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[BoscoBread]

I feel really torn about whether or not my fic-quisitor keeps her vallaslin or not. It's important for my purposes that she's lost her family, so I can't quite figure out whether or not she would cling to that recognition of her past or whether she was taken in by Solas' smooth talking words. I feel like I've done more thinking than actual writing for the past few days, which while not necessarily a bad thing, isn't exactly the most productive either.

I keep mine.  I have a lot of pretty complicated feelings about the vallaslin - Giton posted some really interesting thoughts on the Solas thread about it.  She referenced some writings on Maori tattoos.  Essentially it came down to "you could lose everything but you will always have those tattoos even into death".  So...feels.

[Siha]

Funny enough, my Dalish girls have always refused vallaslin to begin with.

[Caddius]

I usually go with Mythal's vallaslin. So the line of thinking was, "Um, I just met Mythal. She was awesome. Did you see how she out-snarked Morrigan? (No, wait, you scampered off the moment I started the ritual. Hmm. That's weird. Whatever.) I'm not going to let slaver elf-lords from the dawn of civilization ruin what my people have done with it. We survived Arlathan's fall. We survived the Exalted Marches. They are still the marks of our gods, and I still honor Mythal. The fact that this shade of purple perfectly complements my eyes has nothing to do with it."

My Dirthamen Lavellan, on the other hand. "Oh. Well. That's done then. Get it off. I knew I should have gone with June."

[Swevenfox]

I am still not at that part where I have to decide about the vallaslin, but personally have mixed feeling to let it go or not.

Many old cultures the tattoos are mark of adulthood and part of a heritage - and this is how I seen with the Dalish. 

 

Also it might be slave marks from the old times, but as the old times gone and the old gods are nowhere ... these elves survived a lot, they are minority and hated, hunted, molested by humans. Those who wear the marks the ones who leave behind every root and survive without having a land of their own, without support, luxury from their own strength. Nomads between lands which ruled by humans, kings and soldiers and they still live. They still survive - if for them - for their spirit the vallaslin part of their life, then it is spiritually and mentally something which brings them together, unite them and their faith.

They might be aggressive with others, afraid to loose what they have, having too few numbers to really stand against an army if they would want to burn them out - for everyone else they are minority, savages. The vallaslin unites them, makes them a family no matter how far they are, how much one forced to leave the clan (thought I find it still bs about too many mages in the Dalish thing) - since I imagine one getting theirs requires sort of maturity and they ritually making it once they are certain which god they want to cherish, essentially a serious celebration. 

 

Remove it - even if the Inquisitor cant live among the Dalish anymore with the mark and the pressure lays on their shoulder, but this is spiritually their heritage. It is something deep, something precious, something which can not be removed just like that.

 

If you decide to get it removed, you really must love Solas (or be really too damn proud to accept anything about slavery) and the following break up really can crush a lot mentally in the poor girl. 

As a player I can imagine the depth this can cause and make, but character-wise the vallaslin removal is asked before I know he will be breaking up with me. So this is really a thought decision to make - I building my character up, so my ingame decisions forming her final character so in a way I am excited to reach that part but other hand afraid of it. I not spoiled to myself to check youtube - but even if I would I have no personal feelings for it up until it is the character I forged during my game. 

 

But back to the topic, character wise the removal of the vallaslin is a very harsh move, and has very strong spiritualism behind it, and its meaning, reasons. A bound an eye cant see but the heart feels and carries along everything.

If your character built on doing everything because she must do, but trying also through this influence support her heritage whenever she can in hope she can help her blood, her Family to maybe win some merits out of this - even if she sees their flaws and the mistakes such isolation carries this decision can be fatal if not having second thoughts about it. 

 

I understand why Solas wants to see you without them, he comes from an age this was sign of slavery and he is everything which is about freedom and free thoughts. But he can not see the Family behind this of the modern times - how the vallasin changed its meaning so in my opinion removing it can hurt a lot more and ruin a lot more then it looks like at first. And def not helps the fact he breaks up right away it is done.

 

But this is another of those little details I personally dig, because this decision is big, and emotionally strong. This is a moment which can be very important in the inquisitors life and even change her entire personality after this. 

 

But it be again that I overthink small details - but this theory and thinking this deep behind a mind makes this part of the game alive to me. :>

[Abelas Forever!]

