436 réponses à ce sujet

[saladinbob]

At the heart of the issue is that Bioware decided to make this game for consoles and port it over to the PC so from a design perspective, the PC never had any of the gameplay elements that they enjoy. It lacked depth and was heavy on the action. If this game had been made for the PC and ported to the consoles then it would have had the gameplay elements that attract PC audiences and the console ports could have had those elements removed leaving them with stripped down action they enjoy. If they had taken the former route rather than the latter, both PC owners and Console owners would have been happy with the game that had been released on their platform.

[In Exile]

Origins had healing magic and damage mitigation by way of both Rock Armour (magic and salves), Heroric Defence, Heoric Aura, Arcane Shield and the Glyph of Warding and by no means was any character on any playthrough even remotely god-like in their abilities nor was it a walk in the park. It was, in fact, a harder game than Inquisition is. The entire argument of not having healing magic in DAI because it has damage mitigation is preposterous. There really is no reason not to reintroduce it if it's balanced correctly.

That has to be a joke because DAO was a joke. Even if you put aside the crappy UI on PC in DAI that IMO ups the difficulty a lot, mages were so broken in DAO that they turned the game into the easiest thing in the world to faceroll.

The only source of difficulty in DAO came from intentional choices to gimp yourself either by not using certain classes or builds.

[Thibax]

People are complaining of healing spells, complaining about a mandatory healer, but now they always use barriers mages. Go figure!

[shadownian]

That has to be a joke because DAO was a joke. Even if you put aside the crappy UI on PC in DAI that IMO ups the difficulty a lot, mages were so broken in DAO that they turned the game into the easiest thing in the world to faceroll.

The only source of difficulty in DAO came from intentional choices to gimp yourself either by not using certain classes or builds.

TBH, i find no more and no less challenge with either game.

 

I do however find myself bitching at the screen every time i need to use a stupid potion or ever time i look at my so called mage abilities.

 

My mage now has nothing but lightning spells. Save for the other starter spells. Only because at least those spells arent as bad as the others. I also have a lightning staff. No spirit, no shields, none of that.

People who complain that healing made it too easy have to be joking. Almost every class in DAI can build up some form of shielding. Almost everyu class has at least one specialization that allows them to solo dragons even on Nightmare difficulty.

 

Please tell me how having shields and potions, both of which wre in the other games, has increased the challenge in any way?

 

And dont say it adds to the strategic element of the game either. Having all youre characters with shields on them so they never take damage or take so little they barely even need to touch their potions is not strategic. You just changing from a responsive measure, to a preventative measure. Thats it. Its either you act before to stop from taking damage, or you act after to replenish taken damage. Theres no difference.

 

The only thing leaving out healing does is limit the class even more and annoy part of your fan base.

[shadownian]

But like what was said on my other post about this...

 

"The reason why healing was removed and potions don't drop is because of DAMP. You won't spend money on loot chests for consumables if you have a dedicated healer or potions drops.

If you don't have healers in DAMP they sure as hell won't be in single player. Because MONEY."

 

I wouldnt be surprised if that all it came down to....money.

[TristynTrine]

But like what was said on my other post about this...

 

"The reason why healing was removed and potions don't drop is because of DAMP. You won't spend money on loot chests for consumables if you have a dedicated healer or potions drops.

If you don't have healers in DAMP they sure as hell won't be in single player. Because MONEY."

 

I wouldnt be surprised if that all it came down to....money.

What, I'm pretty sure people don't buy this "platinum" nonsense... and if they do, they are dumb and should feel bad for hitting that button. On the barrier debate, hell if they are so against healing I say we boycott barriers til they take them out. Cause they want to restrict my play, I'll try to restrict theirs >.>

 

Also magic in this game is boring, where are all the fun spells... We got Primal spells and a barrier... Big f-ing woopdie doo...

[Bladenite1481]

That has to be a joke because DAO was a joke. Even if you put aside the crappy UI on PC in DAI that IMO ups the difficulty a lot, mages were so broken in DAO that they turned the game into the easiest thing in the world to faceroll.

