What about Merrill's Keeper? I don't remember correctly but the demon was inside of her? And then Zathrian. He had a connection to that spirit? Didn't he?
To me there isn't anything weird that Mythal went to a human. Their situation was similar. Other ancient elves most likely weren't in a similar situation. Besides nobody would have suspected that there was elven goddess inside human 
The demon was destroying Marethari as I recall. He made that spirit which... hmmmm so elves can make spirits into physical beings.
I mean that's true. It was rather sneaky in that sense but who is really going to start questioning an elf either? I still find it odd she didn't go Elvhen but then again maybe she had to worry about rejection if they happened to be aligned with a certain god. Maybe she couldn't trust any of them. I understand why she chose a female but she had female slaves in the temple. Why not take one of them? They'd be more than willing. Flemeth must have been convincing then.
Perhaps spirits can go into either humans or modern elves, because they have been sundered. Perhaps, since the Elvhen were basically spirits who created bodies for themselves, maybe there isn't enough room there for another spirit?
Then again, there could be spirits for all! Abominations galore! It might just be the act of surrendering oneself to the spirit that is important, and nothing else matters.
When Mr. Gaider created this world, I think he kind of melded a lot of real life creation stories together. Edgar Cayce has written that humans were created when the spirit self went into the earth and created a body from it. I think that was in the Atlantis book. Anyway, it makes sense to me since skin tones are pretty much the colors of different dirt.
Which makes me think that the earthly Thedas was created by the Titans, and the spirits were created by the Fade. When the two met, elven/human life happened. In our world, it is a symbiotic relationship, but in Thedas, it's full of trouble since both sides want to rule completely.
Hmmmmmm. Making me think. See that's what I was thinking. Because the Elvhen have more of a spiritual presence inside of them so adding another would just be too much. It would actually destroy both spirits or maybe it would change their nature altogether. Like imagine Mythal's body was inhabited by a spirit of justice. If you then try and add a spirit of purpose, that would get messed up. You have two pure spirits fighting for dominance.
But what if... I'm thinking of genitals again here... okay what if all Elvhen were spirits that created or inhabited a body that didn't have the pure spirit inside. They could never be inhabited by another spirit without creating some major conflict, whereas humans are different in some way. Their spirit is weaker, maybe like the branch of a tree as opposed to the tree itself. So it's easier to for the Elvhen to take over that being or coexist.
Don't get me started on clay!!! Don't make go there. 
I did get the impression that titans rule the earth and the Elvhen the Fade. So sky and earth. At some point the the spirits wanted to be more than energy? So when they became physical (dragons?) it started a fight for dominance. No I really haven't been on the elfroot tonight. But if I were, I'd so share some with you
I'm going to bed... no I really am but I ran across this like three seconds ago and it needs posting. It's the most beautiful and saddest thing I think I've ever seen in a DA game. I have no idea why. It just is. So there. Shushies. Sleepy time.
Babelas I think one possibility could be that Mythal couldn't go into ancient elves like you said or it could be like Tielis said that spirits could go into either modern elves or humans. I think they are both possibilities.
Anyway if I think about Mythal there isn't that many choices for her. I don't think she could get help from an ancient elf whose goddess isn't Mythal or that person's god isn't Solas. I'm not even sure would Solas' people help her. Anyway because she was slain I think most of her followers were killed or they become slaves. Maybe there are other followers like Abelas and the sentinels. But I doubt that there is many of them.
So why didn't Mythal go to Abelas? Or why she didn't stay in the fade and give orders from there? If we think about Abelas (and I like to do that 
) he would have to be willing. Would he be? I'm not sure because in the end he is a slave. He also has his duty and the rest of them have also their duties. It would be better for her to go to somebody else. Nobody can connect her to elves so she's quite safe. She's also free to do whatever she likes and nothing bad happens ot elves.
By the way there are two sides in Mythal. Loving and the vengeful. Maybe she consist of two spirits that have merged into one?
Even though Mythal let Solas to kill her I still consider that as actual killing. He didn't see any other choice in that moment and Mythal knew that and she let that happen so that he could get her power. But before that she had send her godhood to Morrigan. I have been thinking that Mythal apologized because she knew what Solas was going to do. However her reason for doing that could have been as you said and she apoloziged because she was going to stop him later. Maybe he knows that. Not sure about that though.