I have completed two playthroughs where I have romanced Solas. Both of my Lavellans accepted his offer to remove the vallaslin. They both were proud of being Dalish  and they both thought that their heritage was very important so they both drank from the well because it was their heritage. They couldn't let Morrigan to do it. So when they heard about the meaning of the vallaslin they both were sad but they accepted that the Dalish got its meaning wrong. So it was natural for them to get it removed. They didn't want it to be removed because they loved Solas. They wanted it to be removed because it was possible and they didn't want to wear a slave marking. I always think that Solas offers it as a gift and not because he wants to see Lavellan without it. He cares about her so much that he wants to give her its real meaning and if she wants to get it removed then he can do it. Maybe one day I will create Lavellan who will keep her vallaslin because it has meaning to her.

[Abelas Forever!]

They are around for sure. Perhaps, when they have time they can add it.

Or would it be better to create a thread to Fan fiction section of this forum and  put all the links to Ableas fan fiction there? That way they are at the same place and it is only needed to update the first post of this thread once.

[Abelas Forever!]

I am surprised there isn't a fan fiction section on the forum already. But if there isn't it might be logical to create one. It would keep it better organized. 

I mean that there is a fan fiction section in this forum. It's here http://forum.bioware...34-fan-fiction/So I was just thinking is it a good  idea to create a thread there where everyone can post a link to their Abelas fan fiction or should the links be in the first post of this thread.

[BoscoBread]

<snip>

But it be again that I overthink small details - but this theory and thinking this deep behind a mind makes this part of the game alive to me. :>

 All of this.  I am pleased it was included in the romance. It's a pretty heavy decision and holds different meaning for each player.  I like my girl's conflicted headcanon.   

 

I am curious as to how Abelas would view the vallaslin.  I've always seen him as CHOOSING to be a servant of Mythal. It was probably a great honor to serve her in the way that he did.  For him, the vallaslin would likely be incredibly important as it marked him as her sentinal and guardian. A position that he took seriously. 

[Kestrel]

I really want to stick extended vallaslin conversations in there, when I get there. Abelas is bound to have a different interpretation of his tattoos from how Solas sees it, and we do only see things from Solas' point of view.

[Siha]

I am curious as to how Abelas would view the vallaslin.  I've always seen him as CHOOSING to be a servant of Mythal. It was probably a great honor to serve her in the way that he did.  For him, the vallaslin would likely be incredibly important as it marked him as her sentinal and guardian. A position that he took seriously. 

 

Considering how derogatory his remark seems ("You carry features of those who call themselves Elvhen") I assume he is not so pleased to see vallaslin on somebody who does not actually serve the gods. But I am not so sure what I think about this.

 

Actually, until Giton postet that about the facial tattoos I had never heard of a positive meaning. All I ever heard about (permanent) facial markings was unsettling; either them indicating slavery or war. (Probably because all I ever heard of was about markings made by others not by the person him/herself.) Even the dwarves in DAO were marked for being casteless = unworthy.

Without thinking much about it, simply from my very first associations (paired with me never playing a religious character), I always refused to give my girls vallaslin. When when DAI forced me to use them, I made them very light to hide them as best as possible (and headcanon my girl didn't have any). So Solas telling about their meaning was rather confirmation for my initial dislike. I don't romance him as such, but if I did I'd be glad to have them gone, just because I did not "trust" them to begin with.

[Abelas Forever!]

I am curious as to how Abelas would view the vallaslin.  I've always seen him as CHOOSING to be a servant of Mythal. It was probably a great honor to serve her in the way that he did.  For him, the vallaslin would likely be incredibly important as it marked him as her sentinal and guardian. A position that he took seriously. 

I have also imagined that Abelas choosed to be servant of Mythal and I don't see him wanting to remove the vallaslin. Maybe he wants to keep it to remind him what he used to be and to remind him about his mistake of not being able to protect the temple.

[BoscoBread]

You think he feels remorse at not being able to protect the temple or a sense of relief for finally being free from his duty? 

 

When my quizzy drank from the well and read the ancient elven text, which was about him, I got the distinct impression he was in love with Mythal. I'm not saying it was reciprocated. It was just a feeling. I wish we could explore his emotional baggage.

I would imagine it was a pretty heavy moment for him.  He basically admits his duty and the deaths of his fellows were pretty much pointless. They were protecting a memory.  It holds no real meaning anymore because the Empire was already lost and they left the knowledge to rot in a temple.  So it was probably anger at that, sadness at the loss of his duty/purpose, and possibly relief/fear at being free to do something for himself for once.  He was pretty emo.