The only source of difficulty in DAO came from intentional choices to gimp yourself either by not using certain classes or builds.

Any class when built right by end game could turn DAO into faceroll territory. In fact, this is how most RPG's are built in the first place to be honest with you. Weak at the beginning, kings by the end.

 

DA:I is not different in this particular aspect, it is not difficult by any means and only made difficult by imposing self restrictions like no crafting. Personally I don't play these games for difficulty, because the company that makes it doesn't do difficult games of this genre well and never has. Every game they have ever created has been more about the ways you can play and the journey more than the difficulty. So if I have a choice between not difficult and boring or not difficult and tons of choices I can explore, then I'd rather explore. 

[Rearden]

I absolutely 100% disagree with this.

 

The reason healing magic was removed is to better balance the game. (see this article for more) Adding in healing magic and/or out of combat healing makes the game more like DA2 where the focus was on individual encounters. In order to make this challenging the encounters had to take much longer (hence the waves of teleporting enemies). Each encounter was an isolated event where you either survived or you didn't, once completed you continue on as if nothing had happened. 

 

In DA:I its not the encounter that's important, but the mission. The focus is on a series of encounters which forces you to actually use your abilities more effectively (fun) instead of relying on potions and cheap healing spells (boring). I remember in DA:O being essentially forced into having Wynne in the party or spending ridiculous amounts of gold on healing potions. Option A reduces your party choices even further (must have tank + healer + rogue) which meant that I was running Hero, Alistair / Shale, Wynne, and Liliana / Zevran. Not a lot of choice there. Option B is even worse since relying on potions is extremely cheap and unimaginative.

 

It is also slightly more realistic. Unless your name is Logan, and you have a metal skeleton, your body should not be healing wounds when there is no one actively hitting you. Now you either have to learn to use your abilities more effectively to play at higher difficulties. It also allows players the option to tactically retreat, regroup, and reengage without completely breaking the game. Don't like it? L2P or lower the difficulty.

[In Exile]

Any class when built right by end game could turn DAO into faceroll territory. In fact, this is how most RPG's are built in the first place to be honest with you. Weak at the beginning, kings by the end.

 

DA:I is not different in this particular aspect, it is not difficult by any means and only made difficult by imposing self restrictions like no crafting. Personally I don't play these games for difficulty, because the company that makes it doesn't do difficult games of this genre well and never has. Every game they have ever created has been more about the ways you can play and the journey more than the difficulty. So if I have a choice between not difficult and boring or not difficult and tons of choices I can explore, then I'd rather explore. 

 

I disagree to an extent, but yes, generally. However, mages were OP at level 8. That gave you enough points to pick up fireball, and then you just had to roll your way to mana clash. Suddenly, game-over. The only source of difficulty in DA:O was the lack of respec potions. 

[Thibax]

Rearden, forced to have Wynne? When?

 

So in DAI, we can assume that we are forced to have a mage with Barrier.

 

We are restricted with potions.

 

Not a lot of choices too.

[Rearden]

Thibax

 

In order to play any of the DA games, you really need a tank and a healer. In DA:O Wynne is the only one that starts out with Spirit Healer and Allistair makes the best overall tank as a templar. Shale is OK as a tank, but gear customization was next to non-existent. DA2 was even worse. Aveline and Anders are virtually required party members unless Hawke substitutes for one.

 

DA:I you can easily tank with Cassandra OR Blackwall; Cassandra providing party buffs and Blackwall being all but immortal. In addition, tanking is no longer mind-numbingly boring as it was in the previous 2 games. so subbing the inquisitor is not only viable, but seriously fun.

 

For mages, you are "forced" to have a mage with barrier; however barrier is the first spell in the spirit tree, so not hard to get, thus leaving the rest of your ability points open for other spells, wheres in the DA:O you had to invest multiple ability points into healing spells in order to have a decent healer. and DA2 where you either had Anders or Hawke healing. 