I think it might be that Abelas doesn't know what happened to Mythal because Inky who drank from the well didn't know that she/he was bound to Mythal until she/he met her. But if he knew that Solas had killed her I don't think Abelas would approve.
To me Abelas didn't seem to be the kind of man who believes in Mythal like people believe in Maker. He knows that there is a prize for her favours and he knew that he was a slave and that the one who drank from the well would become one as well.
True, I just feel they are in the middle of their own schemes and dragging everyone into it lol
Yeah I agree about Abelas, but I do wonder if Solas is stuck with a similar fate? If you drink from the Well he talks as if he knows how it is to be bound to someone, though he never outright states it. I wonder if he is bound or he saw Mythal's slaves and did not like how she treated them? I somehow doubt she was horrible though because if you ask her if you are her servant now, she looks so sad and asks if you really feel that way.
True, I just feel they are in the middle of their own schemes and dragging everyone into it lol
Yeah I agree about Abelas, but I do wonder if Solas is stuck with a similar fate? If you drink from the Well he talks as if he knows how it is to be bound to someone, though he never outright states it. I wonder if he is bound or he saw Mythal's slaves and did not like how she treated them? I somehow doubt she was horrible though because if you ask her if you are her servant now, she looks so sad and asks if you really feel that way.
Trespasser spoilers:
Trespasser spoilers:
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Spoiler
Hi all! *waves hand*
Re: Mythal choosing Flemeth, I think it was probably because of emotions; we know that spirits are drawn to them, and if Mythal was wandering in wisp form it seems likely that she was attracted to Flemeth's strong feelings of betrayal and desire for revenge. She also probably felt that Flemeth was strong and intelligent, and at that point I guess Mythal didn't care whether her vessel was elven or human, just that it could be able to do what was required to carry her plans of revenge forward.
Hi all! *waves hand*
Re: Mythal choosing Flemeth, I think it was probably because of emotions; we know that spirits are drawn to them, and if Mythal was wandering in wisp form it seems likely that she was attracted to Flemeth's strong feelings of betrayal and desire for revenge. She also probably felt that Flemeth was strong and intelligent, and at that point I guess Mythal didn't care whether her vessel was elven or human, just that it could be able to do what was required to carry her plans of revenge forward.
Spoiler
Hello!
Very well said!
Hello Vorathrad! Nice to see you again 
Sometimes I wonder if Solas actually belonged to Andruil. I say this because of that codex about Andruil and Anaris. Basically, she tells Solas he will please her for a year in bed as punishment. Would Andruil do that if Solas had belonged to Mythal? That would risk making Mythal angry. Every one just assumes Solas belonged to Mythal but I'm not so certain. I'm also not certain that Mythal ever had slaves. I suspect she did to play along with the other Evanuris and then supported Solas's rebellion in secret but then I wonder if elves such as Abelas joined her willingly. Something about Abelas, at times, makes me think he was part of the elvhen nobility. It's the way he acts, I think. It doesn't feel very slave-like. Either way, he's very good at ordering people around
Babelas that's very interesting theory. I think it makes sense.
I think the situation with Abelas and the sentinels are interesting. They wear slave markings and they are not free. So basically they are slaves. However there can be different slaves like there are in Tevinter. Dorian tells the Inky that sometimes people will agree to be slaves because then their lifes are better than if they would be free. Maybe the situation with sentinels are something similar. They gain more when they become sentinels. They lose their freedom but they gain purpose and I believe that being Mythal's sentinel mean better life for them as well. What comes to Abelas I think he might belong to the nobility like Babelas suspected. Maybe that's the reason why he is the leader of the sentinels?
We know Mythal had slaves because of her vallaslin, which all the sentinels wear.
But were they willing slaves? Elvhen who loved the idea of s&m Mythal? You never know
I think Abelas just liked leather personally. He couldn't resist Mythal's leathery dress (the one Flemeth wears) I'm certain of it.
Well, I know I can't resist Flemeth's leathery dress, so I'm with Abelas on this one (really, if Mythal sets up a bra shop, she can have all my money; that state of the bosom after millenia!)