 

I don't think he was in love with Mythal. Not in a romantic way.  He was devoted.  It's religious devotion.  No different than any other priest/religious acolyte in the real world who go on about the love of their god etc. etc.   I'm sure, to him, she embodied the greatest aspects of the elvhen.  The attributes that he held the most dear.

 

 

Considering how derogatory his remark seems ("You carry features of those who call themselves Elvhen") I assume he is not so pleased to see vallaslin on somebody who does not actually serve the gods. But I am not so sure what I think about this.

 

Actually, until Giton postet that about the facial tattoos I had never heard of a positive meaning. All I ever heard about (permanent) facial markings was unsettling; either them indicating slavery or war. (Probably because all I ever heard of was about markings made by others not by the person him/herself.) Even the dwarves in DAO were marked for being casteless = unworthy.

Without thinking much about it, simply from my very first associations (paired with me never playing a religious character), I always refused to give my girls vallaslin. When when DAI forced me to use them, I made them very light to hide them as best as possible (and headcanon my girl didn't have any). So Solas telling about their meaning was rather confirmation for my initial dislike. I don't romance him as such, but if I did I'd be glad to have them gone, just because I did not "trust" them to begin with.

My gal was not religious either but she did appreciate what they stood for and why they were honored. Nor was she particularly MEGA-DALISH but she was proud of where she came from. For her, the vallaslin was a rite of passage. One that marked her as a fully-fledged hunter - something she would have been particularly proud of.  That whole moment for her - with Solas - would have been pretty emotional.  It's a lot of stuff to deal with in like the span of 20 seconds.  She would have wanted more time to reflect on it.  Too bad she doesn't get it!

[Sable Rhapsody]

That whole moment for her - with Solas - would have been pretty emotional.  It's a lot of stuff to deal with in like the span of 20 seconds.  She would have wanted more time to reflect on it.  Too bad she doesn't get it!

 

For all that Solas asks for time to think about things (at the start of the relationship after the Fade kiss) he certainly doesn't offer Lavellan the same courtesy.  What a butt 

 

As for Abelas, I hope he finds something to do with his life now that he's no longer bound to Mythal.  As much as I'd love him to join Lavellan and the Inquisition, I'm not sure he'd fit in particularly well.  The Inquisition is pretty hodgepodge and depending on the Inquisitor can be very tolerant, but what exactly does one DO with an ancient elvhen sentinel after Corypheus's defeat?

[Kestrel]

Teach him to love, duh.

 

Nah, but really. I can imagine him sort of showing up and being confused about the world like an adorable lost bunny rabbit. Or so I tell myself. It's hard to say what he would actually do, because we see so little of his personality. Maybe he wanders with the rest of the Sentinel elves, seeing if any of their kind are left. Perhaps he finds the old temples and sits there and simply remembers. Perhaps he tries to reconnect with modern Dalish culture, to overcome some initial distaste and see what has become of his people. There are so many possibilities out there.

[Lorien19]

You think he feels remorse at not being able to protect the temple or a sense of relief for finally being free from his duty?

When my quizzy drank from the well and read the ancient elven text, which was about him, I got the distinct impression he was in love with Mythal. I'm not saying it was reciprocated. It was just a feeling. I wish we could explore his emotional baggage.

I think he'd feel both remorse and relief.

As for Mythal,I'm positive thing he did love her, but there are many ways to love someone and I'm not really sure, whether it'd be the romantic type of love as far as he's concerned.

[Abelas Forever!]

You think he feels remorse at not being able to protect the temple or a sense of relief for finally being free from his duty? 

 

When my quizzy drank from the well and read the ancient elven text, which was about him, I got the distinct impression he was in love with Mythal. I'm not saying it was reciprocated. It was just a feeling. I wish we could explore his emotional baggage.

I think Abelas blames himself for not being able to protect the temple. Although he probably knew that he was going to fail but he kept protecting it anyway. That is why I don't think he wanted to be free from his duty but instead he probably was going to die protecting it. I also think that leaving the temple was very hard for him because he doesn't have a purpose anymore and he has just experience a huge failure. So he is broken. I would also want to explore his emotional baggage more.

 

What text are you talking about? I don't remember reading that although I remember finding some ancient elven text in Arbor Wilds.

 

 

Teach him to love, duh.

