20 réponses à ce sujet

[GhoXen]

I see a lot of people asking about why their tanks melt so quickly etc., so I decided to share my tank's build (Champion), an alternative build if you have Cass as tank (Templar), and a sub-optimal build if you happen to use Iron Bull for tanking. Reaver is just not a useful tree for a tank.

 

Gear priority

 

Defensive Attributes

1. Armor: make sure to keep this up to date, so that enemies hit you for only 1 damage. Once that point is reached, getting  excessive armor is not necessary, unless your tank is expected to stay in To the Death for minutes.
2. Magic Defense: magic will become the only type of damage your tank cannot fully mitigate. As such, magic defense is highly valued. It's also the only defense that suffers no diminishing return.
3. Melee Defense: mainly useful only for excessive To the Death, or melee attacks from the flank.
4. Ranged Defense: ranged attacks will be significantly weaker than melee attacks due to Turn the Bolt, so this stat is only useful for ranged attacks from the flank.

Offensive Attributes

1. Stagger on Hit: if damage is simply not a priority whatsoever, then you should try dump offensive slots on this stat if possible. The stun triggered by this stat does allow cross-class detonations. It also offers a nice bit of control. Beware that most bosses are immune to this.
2. Armor Penetration: one of the only build that benefits more from AP than attack % is a SnS build. Unlike DW rogues, you don't rely on crit hits whatsoever, and unlike bow rogues, you don't use any form of non-physical damage. If damage output is a concern, AP is your best stat.
3. Attack: if AP is not available(cloth slots) get Attack % like everyone else.
4. Crit Chance: normally meaningless. However, if you spec into "Shield Breaker" under 2H tree, you can stack crit chance % over every other offensive stat instead to improve the damage output of the rest of your party. Avoid if you have 2-3 mages, since enemy armor is irrelevant to them.

 

Immortal Champion

 

The optimal tank, as long as you control the tank. It's not nearly as effective or predictable if left to the AI.

Spoiler

Ability Acquisition

1. Shield Wall
2. Payback Strike
3. War Cry
4. Turn the Bolt
5. Bear Mauls the Wolves
6. Shield Bash
7. Turn the Blade
8. Charging Bull
9. Cutting Words
10. Bodyguard
11. Bodyguard upgrade
12. Line in the Sand
13. Bulwark
14. Adamant
15. To the Death

Spend the rest of the points on acquiring passives, such as Deep Reserves, passives for Shield Wall, but avoid Counterstrike, since it's pretty useless for a geared tank compared to Inquisitor's unique focus power. Here's an example:

• Charging Bull upgrade
• Shield Bash upgrade
• Payback Strike upgrade
• Grappling Chain > Hamstring > Deep Reserves
• To the Death upgrade (useless until 2-3 mins of To the Death)

Action Bar

1. Shield Bash
2. Shield Wall
3. War Cry
4. Charging Bull
5. Bodyguard
6. To the Death
7. Mark of the Rift
8. Payback Strike/Line in the Sand/Combat Roll/Walking Fortress

The final slot can be used for Line in the Sand, Payback Strike, but I personally recommend either Combat Roll or Walking Fortress. Combat Roll should be picked if your tank simply doesn't have good magic defense despite trying  everything. Walking Fortress should only be picked if your party has poor damage output, and your tank is expected to keep "To the Death" active for 2-3 mins. If neither apply, I recommend Payback Strike, which offers control all the time, breaks CC, and is generally better than Line in the Sand, which only offers control in certain situations.

 

Playstyle

In general, a fairly easy to play build. Use Shield Bash to destroy enemy guard. Use War Cry for general taunting. Use Charging Bull for gap closing and/or AoE damage. To the Death can be used freely on any high priority target or boss. However, make sure you have your Bodyguard ready when To the Death is on a boss. After a minute or so, the boss will start melting the rest of your party if they get hit.

 

Immortal Seeker

 

First of all, you should only use this build if you want Cass tanking, or if you simply have a paladin fetish or something. For all its benefits, the contribution to the party's overall performance is simply overshadowed by Champion's "To the Death".

Spoiler

Ability Acquisition

1. Shield Wall
2. Payback Strike
3. War Cry
4. Turn the Bolt
5. Bear Mauls the Wolves
6. Shield Bash
7. Turn the Blade
8. Charging Bull
9. Cutting Words
10. Bodyguard
11. Bodyguard upgrade
12. Spell Purge
13. Blessed Blades
14. Maker's Will
15. There is no Darkness

Simiarly, the rest of the points should be spent on passives, or acquiring the active ability for the 8th slot.

 

Action Bar

1. Shield Bash
2. Shield Wall
3. War Cry
4. Charging Bull
5. Bodyguard
6. Spell Purge
7. Mark of the Rift/Rally (Templar's focus ability is actually not useless)
8. Payback Strike/Combat Roll/Wrath of Heaven

Wrath of the Heaven is a good ability for control, but don't expect it to melt demons like it would on a 2H DPS Templar. Blessed Blades is not worthwhile for a tank, since damage bonus for the tank is fairly meaningless, and the rest of your party will only gain the damage bonus if they stand in that tiny circle the ability creates.

