Questa discussione ha avuto 191 risposte

[Blackstork]

 

Not yet. Though on my playthrough now I have gotten increasingly annoyed with the Deathblow bug. It's making the playstyle feel a bit clunky!

I might give it a go for the remaining part(Oasis and mire)!

How was the build again? Something like:

 

2 points - Level  3:  Flank Attack + Upgrade [Double Dagger, Left side]

4 points - Level  8:  Easy to Miss --> Knockout Powder + upgrade --> Mercy Killing [Subterfuge Right side]

2 points - Level 10:  Evasion --> Evade [Subterfuge, Left Side]

2 points  - level 12:  Shadow Strike + upgrade [Subterfuge, Center]

 

 

Yes, swap order between Evade and SS depending on your composition and content - there some differences could exist, but FA is re-stealth universal starter which keeps you safe if things hairy. and stealth used. This also allows more oportunities to time your Stealth + SS combo later. 

Particularily abusing it you can fight very overwhelm,ing odds with some patience, esp in hinterlands, tho you should  beware of mabaris cause they are perceptive.

You can also get KP before FA, if you find that combos and cc much more valuable and that will be enough to keep you safe (oin NM + 3 companions its better). So, unless you solo, KP first is better solution too. You can create Nightmare effects or ruptiures just from level 3 or so (already in Haven as start of Hinterlands) and this is awesome damage and cc. As i guess you do not making play with reduced/0 qty of companions, and if it so, KP is first pick, then FA, then Deep Slumber and MK.

[Matth85]

I'm confused.

 

If you are just doing this for Youtube videos, why don't you just use the trainer to advance your characters, then fight the dragon directly instead of wasting hours of time? You could probably do every combination in a few hours, and upload everything. 

If I want to play a game, I play the game. Ia actually enjoy the Hinterlands, hence I go through it.

Besides, I am recording it as well. Just so I can put each of my build to the test, and prove they work flawlessly!

 

I am also OCD when it comes to completing stuff. I can't allow myself to fight the Ferelden Frostback before everything else is done.

[SpaceV3gan]

Check out my video of the Ferelden Frostback! It shows my tactic for defeating it serverlyt undergeared. My longest kill by far: 25 minutes! My shortest was recently, post-patch, at 9 minutes on an archer. That might be because of the purple Tier 2 bow that can be found in the Astrarium puzzle at Storm Coast, hehe!

 

I am working on getting my DW rogue and 2h warrior to this point, so I can get a video of all 4 builds defeating it. I am level 8 on my rogue, using 2 level 1 daggers (That sucks big times!) but got bored. Starting my 2h warrior now. 

 

It's fun, I have mapped out how long it takes me to do everything pre-skyhold! That means I have done this waaay too many times!

 

4 houres Hinterlands

1 hour Storm Coast

45 minutes Oasis

45 minutes Fellow mire

1 hour Hinterland(with dragon kill).

 

Bloody Hinterlands, you are way too big! 

I've watched your video, partially. I had given up the Dragon fight.
I loaded the game with this mindset but there my party was, inside the tunnel with the Dragon sitting on in front of me, just waiting. Because I am stubborn, I could not resist a last attempt.
I didn't play well, Vivienne was always outside the dragon wingspan and used a ton of potions. But for some reason the fight went better than before.
When the Dragon had 3k health left there was only Cassandra standing with 1 potion, but gladly she was very well geared, Tier 2 + Paragon Lust from head to toe. And so I managed to kill the Dragon, at level 10.
I have to say this was the toughest fight in the game hands down. I am not willing to include it as part of my pre-Skyhold routine for further playthroughs. But at least I felt that accomplished something.

And despite I had killed all the Dragons with a different character before, only after this Fereldan Frostback fight I unlocked the Dragon's Bane Achievement. So that is a plus.

[Matth85]

Good job!

 

It gets better, hehe! Once you get into the habbit of dealing with the draogn mechanics, it's smooth sailing. The only problem you might run into is the AoE lightning circles dragons such at the Northern Hunter does (In Crestwood). Doing that pre-specialization at 13 was also very easy! 

 

I havn't actually killed the Ferelden Frostback with this setup on a 2h warrior yet, so I am looking forward to that. It's going to be... interesting.

[Dabrikishaw]

I admit, I'm a little stumped at how you got to level 12 before Skyhold. I'm level 9 and I just finished In Heart's Whisper.

[Kaigen42]

If you do absolutely everything in the first four areas available (including collection of shards, regions, landmarks, etc.) and prioritize getting the Codex/Dialogue perks, it's not too hard to hit level 12 pre-Skyhold. I'll even do a few requisition quests early on just to line up those perks a little faster. On my current playthrough I got them and Massache's Method before fighting the Frostback and ended up at level 13 before doing In Hushed Whispers.

