94 réponses à ce sujet

[Illydth]

LOTS to respond to!

 

@Gwyvian:

 

"I DID get the Mask of the Grand Duchess and the Mask of Chalons, presumably through exposing Florianne, so the notion that this option yields no rewards is wrong. (One reason I was hesitating to go through with this, but you DO get these two.)"

 

So the notion is not "wrong".  The two masks you mention come from exposing Florianne, you will get them in ANY outcome in which Florianne is exposed...this has NOTHING to do with the way you deal with the three leaders (I hoped to be able to make that clearer in the guide, but unfortunately everything is too tied together and when I had them separate it was just confusing).  If you expose Florianne you get these two masks.  What this means, of course, is that you got NOTHING from the outcome of the 3 leaders...making this ending the worst choice for personal gain.

 

@SimSiren3

 

"Sorry if this is an extremely dumb question but - the guide has the exact same path to get the ending where Gaspard rules and where Briala rules through Gaspard.  Surely at some point you need to make a different choice, at the very least a different conversational option?  Can someone tell me at what point the Briala ending differs from the Gaspard ending?"

 

Not a dumb question AT ALL.  Looks like this part of the guide got MORE convoluted when I tried to make the guide LESS convoluted...namely I lost the conversation option I used to have in the guide that lead to this.

 

Upon dealing with Florianne (remember, you CANNOT choose Gaspard or Briala on the throne unless Celene dies in the Assassination attempt), you'll enter a cutscene with Briala and Gaspard.

 

The very first menu interaction has 2 options: 

 

5. Gaspard will be emperor.

2. Briala can take over.

 

Choosing 5 will put Gaspard on the throne and execute Celene, Choosing 2 will put Gaspard on the throne, but he will be Celene's Pet...she will be calling all the shots from the background.  From there, it's just a matter of exposing the evidence you found on either Gaspard or Briala in the next set of menus till the conversation is over...there are no more choices.

 

Sorry that wasn't made clearer!  The guide has been updated with this information, thanks for the catch!

 

@redbonegt

 

"However, I wanted to see whether or not I ended up getting the bug the ending. According to what I read here if you use the over 85 approval rating and have Florianne arrested, put Celine on the throne, and have Gaspard executed you should end up with the masks of the Empress, ambassador, grand duchess, Chalons, and Valmont.

I did just that, but did not reunite the Empress and Brialla as I feared having a glitched ending. I basically did all of the conversation choices as if that was my goal, i.e. I had made both the Empress and Brialla aware that I had found the locket, but at the very end I only said that Gaspard was guilty and not that Briella helped.

I ended up getting all the masks except for the mask of the ambassador. Did I do something wrong, or was it behind the treasure door, or did I end up with a glitch still?"

 

So I'm confused.  The "Bug" mentioned only applies to Reuniting Celene/Briala...the wrong masks are returned.  The ending you describe above is "Celene on Throne Alone (Gaspard Exiled or Executed, Briala Exiled or Unmentioned)".  Because you did not reunite Celene and Briala, you get the loot as noted in the walkthrough:

 

--> Expose Florianne (85 or Better Court Approval) - No Fight

     --- Mask of the Grand Duchess

     --- Mask of Chalons
     --- Mask of the Empress
     --- Mask of Valmont

 

Which as you're mentioning seems to be exactly what you got.  Note, mask of the Ambassador is NOT listed here, you ONLY get Ambassador if you Side with Briala.  You are SUPPOSED To get it if you Reunite Celene/Briala, but the mentioned bug prevents you from obtaining that mask in the Reunite case...so the only way to get it is to have Celene Killed and put Briala on the throne.

 

@Kailord

 

"After reading all of the thread I am still unclear how the epilogue is when you make all three work together, either "for Orlais" or "for me". Can someone please enlighten me?"

 

Post 29 on Page 2 of the thread details all the endings...except this one!

 

I haven't finished the game and didn't select this ending.  Anyone else able to follow up?

 

(Post 70 by DuckDuckPotato is the best this thread has on this).

 

 

@BAC PARTY CITY (et.al. Everyone who doesn't want to kill anyone)

 

"My game is on hold till I think about this or bioware patches this"

 

"I'd like to help the Elves but I don't want to remove Brialia or Gasspard as they would both be very helpful to Orlaise. Brialia with her political tact and Gasspard with his military prowess."

