151 réponses à ce sujet

[Bladenite1481]

How was basically having 0% chance to die and healing every fight "fun"? To me, it's much more fun to know you have a limit and to have to manage your party and tactics around it, instead of knowing regardless of what happens you can heal to full health after. I think you should realize this is purely your opinion, and many people don't like healing, as it is a pretty fucken cheap mechanic, at least how it was implemented in past DA games.

 

It requires a different playstyle, but could all of you professional game critics please STFU with this "bad design" like you have any fucken idea what a good design is other than what you enjoy. There's some perverted desire on this forum to turn every opinion into a fact....because having an opinion on something isn't good enough...it must also objectively su

I like healing. Most of the players who are against healing are gamers who have had experience and liked games without it, most notably and recently the Dark Souls series. In truth, I don't see that healing is any more or less exploitable than any other mechanic of damage mitigation. Without it, everyone has basically gone two ways..heavy barrier or heavy guard generation, then you add the masterwork craft that adds guard on hit per strike or ridiculosuly high DPS builds. I haven't seen a full group built yet that doesn't rely on one of those mechanics just as heavily as the former games did healing.  The sum product is not much was really changed. People that liked healing went KE and not only does KE auto regen barrier but they have a heal as well. 

 

I liked setting up my characters to support my main attackers, removing healing entirely is just another way the game has limited choice. Now you can say whatever you want about healing itself, but removing options is limiting choice, There is no addition by subtraction when it comes to this particular topic. 

 

That being said, I think the healing if implemented should be weaker. Either a cast time or a decent cooldown, I also think potions should be more HoT variety, as is they are very strong. I went NM w/FF and never went below 6/12. 

[Elhanan]

I am OK with the new system, but it also has its downside: harvesting components. This is something I wish could be assigned to others well beyond the meager offerings brought in from the War Table. The silver lining is that the dialogue and banter of the party makes the process less annoying; sore fingers and all.

Add a system for Companions to harvest assigned components in the Search area, or make an Auto-harvest feature, and I am good with that. But when my ex-Carta Dwarf goes to the garden to pick some Elfroot, there is something amiss in the lands of Thedas....

As for staying healed, I am doing pretty well on Nightmare; no FF. Things would be better if the Mages that have Barrier would cast it in a more timely and effective fashion.

[Morroian]

I enjoyed it, thank god Bioware took this step, hopefully this mechanic stays and is just improved but Bioware bows to the whims of the whiners so we'll probably go back to health regen and thus mob fights will just becomes a joke again with no thinking needed.

 

When you can refresh potions at camp, when the major fights have supply caches, when you have a plethora of healing grenades and potions I'm not really seeing much of a distinction.

[AgenTBC]

Come on guys, the game is really really easy even on Nightmare.  If there was healing you could play with your eyes closed.

[StrangeStrategy]

Learn to properly use Guard, Stealth, and Barrier.

[Bladenite1481]

Come on guys, the game is really really easy even on Nightmare.  If there was healing you could play with your eyes closed.

So why not make the game harder instead of removing mechanics? Improve enemy AI, give them more move sets, more CC and in the process give me tactics back. 

[Mr.House]

So why not make the game harder instead of removing mechanics? Improve enemy AI, give them more move sets, more CC and in the process give me tactics back. 

Because a default regen health is a stupid mechanic that deserved to be removed. You want your health regen, put that ability on your arnor or learn to use barrier and guard.

[rashie]

So why not make the game harder instead of removing mechanics? Improve enemy AI, give them more move sets, more CC and in the process give me tactics back. 

http://forum.bioware...2#entry17416109

 

You can find their reasoning for why they did what they did here, its fairly reasonable at face value but yes the game could have been harder, especially late game.

[Mr.House]

http://forum.bioware...2#entry17416109

 

You can find their reasoning for why they did what they did here, its fairly reasonable at face value but yes the game could have been harder, especially late game.

It's harder then DAO/DA2 at least so they did fulfill their goal in that regard.

[TheJiveDJ]

Its called multi player balancing and low-cost padding...unfortunate, but that is the sad reality.

[Mr.House]

Its called multi player balancing and low-cost padding...unfortunate, but that is the sad reality.

Uh huh. That's because MP games NEVER have health regen in it right?

[Bladenite1481]

Because a default regen health is a stupid mechanic that deserved to be removed. You want your health regen, put that ability on your arnor or learn to use barrier and guard.

Maybe learn to read?  

 

"That being said, I think the healing if implemented should be weaker. Either a cast time or a decent cooldown, I also think potions should be more HoT variety, as is they are very strong. I went NM w/FF and never went below 6/12. "

 

Does it seem like I have issues with the difficulty of the game? I could care less if out of combat regeneration was kept the way it is. We are talking about healing magic. 