 

I don't know what your point was with the potions comment...I am saying that restricting potions is good. Better to have interesting and usable defensive abilities than a ton of potions with virtually no cooldown. 

[mutantspicy]

^I don't know about that.  I used my companions in DAO at the start, once I was able to stun lock people. I solo'd the game almost everytime.  There really was no need for a healer or tank except for your first time thru in DAO from my recollection.  

[TristynTrine]

Tell my how "barrier spam" is interesting, guard is okay. But you replaced healing with barrier/guard invulnerbility pretty much. lol

[Bladenite1481]

I absolutely 100% disagree with this.

 

The reason healing magic was removed is to better balance the game. (see this article for more) Adding in healing magic and/or out of combat healing makes the game more like DA2 where the focus was on individual encounters. In order to make this challenging the encounters had to take much longer (hence the waves of teleporting enemies). Each encounter was an isolated event where you either survived or you didn't, once completed you continue on as if nothing had happened. 

 

In DA:I its not the encounter that's important, but the mission. The focus is on a series of encounters which forces you to actually use your abilities more effectively (fun) instead of relying on potions and cheap healing spells (boring). I remember in DA:O being essentially forced into having Wynne in the party or spending ridiculous amounts of gold on healing potions. Option A reduces your party choices even further (must have tank + healer + rogue) which meant that I was running Hero, Alistair / Shale, Wynne, and Liliana / Zevran. Not a lot of choice there. Option B is even worse since relying on potions is extremely cheap and unimaginative.

 

It is also slightly more realistic. Unless your name is Logan, and you have a metal skeleton, your body should not be healing wounds when there is no one actively hitting you. Now you either have to learn to use your abilities more effectively to play at higher difficulties. It also allows players the option to tactically retreat, regroup, and reengage without completely breaking the game. Don't like it? L2P or lower the difficulty.

This might be true if there wasn't a camp every fifteen feet. They spaced camps like Mcdonalds restaurants or Dunkin Donuts in New England. You don't even need to rest, you can just heal up via potions manually, equip potions and keep rolling.

 

I never had Wynne, well I put her in just to get the spec but nothing more than that. I never liked her look. Never worried about tanking in the game either, my tactics were built to spread aggro and diffuse damage if necessary. Those options are not present in this game, so it plays like a crappy f2p trinity based mmo. 

 

L2P?  That's cute. I finished the game on NM with FF with a Dual Wield Rogue. I don't find it hard, I find it limits choices. 

[shadownian]

I absolutely 100% disagree with this.

 

The reason healing magic was removed is to better balance the game. (see this article for more) Adding in healing magic and/or out of combat healing makes the game more like DA2 where the focus was on individual encounters. In order to make this challenging the encounters had to take much longer (hence the waves of teleporting enemies). Each encounter was an isolated event where you either survived or you didn't, once completed you continue on as if nothing had happened. 

 

In DA:I its not the encounter that's important, but the mission. The focus is on a series of encounters which forces you to actually use your abilities more effectively (fun) instead of relying on potions and cheap healing spells (boring). I remember in DA:O being essentially forced into having Wynne in the party or spending ridiculous amounts of gold on healing potions. Option A reduces your party choices even further (must have tank + healer + rogue) which meant that I was running Hero, Alistair / Shale, Wynne, and Liliana / Zevran. Not a lot of choice there. Option B is even worse since relying on potions is extremely cheap and unimaginative.

 

It is also slightly more realistic. Unless your name is Logan, and you have a metal skeleton, your body should not be healing wounds when there is no one actively hitting you. Now you either have to learn to use your abilities more effectively to play at higher difficulties. It also allows players the option to tactically retreat, regroup, and reengage without completely breaking the game. Don't like it? L2P or lower the difficulty.

For one weve been over this. The lack of healing does not make the diffiuclty any more or less. Saying its too easy with healing spells is just a lazy excuse to get out of having healing magic in the game. Really want a challenge, put it nightmare and never have or use any shields or barriers, act like they arent even in the game. Just stick to potions and heals. Then when your done with that, tell me how much more enjoyable it is. Ok? Because to your reasoning as long as its more challenging its more fun. So you should have a blast with no barriers! lol

You can gimp yourself in game all you want if you want a challenge. I cant add things to the game that were taken away from me.