 

It's my opinion you're looking at this in the wrong light.  All three leaders are selfish to a fault, all three leaders refuse to work with each other for the better of Orlais.  There is no "make them get along", even the "make them get along" ending makes it clear that the only reason they cooperate is because of the power the inquisition holds over them...it only teaches the three to be MORE underhanded in their attempts to overthrow each other.

 

Gaspard is a traitor to Orlais.  He's literally putting soldiers in place to attempt a Military Coup and has started a military rebellion against the crowned Empress of his country.  In every country in the world that's called "High Treason" and carries a penalty of execution.  His rebellion has pit soldiers against soldiers and commoners against commoners in a very very bloody war (see Western Approach) that has killed thousands.  Following on to that, any ending where Gaspard remains alive notes that he will continue to attempt to overthrow Celene.  While he's a great military strategist and military mind, he's proven he's not willing to work for or toward the betterment of Orlais...only for the betterment of himself.

 

Briala is a traitor to Orlais.  Maybe not as openly as Gaspard, but she's got the largest spy network in the land working AGAINST Celene.  Because of a Lover's Spat, Briala is willing to throw Orlais aside for personal Vengence.  Even were THAT not the case, she's an utter racist: Putting "Elven" above "Orlesian" as a noble of Orlais.  She is billed pretty much as the leader of a terrorist organization in Orlais.  The only thing worse than a guy willing to declare war on his own people to get the throne is the assassin lurking in the shadows willing to pull any underhanded trick to cede power to themselves.  At least Gaspard is willing to stand up and OPENLY fight for what he wants.

 

Celene is a traitor to Orlais.  Ok, again, not nearly as much as the other two, but her biggest fault is simply ignoring Orlais in favor of her own opinions.  She seems to rule with "I'm right and you're wrong because I'm your leader."  It's HER politics that FORCES Briala into the shadows and Gaspard into a war.  It's pretty clear that Celene is nothing more than a little girl with her head in the clouds.  As the leader of the most powerful empire in the land, she's more interested in art and beauty than in furthering Orlais.  Her (ex)-lover is an elf, yet she continues to oppress elves same as always, she has no military sense, and her only claim to the throne seems to be "Well, I'm there."

 

Remember that you, as the Inquisition, are NOT There to fix Orlais...what happens to Orlais is not your concern in the slightest.  Your only reason for being there is to make sure whoever comes out on top in this provides resources and backing for your battle against Coriphious (SP?).  Keep in mind it's your own adviser (Cullen) who suggests allowing Celene to be murdered in the first place to put Gaspard (and thus a stronger military) in the Inquisitions pocket.

 

Remember, it's called "The Game" for a reason, no player is innocent, no player is above reproach.  Remember in all three DA games, everyone says the Orlesian game is played to the death.  All three rulers went into it with an understanding that at LEAST one of them would not survive the outcome.

 

One more concept:  Remember that by the end of the quest, you have enough blackmail material on all three of them to make them do anything you want...meaning NONE of them are innocent and ALL of them, in one way shape form or fashion, deserve the ending they get.

 

Want to really feel bad about yourself?  Remember that all the "evidence" you find that you choose to use as blackmail material is "questionable".  The letter implicating Gaspard in assassinating ambassadors?  Some evidence points to Briala having assassinated the Ambassadors and pinning it on Gaspard...though you can choose to use that as evidence against Gaspard.  That knife in the back of the noble bearing Gaspard's Crest?  Obviously planted there by Florianne's people...but you can still use it as Blackmail against Gaspard. 

 

NO ONE is innocent...including you.

[Illydth]

@andreeaa

 

Would you happen to be able to Screenshot / Video your "push a character through the wall" tactic?  While I suspect this would be considered an "exploit", there's always an argument when it comes to Single Player games.  Who exactly are you hurting?  Don't like it?  Don't do it.

 

I assume once you're in the room you can open the door from the INSIDE without expending Halla statues and thus this works?

[andreeaa]

@Illydth

 

Here's how I did it:

First, make a real save in front of the vault (1.), because the approval clock is ticking and you don't want to lose too much time.

 

 

Place one character slightly to the right side of the closed door. Press hold. (2.)
Place the second one near the wall, between the chair and the weird piece of furniture. Pause. Press hold. (3.)

 

 

Move a third character behind the second. (4.) This will make the 2-nd enter the wall. Switch control to him and jump forward. (5.)