 

Nah, but really. I can imagine him sort of showing up and being confused about the world like an adorable lost bunny rabbit. Or so I tell myself. It's hard to say what he would actually do, because we see so little of his personality. Maybe he wanders with the rest of the Sentinel elves, seeing if any of their kind are left. Perhaps he finds the old temples and sits there and simply remembers. Perhaps he tries to reconnect with modern Dalish culture, to overcome some initial distaste and see what has become of his people. There are so many possibilities out there.

I have difficulties seeing him being lost. Maybe because I don't want him to be lost instead I want him to be broken but still confident about himself and what he is. I could imagine that he would try to restore something ancient but for what purpose? I don't know. I have also difficulties seing him reconnecting with modern Dalish. I think he needs time to heal before he can do that. Maybe he just wanders around the world looking for other ancient elves.

[Kestrel]

Well, as I mentioned before, I don't think he would do anything immediately besides wander, and try to reconcile who he is now versus the very set path he had been on before. Anything I mention would be years and years down the line, because I imagine Abelas operates on a time scale that's positively geological compared to other characters who don't have the benefit of immortality. But I can twist that a little bit for writing purposes, because I'm not so sure elderly, aging Inquisitor is a sexy pairing with Abelas. 

[Swevenfox]

What I understood and I personally find very curious concept that the old Arlathans were sort of mixture of Tevinter and the Qun. 

 

The fact that Abelas is not really a name, and so far beside the gods we not really meet with names, more like "job descriptions" points out that the old elvhen were pretty much "slaves" just as the Qun are but with lot of magic users among them (like all of them had the old magic flow in their veins).

 

I want to imagine that for him standing in the servitude of Mythal was very much his own decision and being chosen for this duty he wore this title with pride and with heart. He wanted this opportunity and he got lucky as he was chosen and he did it with heart and soul - but beside this he known nothing else either.

 

He was happy to serve his Mistress. He loved Her as a Great Protector, as a Mistress (surely not on romantic way, more like with great respect). 

He also know no other way of living, other way of Life either, but he not needed as this made him happy, this gave him purpose, goal and this kept him move forward with pride. 

Now when Myhtal was murdered he changed his name to Abelas (he changed names 2 times from the codex entry) because for him this was a true tragedy and pain, it emotionally torn him and touched him. He though know no other way kept in Her servitude this time for her memory and because this is all what left for him to do.

I repeat; he has no other though of how to live his life. He never learnt to be independent and not even considered this option because he can not outsee his own isolated mind about this - he was clinging in the Well but unlikely being awakened since all awakening reminded him on what he lost, and nothing left for him to hang on and really continue living. He was living such as Mythal was living - through centuries a little shard, a soul shard - kept him going the Well but it was just shadow of the joy of being a sentinel for him like it was when he got chosen.

 

His great tragedy lies in this, but he wears that vallaslin proudly, he IS servant of Mythal and he chosen it by his own free will - he lingers. He lingers - he can not really die, and can not really live - and most important, he has trouble to even imagine now to live independent in an age which he does not know and as we see he not really open to experience it. 

[BoscoBread]

For all that Solas asks for time to think about things (at the start of the relationship after the Fade kiss) he certainly doesn't offer Lavellan the same courtesy.  What a butt 

 

As for Abelas, I hope he finds something to do with his life now that he's no longer bound to Mythal.  As much as I'd love him to join Lavellan and the Inquisition, I'm not sure he'd fit in particularly well.  The Inquisition is pretty hodgepodge and depending on the Inquisitor can be very tolerant, but what exactly does one DO with an ancient elvhen sentinel after Corypheus's defeat?

I can think of a few things.  *wink wink*

 

But seriously folks,  I think he would actually fit really well in the Inquisition. It's ordered. It has purpose.  It's got this cult of personality with the Herald.  It's something that would be familiar to him even if it's not something he would believe in.   I think it would be incredibly weird if he was running around say with Hawke and his/her band of misfits.   I don't think Abelas would be very happy with that. 

[Kestrel]

Can you imagine the first game of Wicked Grace he attends? I bet he's really good at it but so serious that everyone is wildly uncomfortable. Worst game ever.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Teach him to love, duh.

 
 

I can think of a few things.  *wink wink*

 
OK, I did walk right into that one 
 
If there are other ancient elves out there, I wonder if he would try to seek them out as Solas suggests?  The way Solas said "your people yet linger" made me think he wasn't talking about the Dalish or the city elves.  How do you even go about trying to find other elvhen from Arlathan?  We're aware that Felassan belongs to a group of ancient elves of some kind, but that's about it.  It's not like there's a grumpy old elf registry lying about.