPU still lasted 4.5 years before it started to show signs of problems (occasional blue screens of death / crashes etc).

 

Alternatively invest in high quality thermal compound and a quality heat sink / fan. I know you live in a hot climate, but even there you don't need water cooling systems if you use good thermal compound and a quality heat sink & cpu fan. Arctic Cooling MX-4 thermal compound has proven excellent for me, I also bought one of their heatsink&fans and my PC runs almost 21 degrees cooler than it did with the Intel stock fan & heatsink (plus the crap thermal compound they apply to it).

 

If you're running stock fan & heatsink, replace it immediately with a quality one, it makes a world of difference.

 

Don't feel intimidated with installing it either, 5-10 minutes of youtube videos on how to install heatsinks and apply thermal compound properly is all it takes. Very simple stuff to do (I learned from a youtube video, had no prior experience. Spent 15 mins watching videos on how to do it. I'm at best a person with average intelligence, so if I can do it, I'm sure just about anyone can).

[Deamo]

I'm not using stock cooling. Already upgraded to a good heatsink with 120mm fan on it, in a decent enough case. As I said - my issue is high ambient temperatures (my summer day's are 32-35^C) that I can't do anything about.... due to no airconditioning. I could only improve my cpu cooling by going water-cooling and/or air-conditioning... neither of which is affordable and/or practical for me right now.

 

 

As I mentioned before, if you're only reaching the max safe temperature for your CPU, it's not in danger, even for prolonged periods. Exceeding it by 10 degrees even will only very maginally shorten the lifespan on it, but not damage it.

 

Damage starts to incur for most modern CPUs when they exceed 90 degrees. You're nowhere close to that, so you shouldn't be concerned unless you're intending to use that CPU for the next 7-8 years. If you think you can afford to replace it in 4-5 years, then by all means let it run a bit hot.

 

Also, I'm convinced you can get that temperature down a fair bit. Your CPU fan may be large but that doesn't necessarily mean good. Ensure you invest in quality thermal compound (this is severely overlooked by many pc owners, it's just as important as your heatsink/fan) and that the heatsink/fan you are currently using is in fact a good one. If it has a low RPM, it's not doing you much good. Go for a good, high speed fan. May be noisier, but at least it will ease your mind about the heating situation.

 

And again, for god's sake, make sure there's good thermal compound on that CPU and that it was put on properly (youtube it if you don't know how to properly apply. Long story short, the best way is the easiest way - a single pea-sized drop in the center. Don't do that fancy pattern application crap some people suggest, it just globs once you put the heat sink on it and makes air bubbles that prevent proper contact. The pea drop in the middle technique is reliable, it will spread out on its own once the heat sink is fixed on it and it will also spread as the cpu warms up to cover the rest of the cpu)

[ManleySteele]

All these games are Near Real Time Transaction Processing systems. As the database of game states being managed grows, so does the CPU load.  These games verge on trying to run "big data" on a desktop.  Databases have always been the compute hogs of any information system.  This may come as a surprise to many users, but almost every ap on your computer is, at its heart, a database. Word processors are specialized databases. Spreadsheets don't even pretend to be anything else.  Unfortunately, any modern game engine is going to stress older tech, because it is a programmers nature to try to use every fiber of compute, memory, communications, etc.  Programmers don't care if your hardware is old in computer (dog) years. They never quit pushing the edge of power.

 

I know this doesn't help your situation and I'm sorry I don't have an answer for you. You've already said you can't throw money at the problem so I hope someone else can help you.

[ElofValant]

Zippy72 - No control that I am aware of over the cpu fan, as far as I'm aware it runs at high/max speed constantly. I would need to check on this however.

Deamo - where did you get the information about 65^C?

I ask because ALL the information I've ever read, both from official AMD tech doc's and elsewhere, state that the max temp is 62^C and to never run the CPU over this. So I'm wondering just where you got the info that the safe temp is 65^C.

I already have what is considered a goog/high quality air cooler, used Artic Cooling thermal paste, and did the paste correctly. As I said - I play other games and see 56^C max temp's... this is the only game that push's my CPU up to what AMD says is the max/danger point.

Although the point about core usage is correct - this is also the only game which max's out all 4 cores. The others only max out 1-2 cores, or get spread over all but not maxing out. It's an issue with this game and/or engine.

[ElofValant]

Sorry for the bump, but thought I'd update with something I've found. This is prior to the Dec 9th patch hitting.

 

What I have found out, and not sure if this is due to the game or AMD driver's... but a part of my issue seems to be Mantle. I recently decided to switch from Mantle to DX11 and was really surprised by the end-results. What I found after switching to stock-standard DX11 my GPU usage went from 55-60% all the way up to 80-95%, and cpu usage dropped from ~95% to 80-90%.

 

So it seems that Mantle itself is responsible for the fact my GPU was not being used as much as it could, and was responsible for pushing my cpu to the max. Yes while DX11 is still pushing my cpu to near max, it's not as bad as when I was using Mantle - and cpu core temp's are maxing out at 58-59^C now, rather than 61-62^C... and I am comfy with 58-59^C.

 

I can't speak for fps performance difference, if any, between DX11 and Mantle as I was not monitoring that at all. I did notice some minor shadow & environment flickering on DX11 that wasn't there with Mantle, but it wasn't anything seriously bothersome (I only noticed as I was looking for issue's / problems).

 

Not sure if this is a core problem with Mantle itself, with the way the game coding handles Mantle or the Mantle driver's from AMD that are part of my video driver's.