Besides who are you to dictate to me what I find fun?

I find being a healer and a buffer fun. I find potions boring and never really used them even in origins. Just because you dont find it fun, should that give you the right to dictate how I play the game? This is not a MMO, its not a class balancing issue. Its a freedom of choice issue. This is a single player game, dont like healing, dont use it. Its simple, but dont deny me from using it if thats what I enjoy.

 

Thibax

 

In order to play any of the DA games, you really need a tank and a healer. In DA:O Wynne is the only one that starts out with Spirit Healer and Allistair makes the best overall tank as a templar. Shale is OK as a tank, but gear customization was next to non-existent. DA2 was even worse. Aveline and Anders are virtually required party members unless Hawke substitutes for one.

 

DA:I you can easily tank with Cassandra OR Blackwall; Cassandra providing party buffs and Blackwall being all but immortal. In addition, tanking is no longer mind-numbingly boring as it was in the previous 2 games. so subbing the inquisitor is not only viable, but seriously fun.

 

For mages, you are "forced" to have a mage with barrier; however barrier is the first spell in the spirit tree, so not hard to get, thus leaving the rest of your ability points open for other spells, wheres in the DA:O you had to invest multiple ability points into healing spells in order to have a decent healer. and DA2 where you either had Anders or Hawke healing. 

 

I don't know what your point was with the potions comment...I am saying that restricting potions is good. Better to have interesting and usable defensive abilities than a ton of potions with virtually no cooldown. 

I disagree with this whole idea of NEEDing a healer in any game.

People say how barriers and potions are so much better than healers with one hand, and then with the other say how they felt they NEEDED to have a healer in the other games. Thats funny cause what exactly does this game do thats any different that the others didnt do. They both had potions, heck DAO was even better in that regard because you werent limited to a certain amount like you are in DAI. You had shields and barriers as well. Remember Rock armor, Mage shield, heroic defense, etc etc. They just had different names. If people love the whole idea of no healing magic they could have played that way in the other games as well. There was no NEED to bring a healer. You CHOSE to bring one.

 

 

Not to mention for the last time: We are talking about the main character here. If you dont make a healing mage, guess what, healing will never be in your game, at all.

 

 

See how that works!!

[saladinbob]

I absolutely 100% disagree with this.

 

The reason healing magic was removed is to better balance the game. (see this article for more) Adding in healing magic and/or out of combat healing makes the game more like DA2 where the focus was on individual encounters. In order to make this challenging the encounters had to take much longer (hence the waves of teleporting enemies). Each encounter was an isolated event where you either survived or you didn't, once completed you continue on as if nothing had happened. 

 

In DA:I its not the encounter that's important, but the mission. The focus is on a series of encounters which forces you to actually use your abilities more effectively (fun) instead of relying on potions and cheap healing spells (boring). I remember in DA:O being essentially forced into having Wynne in the party or spending ridiculous amounts of gold on healing potions. Option A reduces your party choices even further (must have tank + healer + rogue) which meant that I was running Hero, Alistair / Shale, Wynne, and Liliana / Zevran. Not a lot of choice there. Option B is even worse since relying on potions is extremely cheap and unimaginative.

 

It is also slightly more realistic. Unless your name is Logan, and you have a metal skeleton, your body should not be healing wounds when there is no one actively hitting you. Now you either have to learn to use your abilities more effectively to play at higher difficulties. It also allows players the option to tactically retreat, regroup, and reengage without completely breaking the game. Don't like it? L2P or lower the difficulty.

 

You can disagree all you like, as is your right, but the question you've not answered is simply what is it going to cost you to restore healing in a new, improved and balanced magic system? If you don't want to use it and you're not forced to use it then how does it affect your game play? This thread is not asking for Healing Magic to be restored for the sake of it, we're asking for a balanced system that provides a more elegant solution to the problem to be provided to those of us who prefer to play as a Healer than run around like hippies picking flowers to heal ourselves.

