220 réponses à ce sujet

[HelterSkelter89]

the only way i can see anyone defending this new craptastic system of ammo and reloads is if they never played the first one and experienced the genius that was ammo system and its explanation in the first game. seriously, why on earth did they take something as awesome an screw it up? i have ammo in my gun but i can't fire it? why not still have a cooldown timer but have the heatsink as a quick fix?

[McBinary]

Not to complain, but it is absolutely a step backwards in technology.

The reason for the unlimited ammo was because of very large solid metals being made tiny by mass effect and placed inside the weapon. When the weapon was fired pieces were sheared off of that object and projected through another mass effect that sized the piece back to normal as it fired from the barrel.

Now that being said, the instant loss of heat is nice, however not being able to fire the weapon AT ALL without the heat sink is dumb. It makes no sense what-so-ever.

Modifié par McBinary, 26 janvier 2010 - 09:41 .

[Ezohiguma]

Detsu wrote...

It makes sense and the only complaint anyone could make is "I want my unlimited ammo!" which is a complaint that only CASUALS make.

Deal with it.

I'm a casual and I find that comment very offensive. And only elitist jerks think that being "hardcore" in a COMPUTER GAME counts for anything.

I don't mind the limited ammo. Anyone who ever played FPS knows how to get around it. Simple, really. Use a different weapon. Use your abilities. Use everything you have at your disposal. So you run out of ammo on one weapon?

BIG DEAL!

Your arsenal consist of more than one gun. Use it.

Plus, we finally get hit zones! You don't have to spray a geth's whole body to get it down. You can friggin' headshot them and conserve ammo.

Modifié par Ezohiguma, 26 janvier 2010 - 09:35 .

[Vanth]

I agree with the OP. It is pretty stupid. But I think stupid is par for the course on games like this. After all, is the Alliance military really so crappy that they give their elite soldiers weapons that are substantially worse than those you can buy off the shelf from a high-street arms dealer? They can build a ship like the Normandy, but they can't add modifications to my weapons and armour?

[Veen130]

Adding heatsinks isn't for the sake of the ME universe, its for the sake of gameplay. Heatsinks adds more to the game, making combat more involved, tense and tatical. Bioware just made a codex entry to explain why they use heatsinks in the ME universe.

[Raltar]

Massadonious wrote...

Being able to never overheat was the problem. Why even have the overheat system in the first place?

A penalty is not a penalty when you can trivialize it.

I totally understand from a gameplay standpoint and I honestly don't mind the change(especially since I haven't actually played yet, but I've played games that have limited ammo systems and it has never been a problem).  I'm saying from a purely in game point of view, as if we were all living in the Mass Effect universe, it makes no sense that guns could be upgraded to never overheat, but all of the sudden they change the technology that makes a heat sink worthless once it overheats.  The explination given does not make a bit of sense considering what you could do in the original.  With the explination given, it would have been better to just never mention it at all because the in game explination is crap.

[Malana74]

[quoteEzohiguma wrote...

I'm a casual and I find that comment very offensive. And only elitist jerks think that being "hardcore" in a COMPUTER GAME counts for anything.

I don't mind the limited ammo. Anyone who ever played FPS knows how to get around it. Simple, really. Use a different weapon. Use your abilities. Use everything you have at your disposal. So you run out of ammo on one weapon?

BIG DEAL!

Your arsenal consist of more than one gun. Use it.

Plus, we finally get hit zones! You don't have to spray a geth's whole body to get it down. You can friggin' headshot them and conserve ammo.[/quote]
*****************************************************************

And when THOSE guns run out of ammo?  Ignoring the fact that some of us don't play soldiers who can use every weapon with impunity.  My problem is that the in-game explanation just makes no freaking sense. Great, so the geth invented modular heat sinks.  Whoop-de-do.  that's like saying we should stop driving cars becaue somebody designed a neat bicycle. (leave the eco-friendly commetns at the door, please)  And yes, I love that it's now possible to call your shots. doens't mean we should chuck EVERYTHING about pre-established weapons systems out the window.

it SHOULD have been modular clips and THEN the cooldown. or if someone slaps you with sabotage, THEN you swap to a backup clip without having to change weapons.  THAT would have been a technological improvement.

And saying it's not limited ammo becasue they called it "expendible heat sinks" instead of ammunition is moronic.  It's the same thing!

Modifié par Malana74, 26 janvier 2010 - 09:48 .