[Matth85]

An optimal playthrough gets you to 12. By optimal I mean:

1) You do everything.

2) You get 2 Codex entries.

3) Does not a single Requisition (You end the game with 100-200 extra Power anyways)

4) Get Deft Hand to open the doors

 

 

Why? Simple. By the time Ferelden Frostback dies, I got 5 Inquisition points. I also got 3 Force agents, 1 inquisition agent, 2 Secret agent and 3 Connection Agents.

That means I need a grand total of 3 points in Secret and 2 points in Force. Perfect!

 

Obviously, from a xp-perspective it would be wiser to get the 4 codex entries first. Though then you won't be able to open the deft hand doors, and you can't really "complete" the zones pre-skyhold I also do not get Massache's method as it is.. minimal. The average enemy gives what, 50 experience? that's 2.5% more xp per enemy. Even the Ferelden Frostback only gives 1kish, which translates to 50 more xp. Towards the end of the game it will be maybe a level, but this early on it is simply not as pressing and potions or Deft hand!

 

Also. Fun fact: I end up with 91 Power before doing the Templar or Mages quest. Only requisition done is the one in Storm Coast for the quest. 

[Blackstork]

On my new NM FF on Duo run i go pots upgrades and rush to rogue schematics as fast as possible, because it allows you to have decent tier 2 early in the game, combining that with tier 2 materials you can do nice tier 2 gear pre-plot advance. I know its kinda wasted point for future, but future of the game is easy, while start-mid game need some better gear to pass the hushed/champions and Haven battle.

[Matth85]

On my new NM FF on Duo run i go pots upgrades and rush to rogue schematics as fast as possible, because it allows you to have decent tier 2 early in the game, combining that with tier 2 materials you can do nice tier 2 gear pre-plot advance. I know its kinda wasted point for future, but future of the game is easy, while start-mid game need some better gear to pass the hushed/champions and Haven battle.

That would work.

Though I don't craft I find it to break the game. It simply trivialize Nightmare. I only craft Tier 1 gear for the most part.

[Blackstork]

That would work.

Though I don't craft I find it to break the game. It simply trivialize Nightmare. I only craft Tier 1 gear for the most part.

play duo and not 4 man party, and you will find it vital

[Matth85]

play duo and not 4 man party, and you will find it vital

It's still as broken as ever. You just play with less tools. Once you get tier 3 you can solo the game pretty much. I try to avoid that.

[Tak of the Archives]

Hi Matth85 - thanks for the builds. Quick question post skyhold - which specializations for rogue - both archer and DW would you go for?

[Matth85]

Hi Matth85 - thanks for the builds. Quick question post skyhold - which specializations for rogue - both archer and DW would you go for?

Assassin or Tempest. If you like how the archer or DW plays pre-skyhold, go Assasin. If you want to change playstyle, go tempest.

 

Assassin: Needs the least amount of min/maxing to be optimal, and the playstyle is pretty smooth in both.

Tempest: Changes the playstyle, but offers good control of the battlefield. More survivability. Works well for both.

 

Artificer is a different ballgame altogether. For DW it is a bit odd, though it can be very fun and different. For Archer it is just behind Assassin late-game given an optimal setup. Though that requires a lot of planning and gear!

[Kaigen42]

An optimal playthrough gets you to 12. By optimal I mean:

1) You do everything.

2) You get 2 Codex entries.

3) Does not a single Requisition (You end the game with 100-200 extra Power anyways)

4) Get Deft Hand to open the doors

 

 

Why? Simple. By the time Ferelden Frostback dies, I got 5 Inquisition points. I also got 3 Force agents, 1 inquisition agent, 2 Secret agent and 3 Connection Agents.

That means I need a grand total of 3 points in Secret and 2 points in Force. Perfect!

 

Obviously, from a xp-perspective it would be wiser to get the 4 codex entries first. Though then you won't be able to open the deft hand doors, and you can't really "complete" the zones pre-skyhold I also do not get Massache's method as it is.. minimal. The average enemy gives what, 50 experience? that's 2.5% more xp per enemy. Even the Ferelden Frostback only gives 1kish, which translates to 50 more xp. Towards the end of the game it will be maybe a level, but this early on it is simply not as pressing and potions or Deft hand!

I don't do requisitions for the power, but each one is worth 100 influence towards the next perk, so by doing a few I can get all of the codex perks and still be able to pick up Deft Hands and Massache's Method pre-Skyhold. Most of them only require crafting materials that you are harvesting in vast quanitities and will quickly obsolete anyway (and if you don't craft you have even less use for them).

 

I agree that Massache's Method is a marginal benefit, but I have the codex perks and Deft Hands lined up, I find that none of the other perks jump out as "must haves," so I might as well pick up something that can accumulate to a small benefit if I get it early.