 

The other thing I've been meaning to bring up is it's not just Mages where Magic is dumbed down. Remember Templars in Origins? Templars in Origins where a highly strategic specialisation, being able to stun mages, strip away their mana reserves, remove all disabling effects from party members as well as being able to reduce mana pools on strike with their weapons? Now the Templar specialisation is a collection of increased damage dealing abilities. I'm not saying they're all bad, just that they're not very strategic in their application.

[In Exile]

Thibax

In order to play any of the DA games, you really need a tank and a healer. In DA:O Wynne is the only one that starts out with Spirit Healer and Allistair makes the best overall tank as a templar. Shale is OK as a tank, but gear customization was next to non-existent. DA2 was even worse. Aveline and Anders are virtually required party members unless Hawke substitutes for one.

DA:I you can easily tank with Cassandra OR Blackwall; Cassandra providing party buffs and Blackwall being all but immortal. In addition, tanking is no longer mind-numbingly boring as it was in the previous 2 games. so subbing the inquisitor is not only viable, but seriously fun.

For mages, you are "forced" to have a mage with barrier; however barrier is the first spell in the spirit tree, so not hard to get, thus leaving the rest of your ability points open for other spells, wheres in the DA:O you had to invest multiple ability points into healing spells in order to have a decent healer. and DA2 where you either had Anders or Hawke healing.

I don't know what your point was with the potions comment...I am saying that restricting potions is good. Better to have interesting and usable defensive abilities than a ton of potions with virtually no cooldown.

You absolutely do not need a tank in DAO. A healer is sort of touch and go because you have basically infinite potions by the mid game.

[eyezonlyii]

I was going to post this (among other things) in a super long tldr in another thread, but I think I'll try it here first.

 

As someone who played healer in the first two games, I thought initially that I would miss the craft. What I found out after playing it, is I do miss it, but not nearly as much, nor for the reasons I thought I would. Basically, I miss it only because there are so many other ways to get health back, that it makes me scratch my head. That and things like potions being able to instantly heal you to full health being lore friendly, but magic being a near surgical thing is also lore friendly. How does this liquid accomplish what a mage cannot?

 

But aside from that, I can see why it was removed:

 

1. Lore- healing magic unless done by a spirit healer is supposed to be exhausting and require time and effort.

2. Gameplay- balancing issues as explained in another thread. in the other games, they had to plan for infinite health/mana, now they do not

3. Morality- as others have brought up, would you really want someone with you who wold rather patch you up AFTER that near fatal blow, or someone who would protect you from that blow in the first place?

 

Now my suggestions (with no development experience at all) would be to first rename the spirit tree, as there are all of two spells that mention spirits I believe. Secondly, I would remove the revive spell, and change the lifeward to primary effect with a passive 10-15 sec regen as the upgrade (I would also switch haste and resurgence on the knight enchanter and necromancer, but that is a different point). I do this because it would seem that rezzing someone should be more strenuous than just granting them a watchful spirit or what have you. Lastly I would change the way barrier works. I would keep the primary the same, but have the upgrade be something to the effect of detonating your barrier (a la Mass Effect) would sacrifice your remaining barrier mana and multiply the two. Teammates get a fraction of their health restored based on the number of teammates in range (about the area of the current revive). Essentially if barrier times mana equals x, and there are 2 teammates in the area, the amount of health restored would be x/3, Detonating your barrier would not only consume your barrier, it would also consume mana and slow mana regen for a given time. In my mind, this would allow healing without it being a "spam" spell if you will. 

[shadownian]

I was going to post this (among other things) in a super long tldr in another thread, but I think I'll try it here first.

 

As someone who played healer in the first two games, I thought initially that I would miss the craft. What I found out after playing it, is I do miss it, but not nearly as much, nor for the reasons I thought I would. Basically, I miss it only because there are so many other ways to get health back, that it makes me scratch my head. That and things like potions being able to instantly heal you to full health being lore friendly, but magic being a near surgical thing is also lore friendly. How does this liquid accomplish what a mage cannot?