[DeathNSmalDoses]

The spectre pistol in ME1 once configured never ever ever ever ever overheated and combine it with the soldiers weapon boost skill (forgotten the name what the hell was it) it was the most OP weapon in the game, i think someone did some reaserch on the pc version and work out the pistol did the highest in the game.

So the changes i welcome, but atleast make the weapons once out of coolent cool of slowly so we atleast got a backup!

Modifié par DeathNSmalDoses, 26 janvier 2010 - 09:46 .

[brgillespie]

AMMUNITION IS STILL UNLIMITED. You're not running out of "ammo", folks. Ammo still runs off the virtually-limitless blocks of metal.



What you're "reloading" is your weapon's heatsinks. When you've maxed the heat bar you've essentially burnt up your heatsinks. Your heatsinks work fine so long as you don't redline the system. If you do, then you fry the heatsinks and your weapon can't dissipate the heat. Its sort of like what happens when you overclock your computer's videocard or CPU way too high and burn the electronics out. Except in ME2, you swap in a new heatsink and voila! You're good to go again.

[Captain Jazz]

When you can upgrade your weapons to such a point that you can hold the trigger down indefinitely and mow down enemies in moments without trying... why even bother having weapons? Why not simply point at them and make them spontaneously combust with the power of your mind?

I think this is a good move - no more can your crackshot marine spray bullets across the field of battle in the hopes of felling hordes of enemies with unguided fire without thought... it may be a step backward, but it makes sense to make you learn to consider your shots.

[Kaylis DX]

brgillespie wrote...

AMMUNITION IS STILL UNLIMITED. You're not running out of "ammo", folks. Ammo still runs off the virtually-limitless blocks of metal.

What you're "reloading" is your weapon's heatsinks. When you've maxed the heat bar you've essentially burnt up your heatsinks. Your heatsinks work fine so long as you don't redline the system. If you do, then you fry the heatsinks and your weapon can't dissipate the heat. Its sort of like what happens when you overclock your computer's videocard or CPU way too high and burn the electronics out. Except in ME2, you swap in a new heatsink and voila! You're good to go again.

It seems to me that you're implying that as long as you don't overheat your guns, you won't have to swap heat sinks. Is that true?

[Malana74]

brgillespie wrote...

AMMUNITION IS STILL UNLIMITED. You're not running out of "ammo", folks. Ammo still runs off the virtually-limitless blocks of metal.

What you're "reloading" is your weapon's heatsinks. When you've maxed the heat bar you've essentially burnt up your heatsinks. Your heatsinks work fine so long as you don't redline the system. If you do, then you fry the heatsinks and your weapon can't dissipate the heat. Its sort of like what happens when you overclock your computer's videocard or CPU way too high and burn the electronics out. Except in ME2, you swap in a new heatsink and voila! You're good to go again.

did you even pay attention to the original post?  if you run out of "heat sink clips" your gun doens't work. period. no shoot-shoot, no bang-bang, no matter HOW long you wait. you have to find another clip.   which for all intents and purposes is the same thing as running out of ammo.

[Malana74]

Kaylis DX wrote...

brgillespie wrote...

AMMUNITION IS STILL UNLIMITED. You're not running out of "ammo", folks. Ammo still runs off the virtually-limitless blocks of metal.

What you're "reloading" is your weapon's heatsinks. When you've maxed the heat bar you've essentially burnt up your heatsinks. Your heatsinks work fine so long as you don't redline the system. If you do, then you fry the heatsinks and your weapon can't dissipate the heat. Its sort of like what happens when you overclock your computer's videocard or CPU way too high and burn the electronics out. Except in ME2, you swap in a new heatsink and voila! You're good to go again.

It seems to me that you're implying that as long as you don't overheat your guns, you won't have to swap heat sinks. Is that true?

no.

[Kaylis DX]

Malana74 wrote...

Kaylis DX wrote...

brgillespie wrote...

AMMUNITION IS STILL UNLIMITED. You're not running out of "ammo", folks. Ammo still runs off the virtually-limitless blocks of metal.

What you're "reloading" is your weapon's heatsinks. When you've maxed the heat bar you've essentially burnt up your heatsinks. Your heatsinks work fine so long as you don't redline the system. If you do, then you fry the heatsinks and your weapon can't dissipate the heat. Its sort of like what happens when you overclock your computer's videocard or CPU way too high and burn the electronics out. Except in ME2, you swap in a new heatsink and voila! You're good to go again.

It seems to me that you're implying that as long as you don't overheat your guns, you won't have to swap heat sinks. Is that true?

no.

Well crap.