 

You'll find yourself in the vault. (6.) Loot the place blind.
No proof of breaking and entering

 

 

Now, about escaping the vault... You cannot open the door from inside without using halla statuettes, so you'll be functioning with a 3 member party for a bit. (I've had a hell of a fight with the venatori without my main).
However, the game manages somehow to restore your full party during the cutscene with Briala or when you change area (maybe a save/load fixes it too, but I haven't tried it)
All of this may seem so complicated from my explanations (and my TV-English) but it is simple, really.

P.S. While I may have something against cheating your character into a demigod, this is not the issue. I understand perfectly that you should make choices and can't have it all: masks, loot and the best quest outcome. But to throw those collector side quests, when they know that at least half of the players suffer from OCD, that is purely evil. It's enough of a chore to find all those coins and secrets against time, they shouldn't be in restricted areas too.

[Illydth]

Actually I was just thinking the same thing myself.  Locking a quest completion behind a limited item door (Celene's Room) is a pretty poor way of doing it.  Again, I agree with you that I approve of choices and not allowing you to get everything you want...but my OCD is pretty bad as well and not completing quests bothers me.

 

Thanks for this, I think your explanation (and English) is just fine and understandable.   If anyone wants a better explanation, I'd be happy to provide.

[Obsidian Gryphon]

Oh, interesting. Going to see if it works for me. Thanks for the guide and tip, Illydth, Andreeaa.

[DuckDuckPotato]

Great info on the exploit. But speaking of doors. Could someone tell me what's behind the 2 rogue specific doors? (The one in de library and the other one in Gaspard's trophy room) I've never played a rogue :/

[Illydth]

You don't have to PLAY a rogue, you just need a rogue in your party...probably with Deft Hands, Fine Tools Perk...though nothing in my walk-through seems to note a "Rogue only locked door", so there's every possibility any rogue will get you through those doors.  Take Varrick or Sara with you on your run through and see for yourself.

That said my map is pretty convoluted...but I don't believe there are any secrets or coins behind them, meaning probably just additional random loot.

[andreeaa]

Glad to help!

 

Oh, and if someone is wandering if the said exploit can be used to break into the other halla rooms (mage/warrior treasure), I've already tried it... Nope!

But worry not, I've loaded multiple times and I can tell that they didn't contain anything breathtaking anyway.

[sethroskull79]

I am about to do this quest today....what is the recommended path to take to get the most approval from your party?  I don't care about loot.  I got plenty of good items since I am level 20.

[Umbar]

I was going for the 'Force Everyone to Work Together' ending and failed because I don't have enough Court Approval. That's fine by me; I'm a RP'er and that works, though I wish that was somehow reflected in the conversations. When I tried the 'All of you are to blame' option Celene just brushed me off without any reference to the soldier in her room; I wish Bioware had acknowledged that I had blackmail material on her but that I did not have enough sway in the court for it to be meaningful or something like that.

 

So in the end Briala was exiled and Gaspard executed.

 

Where I messed up is with Briala. I found the elven locket and then plain forgot to use it. Is it worth going back and replaying the entire Royal Wing level just so I can use the locket? I'm not clear on why I should care (as a dwarf in-game) about whether Briala and Celene reconciles. 

 

I am also wondering about the blackmail material against Briala. The elf admits anyone in the network could have done it, but is convinced it was Briala. I suppose there's no way to know who was responsible for sure.

 

I honestly felt Briala's character was wholly extraneous to the entire affair. It would have just fine if the choices were between Gaspard and Celene.

[Mushashi7]

It annoys me I didn't receive 'Mask of the Ambassador' when reuniting Celene and Briala

[Ravelyn]

Thanks for this. I'm dreading this quest since I screwed up on my first playthrough, I wanted Gaspard on the throne but didn't kill Celene (and so apparently a ruling Gaspard was no longer possible). The approval bleed gets me super nervous. Now that I'm doing a super extensive second playthrough, I plan to master this quest and steer it into my preferred ending with the help of this guide! 8)

[Illydth]

Glad this is helpful to you all.   I had a good time putting it together and I'm glad it's become so useful to everyone!

