And doesn't Sera get upset at how they're treated in the Winter's Palace?
Not enough to want to help them in any sort of long-term way.
One book I was reading, American Sniper, has the author condemning Iraqi insurgents for hiding behind civilians in one breath and saying that he doesn't give a **** (his words) about the Iraqi population in another. This seems similar.
Briala tries to improve the life of City elves. In the ending, all the elf's life in Orlais was better cause of Briala if she was put into power. Briala also stated that her goal is to improve city elf's life, but if you put Briala into power, Sera would still disapprove of that decision. She would give approval if you let either humans to become ruler instead. Interestingly enough, they're both nobles and don't care about the little people, the things that she's supposedly fighting against.
Briala's goals are noble, but her methods endanger the lives of the people working directly under her and have prolonged a war that has made everyone's life miserable for two years. Two years of people being rounded up and pressganged into military service or sold into slavery. Two years of people going hungry because trade routes are compromised during the war and what is getting through is being claimed by either army. Two years of villages being destroyed because they're caught in between opposing armies.
There are plenty of reasons to disapprove of Briala's actions even if her goals are noble.
Which isn't to say I disagree with the point; I think Sera is more than a little bit racist. But not agreeing with Briala is hardly proof of that.
Briala's goals are noble, but her methods endanger the lives of the people working directly under her and have prolonged a war that has made everyone's life miserable for two years. Two years of people being rounded up and pressganged into military service or sold into slavery. Two years of people going hungry because trade routes are compromised during the war and what is getting through is being claimed by either army. Two years of villages being destroyed because they're caught in between opposing armies.
There are plenty of reasons to disapprove of Briala's actions even if her goals are noble.
Which isn't to say I disagree with the point; I think Sera is more than a little bit racist. But not agreeing with Briala is hardly proof of that.
None of which helps the fact that Celene and Gaspard have done more, done worse, and won't help the elves at all if they don't have to.
No, if you choose the dwarf/qunari equivalents of "I'm an elf, but I'm here for everyone" upon becoming Inquisitor, she's fine but disapproves of the elf one.
She has an issue with elves.
I don't mind that that's an aspect of her character per se. I mind that people deny it.
I didn't say she didn't have an issue with elves. I was just saying that in general, Sera is against any group that places themselves above everyone else - elves included.
I think that's why she's especially resentful of a Dalish Inquisitor who really plays up the Dalish card. Dalish (though not all, obviously) call themselves the "true elves" and can easily turn away their own kind for not fitting into their definition of what makes a "true elf".
None of which helps the fact that Celene and Gaspard have done more, done worse, and won't help the elves at all if they don't have to.
None of which helps the fact that Celene and Gaspard have done more, done worse, and won't help the elves at all if they don't have to.
I don't disagree, but one isn't required to support someone because they're the lesser of three evils. Both times I've talked to Sera after the Winter Palace, she's condemned all three of them, which is a perfectly fair opinion.
And doesn't Sera get upset at how they're treated in the Winter's Palace?
I didn't say she didn't have an issue with elves. I was just saying that in general, Sera is against any group that places themselves above everyone else - elves included.
Except Andrastians, as she declares herself above those who worship the Creators.
I don't disagree, but one isn't required to support someone because they're the lesser of three evils. Both times I've talked to Sera after the Winter Palace, she's condemned all three of them, which is a perfectly fair opinion.
Condemning Briala moreso, however, is not. And condemning her at all is really just another example of her shortsightedness.
Except Andrastians, as she declares herself above those who worship the Creators.
Condemning Briala moreso, however, is not. And condemning her at all is really just another example of her shortsightedness.
Short sightedness is kind of the cornerstone of Sera's character; she was built and promoted on the concept that she opposes decisions that harm the masses in pursuit of some vaguely defined greater good.
She's somewhat hypocritical in that regard when it comes to her own actions with the Red Jenny network, which you can call her on. But in regards to Briala, it's a perfectly fair criticism, given that the woman's plan was "prolong war and suffering, somehow elves will profit from this", with no real clear or defined idea of how to actually achieve that.
For what it's worth, I wouldn't call myself a fan of Sera's. I appreciate the view point she brings to the game, and find her humorous on occasion, but also find her annoying, and I detest how she actively wallows in her ignorance.
I just don't think "She opposes Briala" is adequate reason to denounce her.
Except Andrastians, as she declares herself above those who worship the Creators.
Does she identify as Andrastian? I didn't catch that with my conversations with her, although I do remember her saying that the Maker and the Creators can't both exist.
If what you say is true, though, then that's a flawed manner of thinking on her part.
and I detest how she actively wallows in her ignorance.
Not racist, misguided and ignorant. Put this into a real life situation:
You are a white person. You have never spoken to a black person, never been around black people, never seen any black people in your entire life. The news says Muslim Jihadists are blahblahblah. Immediately, you are going to be wary of everyone who looks like a Muslim, and not being racist here, is going to be most black people. You don't understand that not every black person is the same as the next. You don't know that Muslim's include white people. You are going to be ignorant whether you like it or not. This is not racism, it is misinformation.