[Raltar]

Again, I don't have a problem with the change. I have a problem with the explanation as to why it was changed in game. They could have said, "There was a breakthrough in armor and shield technology and to keep up, they needed to invent new more powerful guns. The new technology is so powerful that the heat the guns generate overwhelm the current heatsink technology, so you have to replace the heatsinks now because they become useless after so many shots fired."



Much better than, "I know we had guns that could be fired without any chance of overheating, but use this clearly inferior geth technology instead."

[tonnactus]

Really,the explanation doesnt make sense.Built in frictioness materials would be the way to go, not crappy heatsinks.At least for people like spectres and cerberus operatives.

Modifié par tonnactus, 26 janvier 2010 - 10:00 .

[brgillespie]

No, it's not. You can play through the entire game firing your rifle/pistol/whatever without ever once popping in a new thermal if you pay attention to your weapon's heat level.

Solution to "running out of heat sink clips" is to ease up on the trigger finger.

EDIT: Wait, am I wrong? I thought I had a good understanding of the system. Basically, your "heatsinks" are now finite in use?

Modifié par brgillespie, 26 janvier 2010 - 10:02 .

[adam_grif]

If you're hoping for an official response, you'll be disappointed, because they all go something like this:



*waves hand*



"You don't need to see our justification. These aren't the mechanics you're looking for."

[Malana74]

Captain Jazz wrote...

When you can upgrade your weapons to such a point that you can hold the trigger down indefinitely and mow down enemies in moments without trying... why even bother having weapons? Why not simply point at them and make them spontaneously combust with the power of your mind?
I think this is a good move - no more can your crackshot marine spray bullets across the field of battle in the hopes of felling hordes of enemies with unguided fire without thought... it may be a step backward, but it makes sense to make you learn to consider your shots.

Unless you played the game all the way through, got the uber weapon AND tricked it out, you couldn't do any such thing in the first game either.  The Spectre weapons were a gift for playing through the game....and even then, if you "sprayed bullets across the field of battle" you would still get sniped to death....you STILL had to actually aim, take cover, etc....tricking out your weaponsimply made overheating less of an issue.

[adam_grif]

brgillespie wrote...

No, it's not. You can play through the entire game firing your rifle/pistol/whatever without ever once popping in a new thermal if you pay attention to your weapon's heat level.

Solution to "running out of heat sink clips" is to ease up on the trigger finger.

The guns DO NOT cool down by themselves. You MUST empty heat sinks after every X shots. Try it yourself if you don't believe me. We've had official confirmation on this for months now. It's an ammo system in everything but name.

[brgillespie]

Ahhhh, I see now. Knowledge flows through me.



Oh, well. Game mechanics are the game mechanics. Guess it'll promote more judicial use of my weaponry. Take the good with the bad: at least there's no more Mako driving.

[Wolf_in_the_Meadow]

The in game explanation is a huge pile - who gives up infinate ammo?? Do these people not know about burst firing? And for that matter why is Shepard the only one who knows about frictionless materials?

Salarian: "Those Geth fellows have gone with heatsinks... lets do that!"
Turian: "But... if we use frictionless materials, we'd literally never have to stop firing... thats pure win."
Salarian: "No, no... heatsinks: severley limiting our fire is the future."
Turian: "... Right..."
Krogan: "I'll just stick to unlimited ammo thanks... (so gonna kick your asses in the next revolt...)"

Modifié par Wolf_in_the_Meadow, 26 janvier 2010 - 10:10 .

[adam_grif]

The way Bioware made it sound initially is that it would be some hybrid system, where you could let them cool as normal, but if you needed more rounds NOW you could eject a heat sink for those "Oh crap" moments.



Instead it's just ammo.



Sigh.



I'd like to see how they try to justify the fact that heat apparently never dissipates, when 2 years ago guns would self-cool just fine. Maybe there was like a galaxy-wide factory recall on all weapons or something.

[Solar Sail]

my problem with the game is that weapons evolve with the amour avaliabe or the situation. If this was the case it wouldnt take 20 bullets to kill an enemy.As a example, the long bow was developed to kill the 'modern" day amour which was steal plateing. it wouldnt go through the newest dragon amour though cause it isnt designed for it but it would leave a god damn big bruise. So what im trying to say is that i dont get were these guns are gettting this unlimited ammo as you have to fire something but with the new system its a bit faultly cause \\carrying a good amount of ammo for these missions considering the strength of a unit is impossible unless the bullets did more damage. All in all both system i dont think are very well thought over if they are trying to imitate the real life of the future