 

@Ravelyn:  The "Getting Gaspard on the Throne" ending is pretty easy actually, court approval only needs to be high enough to NOT get you thrown out of the ball.  Otherwise all of the choices are pretty much made for you.  You MUST get blackmail material on Briala (the story won't continue, that's what you get in the first locked room at the top of the garden/first restricted area), and Celene getting assassinated is an easy outcome which can happen no matter what your court approval is.

 

The only endings that require high court approval are the two "special" endings:  Work Together and Briala+Celene Makeup.  For any of the others, court approval is meaningless so long as you're not so low you lose the mission.

[Deadly dwarf]

Dumb question perhaps, but if your inquisitor isn't a rogue, is there any way to get the "rogue needed" doors in the library opened?  Any way to task Sera or another rogue to open them for you while you're elsewhere?  I was able to get Sera to open the locked basement cells for me in Haven.

[Deadly dwarf]

I went for the "all of them work together" option.  When it was through, Celene and Gaspard went up to speak while Briala sulked.  She wasn't arrested and I've not heard anything about her being exiled.  Did I succeed in the "all three" option or did I accidentally stab Briala in the back?

[Gervaise]

I've a couple of queries.   First the Belle of the Ball achievement.   I'm not that bothered about it but I am intrigued to know how it works.   Even if you enter the Royal Apartment with 100 approval there doesn't seem any way of getting to the end with that in tact.   However, there are occasions when you could get court approval but it doesn't show because you are already on 100.   Does the game bank this?

 

Also I noticed that when I untied the soldier on the bed, asking him to testify, the message flashed up  Approval -45.   On screen it still showed as 100.   So what was going on there?   According to this guide you ought to get +10 for releasing the soldier.    Does this minus approval not influence the outcome in the ballroom but does influence the epilogue?     I imagine it makes no difference if you get all 3 to work together but if you go for Gaspard/Briala the amount of court approval affects the epilogue.  

[Illydth]

I too noticed something about this.  At one point you have to get past the guards out front of the trophy room.  I "tricked" them and got something like a -15 approval or something like that but it didn't seem to affect my score at the time at all.

 

That said, I did end this thing with something like 92 - 94 approval.  I don't know how I'd have ended it with 100.  Anyone out there confirm that the game will "store" approval above 100, it just won't show it?

 

@Deadly Dwarf: 

 

If you kept Celiene alive, and the conversation that happened at the end didn't include Celene either banishing or telling Gaspard she was going to have him executed, then your "work together" ending succeeded.

[JosieJ]

I too noticed something about this.  At one point you have to get past the guards out front of the trophy room.  I "tricked" them and got something like a -15 approval or something like that but it didn't seem to affect my score at the time at all.

 

 

If you have the Massache's Method perk (under Forces), you get another option to make them go away.  I can't remember if you actually gain favor from using it (you definitely don't lose any), but I'm about to go through this quest again once I get home from work, so I'll post later on the outcome!

 

On Edit:  OK, I've passed that point: you gain 10 points of favor for using that tactic with the perk.  And it does seem like you can "store" approval.  I got way over 100 with the secrets and with gaining the maximum favor while dancing with Florianne.  Once I got into the royal wing, discovering the tied-up captain supposedly lost me 4 points of favor, yet my Influence remained the same.

 

And thanks for all your hard work on this!  Now that I've played through a few times and not gotten the outcome that I wanted (and went with it anyway for RP purposes), this will help me get my desired outcome this time through.

[Lord_Draevan]

How exactly do you "Negotiate peace between Orlais and Ferelden" if Gaspard rules alone? I know there's the war table operation "Delicate Negotiations", but is that only available if Celene lives, or is it available for both?

 

On a side note, I wonder what'll happen if Celene stays in power. If she doesn't have a kid, when she dies the Empire will likely fall into another civil war, with every noble even somewhat related to her vying for the throne. Because if she's a lesbian... no kids of her blood, so... potential problem of succession when she dies.

[Alucard400]

I just did this story quest a couple of times in the last few days. I follwed the "reunited Celene and Briala" scenario. I was not able to both open Celene's hala door and the door in the Guest Garden. It was either or so I couldnt even finish the secrets quest. But I verified the rewards at the end and can say I received Mask of the Grand Duchess and was NOT bugged. Apparently, I also did receive this mask as a reward even with Celene alone (not reunited) as being ruler with Gapard executed. The rewards listed on this guide may no longer apply because of the game updated but I think rewards now may have to do with something else such as the number on the court approval.