 

But aside from that, I can see why it was removed:

 

1. Lore- healing magic unless done by a spirit healer is supposed to be exhausting and require time and effort.

2. Gameplay- balancing issues as explained in another thread. in the other games, they had to plan for infinite health/mana, now they do not

3. Morality- as others have brought up, would you really want someone with you who wold rather patch you up AFTER that near fatal blow, or someone who would protect you from that blow in the first place?

 

Now my suggestions (with no development experience at all) would be to first rename the spirit tree, as there are all of two spells that mention spirits I believe. Secondly, I would remove the revive spell, and change the lifeward to primary effect with a passive 10-15 sec regen as the upgrade (I would also switch haste and resurgence on the knight enchanter and necromancer, but that is a different point). I do this because it would seem that rezzing someone should be more strenuous than just granting them a watchful spirit or what have you. Lastly I would change the way barrier works. I would keep the primary the same, but have the upgrade be something to the effect of detonating your barrier (a la Mass Effect) would sacrifice your remaining barrier mana and multiply the two. Teammates get a fraction of their health restored based on the number of teammates in range (about the area of the current revive). Essentially if barrier times mana equals x, and there are 2 teammates in the area, the amount of health restored would be x/3, Detonating your barrier would not only consume your barrier, it would also consume mana and slow mana regen for a given time. In my mind, this would allow healing without it being a "spam" spell if you will. 

This is a good post, and I appreciate all the time and thought you put into it.

 

Personally though, I dont want more of what we have now, where what little healing we have is some sort of side effect of something else. A by product.

People can say having a normal healer would be just a spam thing with no thought or make the game too easy or what have you, but I dont agree.

 

As far as your points....

Lore-OK, in lore healing takes time. This i true. But you cant be out and about and have some sort of healing mini game where you sit there for 5 mins or an hour hovering your hands over a companions wounds. Lol. Like you said, if a potion can miraculously heal you like nothing ever happened, and it works for gameplay even though it doesnt make sense, why cant mages do the same. Ya it might not make sense, but it works. It still is a game after all. If you want to try to keep it lined up with the lore, you could keep it to just revives and heals over time. Heck you could throw a HOT on somebody right when you jump into battle and call it a preventative mesure just like the barriers...lol

 

Gameplay Balancing- Im sorry but this is a lazy excuse. Not on your part but on the devs. They didnt want to have to figure it out and make it work, it was just easier to get rid of it and blame it on balancing issues. If they wanted they could have had it in game, they just choice not to. It also has nothing to do with the idea that its too easy or because, as Bioware stated, players use to have a bunch of healers that couldnt die in DAO and broke the game. We are not talking about a bunch of healers here. Were not talking about 2 healers, just one. Your main character. And if you choose not to use healing magic, youll never know the difference in game.

 

Morality- Now this is stretching it...alot. You know people are grasping at straws when they pull something like this out...lol. Are you going to get mad at your doctor when you get sick or hurt because he didnt tell you to cover yourself in padding to keep you safe before hand? No, your just happy somebody is there to help and get you back on your feet. And when you think of it in game, say a warrior gets hurt, you think they are going to get mad at a mage for not taking the nit for them? No, thats what they do, if anything a warrior will jump in front of the mage to protect them and take the hit for them. Especially if he knew that the mage was a healer and could fix em up after anyway. This is just another version of that same argument of preventative, or reactionary magic. Some people like to spam barriers to keep their people from dying, some like to heal to keep their people from dying. There is no difference but when the spell is cast.

 

But this kind of thing is what i mean when I say that people dont care if a warrior or rogue gets a new ability, but when its a mage its, omg the end of the world...lol

Putting healing magic in the game will effect nothing, especially for those who dont like it. Because they never have to play the game with healing magic in it.