[Adynata]

You can essentially have two stacks of regen potions on every character so it's really hard to run out of healing pots.

[Adanu]

Because a default regen health is a stupid mechanic that deserved to be removed. You want your health regen, put that ability on your arnor or learn to use barrier and guard.

Or you could just give us healing and you don't have to spec into healing. That might work instead of telling us what your world view is the only valid one.

[MapleJar]

Why does this thread read like having healing spells back in the game would also mean the return of auto health regeneration post combat? Why would this be the case? I don't understand that. I'm fine with there being no auto health regeneration, having your health not auto regen makes way more sense to me, but my favorite mage type to play is a healer.

I loved the Spirit Healer specialization. I very much miss healing magic in DAI, and indeed believe it's a continuity destroying situation that it is not available in this game. What happened to all the Spirit Healers in Thedas? What happened to the creation tree? Why is there no in game explanation for any of this? Why does the Inquisitor ask the surgeon at Skyhold why she is not leaving the healing "to the mages"? Why didn't the surgeon say, "Because you mages cannot heal anyone anymore - remember?! ******!" This decision to remove healing from the game was not well thought out, at all, and it's a lore destroying situation. Obviously no one told the writers that this was happening as well. I also miss the injuries mechanic of the previous games.

All that being said, for me, combat plays exactly the same, on a fundamental level, for all three DA games. The mechanics of it all are different, of course, but on a fundamental level it's not greatly different at all in my opinion. The mechanics of DAI, however, have made combat for me a lot easier and a lot less involving than the other two games. I play all three games on normal mode, exclusively, and I've died a lot less in DAI than I ever did in the other two DA games. Once you adapt to the way it all works in this game; guard, barrier, stealth, and all the different pots and how you can upgrade them -- it's easy. That being said, I have yet to come across a dungeon, or any other combat situation, that did not allow me to fast travel back to a camp if I wanted to. In fact, if you fast travel and then go back to the combat you had to leave, usually whatever you were fighting has lost all their guard. It can make the fight so much easier than it was. That being said, I try not to fast travel unless it looks like my party might wipe.

I mean, look at the post from Bioware that's linked here in an earlier post - the dev is saying his 7 year old can play without dying. The dev is using that as an example of the success of this mechanic. I think that is indicative of a massive failure of this mechanic. If any 7 year old can successfully navigate a supposedly tactical combat of an RPG, then they are not playing a true tactical RPG in my opinion. I had to be a lot more careful, and plan so much more, with the combat in DAO and DA2. Why does post combat regen affect your planning in combat? That also makes no sense to me at all. You can't go into combat assuming you're going to survive it! So these people saying that combat in this games makes them think more - I don't understand that point of view whatsoever. Like I said, though, I only play on normal mode, so I don't know what combat is like in the higher difficulties.

Combat in DAI is a lot easier to survive in my opinion. I prefer combat from DAO, personally. They should bring healing spells back, and at least continuity will be restored and the world of Thedas will once again make sense. For me, it's not about making combat more or less easy. It's about keeping things consistent between the games. They've established this world that has healing magic. It makes no in-game sense to take it away, with absolutely zero in-game explanation at to why this happened. And, in fact, characters in game seem to still believe that mages can heal. Good job, Bioware!

[Lennard Testarossa]

I find the Barrier+Guard system to be far more appealing than the healing system from Origins. It's a very fun mechanic with way more tactical potential than traditional healing spells. I hope they keep it for their future games.

 

It does need a bit of work, though. Right now the balance betwwen barrier health and regular health is pretty weird.

 

Combat in DAI is a lot easier to survive in my opinion. I prefer combat from DAO, personally. They should bring healing spells back, and at least continuity will be restored and the world of Thedas will once again make sense. For me, it's not about making combat more or less easy. It's about keeping things consistent between the games. They've established this world that has healing magic. It makes no in-game sense to take it away, with absolutely zero in-game explanation at to why this happened. And, in fact, characters in game seem to still believe that mages can heal. Good job, Bioware!

 

This has been discussed before. Instant healing from a distance isn't and never was part of Dragon Age lore. Healing magic is pretty much like magical surgery and takes a lot out of the person doing it. The way it is right now is far more compatible with the lore than it was in Origins. (Though the potions clearly still break the lore.)

[Wintermist]

I really miss healing. In Origins my mages had constantly to decide whether to use their time/mana for crowd control, damage, or a heal. In DAI barrier use is much spammier than healing ever was (in my games)--and to me, much less satisfying. This is partly because I enjoy playing a healer and partly because I prefer higher risk, bigger payoff gameplay, in TES terms always an altmer, never a Breton. Forcing risk avoidance as the basis of combat makes it ... dull.