[Matth85]

I don't do requisitions for the power, but each one is worth 100 influence towards the next perk, so by doing a few I can get all of the codex perks and still be able to pick up Deft Hands and Massache's Method pre-Skyhold. Most of them only require crafting materials that you are harvesting in vast quanitities and will quickly obsolete anyway (and if you don't craft you have even less use for them).

 

I agree that Massache's Method is a marginal benefit, but I have the codex perks and Deft Hands lined up, I find that none of the other perks jump out as "must haves," so I might as well pick up something that can accumulate to a small benefit if I get it early.

 

I did not know they gave Influence! Alas, it matters not. Not doing them gives 5 points, just enough to reach Deft Hands and potions. 

Good to know though!

[SpaceV3gan]

Agents are abundant pre-Skyhold, but I screwed up many. I didn't know choosing to help the refugees would not hire Speaker Anais at all. And I wasn't aware Belle even existed until I read some guides.
Also, by disbanding the Templars I wasn't able to get the templar dude. And lastly I have the impression Corporal Vale is locked for good, since he is still asking for blankets post-Skyhold.
Now I comfort myself with the thought that Agents lose their relevance by late game (arguably they do) and also that I made many choices that were according to my Inquisitor's view, regardless of getting Agents or not.

[Dabrikishaw]

Whelp, I've tried but I can't kill the Ferelden Frostback even at level 11. Guess I'll just have to move on with the main story.

[Valerius]

Hey great guide Matth85! I've seen you posting some great builds around lately and giving some great information thats helped many (including me) out, so thanks a lot for that!   Quick question from your experience, which was more satisfying to play, a s&s warrior, or a 2h warrior? Thank you again!

[Matth85]

Hey great guide Matth85! I've seen you posting some great builds around lately and giving some great information thats helped many (including me) out, so thanks a lot for that!   Quick question from your experience, which was more satisfying to play, a s&s warrior, or a 2h warrior? Thank you again!

I haven't actually played a sword and shield warrior! I let the AI do it. So I can't really answer on that I like to be the one doing the damage, as I can do it optimally compared to the AI. The AI can tank fine anyways!

[Blackstork]

Ok i playing my, suggested Full suptrefuge build, which have only un-upgraded TF and upgraded FA from DW.

I playing duo game (me + only one companion) Nightmare, FF on.

Well, its exitingly good  with properly build Combo/CC Vivienne (or any mage, pre-skyhold mages do not differ skill-wise, anyways). 

You simply... well, never get hit. All you need is good planning to create stun lock, decimate/CC rangers first, lock out melees at start, and provide barrier for the gaps.

Such rogue + Static cage (through LB - Barrage/LB/SC))+ top winter tree + top of spirit tree  = CC AOE pownage. After getting used to it it makes easy duo on NM FF on. You dont even need to run with Cassandra. You simply CC/combo lock.  

Well, i did not hit Haven yet, but i am sure it will be cheese.

Btw, the classes are balanced. I also think you can solo NM with mage , even through Haven.

Now i see the power of the Dark Breasts, my dears! You do need to be KE even, i assure you! Btw if there would be PVP proper mage (Vivi) would be class that is very annoying to fight against

[Matth85]

I did give the Subterfuge build a try!

Wasn't my kind of playstyle though. Just as Tempest isn't my absolute favorite way to play. The playstyle seem to be rather similar though. 

I might add it to my build list though!

[1G86]

Hey Matth85, I gave some thought about your points for AI not using Charging Bull very effectively. Would it help if I set other abilities to "Preferred" so that the AI ends up using those skills more, or would the AI just really burn out Stamina trying to run around with Charging Bull? 

 

I want my companions set-up as though I can switch to them from time to time. Since Charging Bull is something I would use, I want it mapped out on my Warriors, as it opens up some free skills when upgraded. 

[Matth85]

Hey Matth85, I gave some thought about your points for AI not using Charging Bull very effectively. Would it help if I set other abilities to "Preferred" so that the AI ends up using those skills more, or would the AI just really burn out Stamina trying to run around with Charging Bull? 

 

I want my companions set-up as though I can switch to them from time to time. Since Charging Bull is something I would use, I want it mapped out on my Warriors, as it opens up some free skills when upgraded. 

Well, sure -- you can do it and hope the AI doesn't muck it up. If you play with FF off, it is manageable. If the warrior is a dps it doesn't matter too much, but as a tank it might make for some frustrating times. 

At worst, just set it to disable

[1G86]

Well, both Cass and Blackwall will be converted to 2H Warrior. Won't be using Iron Bull, since I will use Reaver. Yeah Disabling it could work too just as long as it's still mapped.

[zeypher]

K until deathblows stamina drain of 100 is fixed i say that skill is worthless. first hit takes 50 second takes 50 as well. This means i cannot chain it, it lowers my dps due to its massive stamina drain.