Regarding Abelas and the sentinels, I agree with Silent that there were probably different types of lives like in Tevinter. I'm sure it's not the same being the personal assistant of a powerful magister than the cook of a minor mage that doesn't even belong to the Magisterium. It must have been the same in Arlathan. Probably as in Tevinter, some elves even went into slavery willingly to achieve a better social position. Abelas and the sentinels (it still sounds like a fabulous band's name ) must have been pretty high in the slaves rank. They were priests of Mythal and guardians of her main temple (I assume there were others scattered through Thedas but the one in the Arbor Wilds was the main one, much as it was the case with Greek gods) it's likely that, even being bound to Mythal, they had much more prestige than say, a free poor merchant; once again, as it's the case in Tevinter.
It feels so good to be back a'theorizing with you 
Well, I know I can't resist Flemeth's leathery dress, so I'm with Abelas on this one
Spoiler
Regarding Abelas and the sentinels, I agree with Silent that there were probably different types of lives like in Tevinter. I'm sure it's not the same being the personal assistant of a powerful magister than the cook of a minor mage that doesn't even belong to the Magisterium. It must have been the same in Arlathan. Probably as in Tevinter, some elves even went into slavery willingly to achieve a better social position. Abelas and the sentinels (it still sounds like a fabulous band's name
Spoiler
It feels so good to be back a'theorizing with you
There you are! I was about to send Alchemillia out after you. She prons people to death with her smexy art I know you can see the group so I know that you know that I know what I mean by the pron.
Seriously, it's really lovely to see you again I missed you.
Abelas and the sentinels (it still sounds like a fabulous band's name ) must have been pretty high in the slaves rank.
Oh it does! LOL! That and the Kitchen Gingers. I agree. It worries me to think why Abelas was so far up the rung and who he may have stepped on to get there. Then again, it may have been that Mythal noticed talent in him (or noticed his well formed thighs and decided they needed to be front and center)
Mythal's Thongs of Praise. It's her best kept secret besides her s&m line. Magical bras that keep it real and perky. That's what I'm talking about.
Andruil ordering him to serve her in bed could also have the side effect of spiting Mythal if Solas was her guardian;
Or if Solas was the reason Mythal always had a smile in the morning. I think more and more that they were lovers. So for Andruil to demand Solas in her bed for a year would have been like a slap to Mythal's face. I seriously don't put that past Andruil at all.
I bet that the Evanuris played power games very similar to the Orlesian Game. Also I'm quite sure that for all the propaganda depicting her as the great protector and such, Mythal certainly had a very dark side. Maybe we'll see more of it in DA4, but we already had a glimpse: what she did to the dwarves, denying them the Sun (I guess it refers to forcing them to live underground and mine lyrium) seems pretty horrible.
I agree... I think that's why when Solas is at the Winter Palace it is all too familiar for him. He's seen the very same scenario play out over the ages. I am very curious to see exactly who Mythal really was, because I'll be honest, I have the whole fangirl thing going on for her at the moment. Has to be the leather or the whips... bet there were whips in the Temple of Mythal.
For some time I've believed that Tevinter and possibly the Chantry hierarchy are similar to what they had in Elvhenan. Like government being modeled on ancient governments etc. It's all throughout history so it makes sense. I'm not saying it is exactly the same, but I keep wondering if someone like Abelas was from a more prominent family, but he was expected to serve in the temple like the nobles of Ferelden and Orlais who are not firstborn are expected to serve the Chantry. Sometimes I consider that. Other times, I consider his life was actually saved by becoming Mythal's slave. It sucks no matter how you peel that apple.
Before I go to bed because Abelas and bedtime seem to be a thing... (shush... I hear the perverted thoughts from here)
by: hedgehawke
Or if Solas was the reason Mythal always had a smile in the morning. I think more and more that they were lovers. So for Andruil to demand Solas in her bed for a year would have been like a slap to Mythal's face. I seriously don't put that past Andruil at all.