 

Playstyle

A very simple-minded playstyle. Use Shield Bash to destroy enemy guard. Use War Cry for general taunting. Use Charging Bull for gap closing and/or AoE damage. Use Spell Purge to destroy enemy barriers. Don't expect to die, but also don't expect to contribute as much, which makes the build perfect for an AI. Make sure to swap Charging Bull with Combat  Roll if you are going to let AI Cass tank with little to no micromanagement.

 

Immortal Bull

 

Even Bull himself will tell you that he's more of an offense focused fighter, why would you do this to him?!

Spoiler

Ability Acquisition

1. Shield Wall
2. Payback Strike
3. War Cry
4. Turn the Bolt
5. Bear Mauls the Wolves
6. Shield Bash
7. Turn the Blade
8. Charging Bull
9. Cutting Words
10. Bodyguard
11. Bodyguard upgrade
12. Grappling Chain
13. Crippling Blows
14. Combat Roll
15. Coup de Grace
16. Horn of Valor
17. Horn of Valor upgrade

Essentially, you should pretend the specialisation tree doesn't exist. Might as well put those horns to some real use and get Horn of Valor or War Horn depending on your party's needs. War Horn should be avoided if you don't micro-manage, as AI is silly and will automatically cease attacking panicked enemies.

 

Action Bar

1. Shield Bash
2. Shield Wall
3. War Cry
4. Charging Bull
5. Bodyguard
6. Horn of Valor
7. Mark of the Rift
8. Payback Strike/Combat Roll

Playstyle

A fairly boring playstyle. All you have effectively achieved is an immortal Iron Bull. Maybe that's enough for some, but any contribution beyond simply taunting and being immortal is very limited. Again, pretty decent choice for pure AI.

[brazen_nl]

Nice builds.

[Rynas]

Nice, thanks, will have to try this out on Cass.  Any particular abilities you set to Preferred?

 

And why no Challenge?  It's one of the most convenient tanking abilities available, imo - instant ranged peel, with guard + stamina generation.

[GhoXen]

Nice, thanks, will have to try this out on Cass.  Any particular abilities you set to Preferred?

 

And why no Challenge?  It's one of the most convenient tanking abilities available, imo - instant ranged peel, with guard + stamina generation.

 

Lack of slots, primarily. On Champion build, To the Death effectively replaces Challenge.

[E.T.I.]

I don't get it really.

 

The main confusion is that you skip HoV(Horn of Valor) on your Champion. It's 50% damage for the whole team despite of range.

 

Really it's godlike tier ability and best damage contribution that tank could bring to the table. OFC I'm talking about time where tank is already taking 1 DMG. Before that - def abbilities and passives are top notch.

[Maverick827]

I belive Horn of Valor is increased to 35% from 15%, not added to the 15%.

The problem with Horn I that you have to spend 6 points to get it, and what you're spending them on are very bad.

I also question Bodyguard in the OP's Champion build. I just don't see it. With or without To the Death, a boss is going to kill your party should something go awry.

[GhoXen]

Horn of Valor is too deep into the tree, and it doesn't offer more damage than To the Death (offers up to 300% in a long fight). Besides, it's pretty easy to get it on a 2H warrior and  set it to preferred in the same party.

 

Bodyguard is pretty much necessary for To the Death. Even on Nightmare, a boss does not one-shot non-tanks. Even a mage can take at least 2-3 hits. However, after prolonged periods of To the Death, the boss will one-shot more squishy party members with full barrier. Bodyguard saves them from such a hit, and it will pretty much be the only source of damage the tank is going to take.

[brazen_nl]

 

Horn of Valor is too deep into the tree, and it doesn't offer more damage than To the Death (offers up to 300% in a long fight). Besides, it's pretty easy to get it on a 2H warrior and  set it to preferred in the same party.

 

 

This.

 

Horn of Valor is an amazing ability, but as a SnB I find the point cost too much. For a DPS 2H warrior, it doesn't cost any extra points, since the preceding ones already mesh very well with the rest of the points taken. It also wouldn't make sense to spec your Tank into a crit machine.

[E.T.I.]

Hmm,OK. Let me make it more clear.

 

First of all we are talking about Nightmare difficulty ofc.(Atleast I am )

I've found that at some point (~lvl8) my tank was at max mitigation almost all the time except for magic attacks (seriously just CC caster/casters and focus fire on them).

 

Then let's assume that we are not min-maxing lvl20+ fullmastercraft dragon kills (because it is just as simple as bring mage(Static Cage) + assa + tempest(with griffon bow ofc) + arti and dragon dies in 10 seconds while doing his RAWR animation).

 

So we already got enought tankiness just from items alone (ok,not alone,some mandatory passives are still needed) and how could tank contribute to team?