[eyezonlyii]

But the thing is, I don't think Gameplay is a lazy excuse.I think after two games they realized that the combination of healing magic plus nigh unlimited potions made for designing encounters come down to (as explained): how hard can we hit the player and/or how can we keep the player from healing? From what I read on here, many people didn't like the latter so much (being CC'd in DA2) so they opted to change the former. Limited potions was one thing, and removing healing was the other. However, with the change in what lyrium potions do (amplify magic power instead of restoring mana), and the fact that everyone has such small mana/stamina pools, if they had increased the mana cost of a heal spell, while also increasing the cooldown, it may have worked.

 

And when I think about it,healing hasn't really been removed anyway. In each of the previous games you had a revive spell, a one target heal spell and a group heal. In Origins, you had a mana/stamina regen and two health regen spells, though one was a sustained spell. That's it. In DA:I, the mana/stamina regen is on a  passive in barrier, you have lifeward tacked on revive, and you have a separate revive/heal in a focus in a specialization. All the healing is there, it's just not able to be repeatedly cast as before. Which goes on to the lore part of the game, as they removed spirit healer. About the morality, sure a warrior wouldn't be mad if he was healed after a blow, but your analogy is kinda flawed. It's more like you go to the doctor because you got malaria, and then you find out that there was a vaccine just sitting on his desk that he never told you about, nor gave to you. So sure, he can fix you up with some medicine, but you wouldn't be upset that he didn't try to prevent you from getting sick in the first place? To offer more RL evidence, it's been shown that preventative medicine costs both a patient and society less than fixing the problem afterwards. Basically it's cheaper to stay healthy, than to be fixed back up afterward. Which, as I typed made me realize that is exactly what Bioware did. They made the healing spell outrageously expensive (using focus) as an incentive to keep your people from needing to be healed by keeping those barriers up. 

 

EDIT: Knight Enchanter's Resurgence has a regen component to it as well, so now in all actuality EVERY heal spell from the previous games is represented.

[Taura-Tierno]

I absolutely 100% disagree with this.

 

The reason healing magic was removed is to better balance the game. (see this article for more) Adding in healing magic and/or out of combat healing makes the game more like DA2 where the focus was on individual encounters. In order to make this challenging the encounters had to take much longer (hence the waves of teleporting enemies). Each encounter was an isolated event where you either survived or you didn't, once completed you continue on as if nothing had happened. 

 

In DA:I its not the encounter that's important, but the mission. The focus is on a series of encounters which forces you to actually use your abilities more effectively (fun) instead of relying on potions and cheap healing spells (boring). I remember in DA:O being essentially forced into having Wynne in the party or spending ridiculous amounts of gold on healing potions. Option A reduces your party choices even further (must have tank + healer + rogue) which meant that I was running Hero, Alistair / Shale, Wynne, and Liliana / Zevran. Not a lot of choice there. Option B is even worse since relying on potions is extremely cheap and unimaginative.

 

It is also slightly more realistic. Unless your name is Logan, and you have a metal skeleton, your body should not be healing wounds when there is no one actively hitting you. Now you either have to learn to use your abilities more effectively to play at higher difficulties. It also allows players the option to tactically retreat, regroup, and reengage without completely breaking the game. Don't like it? L2P or lower the difficulty.

I agree completely. 

Also, there's healing in the game already, with revival and the Knight-Enchanter's focus ability. So it's not like healing does not exist ...

[Bladenite1481]

But the thing is, I don't think Gameplay is a lazy excuse.I think after two games they realized that the combination of healing magic plus nigh unlimited potions made for designing encounters come down to (as explained): how hard can we hit the player and/or how can we keep the player from healing? From what I read on here, many people didn't like the latter so much (being CC'd in DA2) so they opted to change the former. Limited potions was one thing, and removing healing was the other. However, with the change in what lyrium potions do (amplify magic power instead of restoring mana), and the fact that everyone has such small mana/stamina pools, if they had increased the mana cost of a heal spell, while also increasing the cooldown, it may have worked.