Elven Glory Facial Treatment: Blind them with your radiance 
If Abelas parents were able to father those Thighs of Awesome just to send them away to the temple, ancient elves deserved to fall 
(btw that last painting is gorgeous)
Elven Glory Facial Treatment: Blind them with your radiance
If Abelas parents were able to father those Thighs of Awesome just to send them away to the temple, ancient elves deserved to fall
(btw that last painting is gorgeous)
I need tea then coherent thoughts will form... maybe.
Elven Glory Facial Treatment: Blind them with your radiance
I stopped at Elvhen Glory Facial Treatment and thought.... what is she ... oh yes of course! That's what she means. Sorry! The weirdness is winning today.
If Abelas parents were able to father those Thighs of Awesome just to send them away to the temple, ancient elves deserved to fall
That brings up thoughts of Abelas senior. Now I wonder what his father and mother were like. Stern comes to mind. Noooo they sent those thighs away to the temple because it was the best place to preserve them! His mother had foresight and knew one day someone would enter the temple and be able to appreciate those thighs the way they should be appreciated and then worship them. But no one would ever be good enough for her son! So she had Abelas dedicate himself to Mythal, because Mythal would never notice the thighs since she was all up in the Dread Wolf's dreadlocks. I got this all figured out
Yes I really liked that painting. I only wish he wasn't in his armor... like in nothing cause reasons.
Maybe Abelas was part of the nobility and he was sent to the temple to serve for some time but it was expected that he will return some day but then Mythal died and he got stuck there. One other possibility could be that Abelas was sent there so he could be safe from the war.
Maybe Abelas was part of the nobility and he was sent to the temple to serve for some time but it was expected that he will return some day but then Mythal died and he got stuck there. One other possibility could be that Abelas was sent there so he could be safe from the war.
That's a sweet thought that his parents sent him away to be safe. I like that SS.
I'm doing the thing now.
My ideal Abelas romance for DA4.
If not set in Tevinter this: My protagonist is an awesome dagger wielding city elf full of sass. The PC robs from nobles during the night to help the elves in the alienage and has a strong belief in the Maker, but it's more in line with Varric's way of living than the devout way of a priest. Your moral code tends to suffer when you are starving. Just sayin'.
Through the events of the game (whatever they may be) the PC runs into Abelas and his sentinels. I love the idea of many heated debates of Maker vs Creators. Abelas would think them insane. After telling the PC why the PC is wrong in every way possible (which the PC has heard all of the PC's life) the PC defends him physically, verbally maybe both. The PC does this simply because the PC feels it is the right thing to do. That changes his opinion of the PC because he starts to see some sort of strange justice in this woman/man. He can relate to that. He can also relate to being poor if he came from that background. (I imagine a million plus backgrounds for him so who knows) Oh and Zevran must be there because Zevran and Abelas discussions would be the funniest thing ever to happen to DA. Ever. The end. I will never apologize for thinking that ever.
If set in Tevinter.
I'm torn between being a human magister that has the power to help Abelas fulfill Mythal's wishes while trying to find a way to break the geas set on him or trying to convince Abelas what he is doing is wrong while also trying to break the geas on him. I really love the idea of my PC researching the geas in private. I don't think my PC would tell him they were researching the geas. My PC would just break the damn thing, otherwise how would you ever know if it is him saying: No don't break it or Mythal? Abelas may hate my PC afterward but at least my PC would be happy knowing he is finally free. Plus, the arguments they would have concerning history and magic would be epic. There is something endearing and humorous to me when I think of arguing with Abelas. Would be even more fun if Zevran were there to help
Arguing with Abelas. Yes Please! 
One other possibility could be that Abelas was sent there so he could be safe from the war.
Aaaawwww yes please, Bioware please do this and give the man some fluff. He deserves it, seriously.
I also agree with the thigh preservation theory, in fact it makes a lot of sense.
Oh and Zevran must be there because Zevran and Abelas discussions would be the funniest thing ever to happen to DA. Ever. The end. I will never apologize for thinking that ever.
I would pay the full game price for a 10 or 15 minute scene with Abelas, Zevran and Dorian in the same room.
I like your romance ideas, Babelas. Mine probably would be more classic, along the lines of "First he is very reserved and doesn't want to form bonds, then they figure out how to get rid of the geas so he's finally ready to give the relationship a chance as he already started to like her". Yay, go me and my imagination
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