This is the case with Sera. She hasn't got any good experiences with Elves, City or Dalish. So her opinion and attitude to Elves in general is ignorant. If she had been brought up by an Elvish woman instead of a human one, she would have a more diverse opinion because she would know that not all Elves are the same. All she knows of the Elves is a little bit about the race, their beliefs, what they are striving for but nothing about the actual people. In time, hopefully her opinion would change as she sees more of the world and the people that walk it.
You say this like it's a negative thing.
From a meta stand point, it isn't. It's an intentional character flaw, which is fine. All the characters are flawed in their own ways.
From a personal stand point, it isn't a trait I find endearing.
Not racist, misguided and ignorant. Put this into a real life situation:
You are a white person. You have never spoken to a black person, never been around black people, never seen any black people in your entire life. The news says Muslim Jihadists are blahblahblah. Immediately, you are going to be wary of everyone who looks like a Muslim, and not being racist here, is going to be most black people. You don't understand that not every black person is the same as the next. You don't know that Muslim's include white people. You are going to be ignorant whether you like it or not. This is not racism, it is misinformation.
This is the case with Sera. She hasn't got any good experiences with Elves, City or Dalish. So her opinion and attitude to Elves in general is ignorant. If she had been brought up by an Elvish woman instead of a human one, she would have a more diverse opinion because she would know that not all Elves are the same. All she knows of the Elves is a little bit about the race, their beliefs, what they are striving for but nothing about the actual people. In time, hopefully her opinion would change as she sees more of the world and the people that walk it.
I would say this hypothetical person, much like Sera, is racist. That doesn't mean she wants to annihilate all elves. Just being racist is not necessarily the worst thing in the world to be. It's not as bad as being an unrepentant murderer, or, in fact, a repentant murderer, who we've had as companions in this franchise. But it's not great either.
I dunno, she's a flawed character, like all of them in this game. I like Dorian, but I don't deny that he's an apologist for slavery. It's probably true that some people are more unforgiving of Sera because they find her annoying, though. (guilty!)
sera just doesnt like the tim tebows of the elves, you know the preachy ones who wont shut up
Thinking about it, I feel like Sera embrace the no label thing just to deal with the fact that she doesn't have to remind herself that she's an elf.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
I just think Sera wants to live in the present, have fun, and prefers individuals to "culture".
She cares about all "people" people. Not specific types of them. If you didn't already understand that from her Red Jenny background, then I don't know what to say. She also gives approval, when you help normal people with little tasks, elves or not.
Go meet an actual racist (then wash yourself afterwards). They don't do any of this.
I just think Sera wants to live in the present, have fun, and prefers individuals to "culture".
She cares about all "people" people. Not specific types of them. If you didn't already understand that from her Red Jenny background, then I don't know what to say. She also gives approval, when you help normal people with little tasks, elves or not.
Go meet an actual racist (then wash yourself afterwards). They don't do any of this.
As the discussion already said, she gives disapproval if you support elves. Like fighting for the inquisition in the name of elf but not disapproval when fighting in the name of dwarves or mages. She has problems with being an elf and I find "people are just people" to be just a way for her to not face the fact that she's an elf herself. I meet plenty of racist in real life, and many forms of racism are not outward but very internal and subtle, sometimes it's even on subconscious level.
I think in general when it comes to them big choices, you should be able to look over your shoulder and say 'opinions?' to your companions. I like how varied their approval is but I often wished I could have talked with them about it. I get why she wouldn't support Briala, but it never really tells you why she would support Gaspard. Can I add: She doesn't approve or disapprove of Celene/Briala, just Gaspard/Briala. (sorry if this was already mentioned)
Guest_StreetMagic_*
As the discussion already said, she gives disapproval if you support elves. Like fighting for the inquisition in the name of elf but not disapproval when fighting in the name of dwarves or mages. She has problems with being an elf and I find "people are just people" to be just a way for her to not face the fact that she's an elf herself. I meet plenty of racist in real life, and many forms of racism are not outward but very internal and subtle, sometimes it's even on subconscious level.
I see it more in a less negative light.
It isn't that she can't face she's an elf. She just wants to be "Sera".
Everything about her is individualistic and free flowing. It isn't just these big issues. Look at how she talks about her bow training. She's self taught and doesn't care to discuss it. She just "does" it. End of story. She's a person of the present. She lives in action. Not ponders on history or the "correct" expression of something.
None of which helps the fact that Celene and Gaspard have done more, done worse, and won't help the elves at all if they don't have to.
I wonder if Sera knows their crimes? I went in with full knowledge from the book, so I knew I wanted Celene to rule alone, but I kind forgot to take in how much we learn from the events of the book in the game.
This is Sera. An Elf Human Supremacist. Just replace everything with [elf] and [human]. We all know where each word goes.
I wonder if Sera knows their crimes? I went in with full knowledge from the book, so I knew I wanted Celene to rule alone, but I kind forgot to take in how much we learn from the events of the book in the game.
Sera's in a decent enough position to be well informed.
Sera's in a decent enough position to be well informed.
I meant the entire group in general though, in that I can't remember what we learned in the game because I had read the book before-hand.
Retour en haut