 

And when I think about it,healing hasn't really been removed anyway. In each of the previous games you had a revive spell, a one target heal spell and a group heal. In Origins, you had a mana/stamina regen and two health regen spells, though one was a sustained spell. That's it. In DA:I, the mana/stamina regen is on a  passive in barrier, you have lifeward tacked on revive, and you have a separate revive/heal in a focus in a specialization. All the healing is there, it's just not able to be repeatedly cast as before. Which goes on to the lore part of the game, as they removed spirit healer. About the morality, sure a warrior wouldn't be mad if he was healed after a blow, but your analogy is kinda flawed. It's more like you go to the doctor because you got malaria, and then you find out that there was a vaccine just sitting on his desk that he never told you about, nor gave to you. So sure, he can fix you up with some medicine, but you wouldn't be upset that he didn't try to prevent you from getting sick in the first place? To offer more RL evidence, it's been shown that preventative medicine costs both a patient and society less than fixing the problem afterwards. Basically it's cheaper to stay healthy, than to be fixed back up afterward. Which, as I typed made me realize that is exactly what Bioware did. They made the healing spell outrageously expensive (using focus) as an incentive to keep your people from needing to be healed by keeping those barriers up. 

 

EDIT: Knight Enchanter's Resurgence has a regen component to it as well, so now in all actuality EVERY heal spell from the previous games is represented.

Or they could make the game more difficult by working on their abysmal AI instead..and then you know, transfer that to the companions so I don't have to baby sit them on nightmare..

[samuelkaine]

The Healing spells in DA:O and DA:2 always broke the lore. Healing, as we see when we meet Anders in his clinic, is a time consuming and draining process. That we can do it at all in those two games is partially gameplay story segregation (like no-one mentioning all that blood magic) compounded by the fact our main healers in both games are exceptional people who have their healing boosted by spirits. There is no freaking way Hawke should be able to access that speciality without some major quest arc. 

 

Healing magic has not disappeared from Thedas, it is exactly where it always was in lore. Hence why, in gameplay, it either requires mastery of the Spirit tree for revive, or extreme focus as a KE. 

 

Now if someone can cite a single in-lore example of someone not possessed by spirits healing broken bones and torn flesh during an ongoing fight, I'll retract that. 

[MisterBotti]

Easy difficulty is always there for you.

[saladinbob]

That has to be a joke because DAO was a joke. Even if you put aside the crappy UI on PC in DAI that IMO ups the difficulty a lot, mages were so broken in DAO that they turned the game into the easiest thing in the world to faceroll.

The only source of difficulty in DAO came from intentional choices to gimp yourself either by not using certain classes or builds.

 

Origins was a more challenging game than Inquisition is so if Healers where used true to the spirit of their design then the game was by no means easy. Nor are we asking for Healing to be put in willy nilly, we're asking for a balanced system that allows for a Healing mage to exist. As for DAO being a joke, the overwhelming majority of people would disagree with you because the overwhelming majority of people consider it the best in the series. Really if your idea of contribution is not to read any of the previous posts and formulate your own balanced view point then you really are doing your opinions a disservice. 

 

 

The Healing spells in DA:O and DA:2 always broke the lore. Healing, as we see when we meet Anders in his clinic, is a time consuming and draining process. That we can do it at all in those two games is partially gameplay story segregation (like no-one mentioning all that blood magic) compounded by the fact our main healers in both games are exceptional people who have their healing boosted by spirits. There is no freaking way Hawke should be able to access that speciality without some major quest arc. 

 

Healing magic has not disappeared from Thedas, it is exactly where it always was in lore. Hence why, in gameplay, it either requires mastery of the Spirit tree for revive, or extreme focus as a KE. 

 

Now if someone can cite a single in-lore example of someone not possessed by spirits healing broken bones and torn flesh during an ongoing fight, I'll retract that. 

 

 

This again? Lore according to whom? All on screen healing happened in a matter of seconds. Nowhere in any of the books does it go in to detail about the length of time it takes for a Mage Healer to heal. So where is this purported Lore that says it takes a long time? Again, for the sake of those who clearly have difficulty reading - we want a balanced Mage Healer. Emphasis on balanced.