 

Of course, I may be unique in my attitude towards potions. Using one always feels like failure, and I've had to use maybe 5 in about 20 hours of DAI. For some reason using scarce character resources to cast a heal feels like a choice to me, where gulping a potion feels cheap. Getting to sell off unneeded potions also feels like a nice reward for careful play.

 

Playing on normal the new approach didn't (so far as I got before I abandoned the game possibly to be played post-patch) feel harder or more strategic, just less fun. Sorry the OP ran into a situation more frustrating than any I experienced. As far as I got potions were too easy to come by for running out to feel like a real danger.

 

Pretty much this says all about how I feel too.

[TheWinstitute]

So you're saying a game where a bow rogue can solo the entire game on nightmare difficulty....needs healing?

 

I don't think you really understand class to class damage mitigation yet.

 

Every single class has the ability to mitigate damage in some form or fashion.

 

I can't say I felt I needed a healer at all during my DA:I run. Potions filled in the gaps where things were going south too fast for me to manage via mitigation, but mostly I was more than capable of consistently keeping my party alive in all encounters...I think I only wiped a few times through the entire game and it was just due to super lazy management on my side.

[MapleJar]

This has been discussed before. Instant healing from a distance isn't and never was part of Dragon Age lore. Healing magic is pretty much like magical surgery and takes a lot out of the person doing it. The way it is right now is far more compatible with the lore than it was in Origins. (Though the potions clearly still break the lore.)

 

What? From where are you getting this information? In DAO it costs just 20 mana to cast a healing spell, and it imparts zero extra fatigue. Additionally, since DAO is the first DA game, it established DA lore. So, to me, what you are implying makes no sense lore wise. I don't understand what you're referring to - please elaborate.

[Morroian]

I find the Barrier+Guard system to be far more appealing than the healing system from Origins. It's a very fun mechanic with way more tactical potential than traditional healing spells. I hope they keep it for their future games.

 

 

Except its just as broken as healing was (if not moreso) and requires way more busywork.

 

 

I can't say I felt I needed a healer at all during my DA:I run. Potions filled in the gaps where things were going south too fast for me to manage via mitigation, but mostly I was more than capable of consistently keeping my party alive in all encounters...I think I only wiped a few times through the entire game and it was just due to super lazy management on my side.

 

See that just implies to me that the game is broken just in a different way.

[Tsunami Chef]

Except its just as broken as healing was (if not moreso) and requires way more busywork.

How is it broken...and it's supposed to require busy work. You shouldn't be able to survive fights by doing nothing...you have to do things like position, barrier, and guard...

 

Really, please explain how it is broken, instead of just saying so.

[Morroian]

How is it broken...and it's supposed to require busy work. You shouldn't be able to survive fights by doing nothing...you have to do things like position, barrier, and guard...

 

Really, please explain how it is broken, instead of just saying so.

 

Cause if you spec right you are essentially invulnerable from either  barrier or guard, or even just spam barrier.

[TheWinstitute]

Cause if you spec right you are essentially invulnerable from either  barrier or guard, or even just spam barrier.

 

Not specifically. Knight Enchanter being the exception, I wouldn't call any of the other specialization classes fully invulnerable.

 

Reaver runs a close second to Knight Enchanter as far as survivability goes but has plenty of failure conditions depending on how you manage it. I could potentially solo a high dragon with a Reaver but it would require me to manage every single ability perfectly, keep my guard generation pretty much on cool down, and consistently be able to dragon rage my way through the dragon's guard phase to remove the armor fast enough AND not die from it by getting back kicked into the dirt before I got my ring of pain down and my devour off....but that doesn't mean that Reaver is invulnerable, its a good class with a lot of answers to dealing with combat...but it has plenty of failure conditions if not played right.

 

Simple facts are is understanding a class and playing it right and getting the results of "not dying constantly due to a lack of healers" doesn't inherently mean a class is overpowered...it means its functioning as intended...it means you're doing it right.

[MullyMagic]

It doesn't bother me not having healing spells but having other mages healing in villages and such is weird when your "elite" companions cannot do it.  The back and forth to camps sometimes is a pain so maybe having health regen slowly outside combat would be nice?

[BammBamm]

i really like the lack of healing spells. funny thing is many complain about the lack of tactics, but the cancel of healing spells is one of the biggest advancements tactical wise. healing is no tactical option, its to compensate the abscence of tactic. basically block and barrier have the same effects as healing, you just have to use them predictive instead of reactive. without infinite healing things like damage evading, position and taunt skills are way more important than before. and in the open world you can play still brainless, the only consequence is to port to camps more often, but when you play wisely it is rewarded with more exploring and less camp hopping. but to be honest, dont know about get stuck in story missions, normally your potions should last long enough to the next refill station. before bossfights you can refill your stock and its autosaved, so i cant imagine how to stuck in it.

 

and no i'm not an elitist, but im capable to use my brain and dont make a game responsible for the complete abscence of it