As for me,I see this milestones:

1. Aggro control (War Cry,To The Death,Challenge is more then enought)

2. Preventing damage to team (And for my team comp(Blackwall+Arti Inq+Cole DW manually controlled+Solas) I got too many CC and direct damage to even bother about regular mobs(melted in a matter of seconds) and bosses are mostly taunted the whole time. So I don't use it )

3. Buffing/supporting your team.

 

Now 3 is a bit tricky. Let's count how much points you need to be godlike tanky. Its 6 points into SnB + 3 points into Champion + 2 into Vanguard(War Cry+) total of 11 points. Now we need to work on aggro control: +1 point gives us TtD(you don't need to upgrade this if you are playing optimized party setup) +2 points into Vanguard gives you 3rd taunt and stamina regen.

 

We are now at 14 points. From this milestone what you want to do is to get things that contribute to your party output, and as I mentioned about side damage to party (atleast in my team comp) - I'd suggest to look only for more damage to hostiles.

 

+2 points in Vanguard for Cutting Words lands us at 16 points and what do you suggest to take next (ofc we are talking about utility for your teammates).

 

So?

 

P.S. About crit machine - arti loves crit machines. End of story

P.P.S.

 

Horn of Valor is too deep into the tree, and it doesn't offer more damage than To the Death (offers up to 300% in a long fight).

 

I don't know from where you read that my statement was "Don't take TtD and take HoV instead". Obviously you need both of them O.o

 

EDIT: Or you could just MC armor or sword with HoV proc

[brazen_nl]

P.S. About crit machine - arti loves crit machines. End of story

 

Agreed. But not on your tank, you do it with any other character. End of that story.

[E.T.I.]

Nah,tell me what you do on your tank then?

 

Even more tankiness to be able to maintain TtD for 40 mins and solo a dragon with a tank? Possible, but too boring.

 

Actually I've found myself crafting tankgear with as many offense/utility slots as possible. And while tank alone benefits more from AP, his little arti friend benefits even more from extra crit source.I'm too lazy to do the STRONG math about this,but in theory I should be somewhere near the truth

[Maverick827]

Then let's assume that we are not min-maxing lvl20+ fullmastercraft dragon kills (because it is just as simple as bring mage(Static Cage) + assa + tempest(with griffon bow ofc) + arti and dragon dies in 10 seconds while doing his RAWR animation).

Why even bother if that's how you're going to play? I mean, Iove making my party as strong as possible, but at some point it's not even fun anymore.

[Feranel]

Nah,tell me what you do on your tank then?

 

Even more tankiness to be able to maintain TtD for 40 mins and solo a dragon with a tank? Possible, but too boring.

 

Actually I've found myself crafting tankgear with as many offense/utility slots as possible. And while tank alone benefits more from AP, his little arti friend benefits even more from extra crit source.I'm too lazy to do the STRONG math about this,but in theory I should be somewhere near the truth

 

With constant uptime on TtD, dragon solo's actually go pretty fast, ~9 minutes or so.

[Magma_Axis]

Do you think Bioware fixed this 1 damage thing with the patch ?

Because one of the patch note said :

- Fixed exploit that would allow users to take no damage

 

Taking 1 damage is not the same as take no damage though. But i also never heard of no damage exploit in DAI

[GhoXen]

Do you think Bioware fixed this 1 damage thing with the patch ?

Because one of the patch note said :

- Fixed exploit that would allow users to take no damage

 

Taking 1 damage is not the same as take no damage though. But i also never heard of no damage exploit in DAI

 

That appears to be something completely unrelated.

 

Taking only 1 damage can be the proper result of damage calculation, with the right gear and abilities.

[RamonNZ]

I've heard that the Melee defense stat in items is bugged and only works from the back, so you're stuck with 30% damage mitigation from the front +  other passives that assist in that, but no extra melee defense from armor/'weapons. Is that why you have melee defense so low down the totem pole in armor building?

[Exalus]

If you go with a dwarven warrior inquisitor, is it possible to get near magic immunity by using mage armor and prioritizing defense:cloth slots?

[RobRam10]

Bump cause this thread is NEEDED!

[RobRam10]

Zap

[DorianBR]

I've tried this build, and indeed my character seems immortal. But does anyone have tips for holding aggro? The taunts don't seem to be enough.. when the duration runs out, the enemies just go attack my squishies anyway. Except To the Death, but it's only really useful on single enemy fights.

Just killed my first dragon and most of the fight consisted of me alone slashing the dragon's legs while my party was dead. Which is exacly how my knight enchanter played and why I stopped playing it.. just can't seem to keep my party alive on hard fights

[DarkAmaranth1966]

With Bull, take it form Bull himself. "You need a front line body guard?" Well that's what Bull is. He works perfectly if he's set to defend the inquisitor. He isn't a tank, never meant to be one, he's a body guard, use him as such and, take Cass or Blackwall as the tank. Bull is a personal body guard.

 

Used like that, you may not need a tank all of the time, Bull late game does get pretty invincible and, he will take anything that targets you off you in a heartbeat. Just don't make a tank out of a body guard.