Just a note here. The false Calling is actually being spread by the Nightmare demon. The spirit that may or may not be Justinia tells you that. When you kill the Nightmare's avatar and seal the giant version away as you escape, the false Calling goes away. That's why you never hear about it again.
EDIT: ninja'ed by robert.
If want control over what is written then write your own game of piece of fan fiction. Seems to me you want them to write it differently because you want additional writing which was not presented to you in game to justify a decision rather than using what was presented to make that choice. The world does not work that way, I cannot for example force the people who run the lottery to keep re-spinning the wheel until my numbers come up no matter how much I want to win it. Sometimes in life you just have to make a decision based on the only options available and this is one of those situations. They could of written Cory doing a million other things or written events in different ways but they didn't, because they did not it has no relevance to making the choice in game and remains nothing more than fan fiction.
It's more about staying true to your characters. There's a certain point where a story kind of writes itself because your characters can only act in so many ways. They really couldn't have feasibly written Corypheus in a million other ways. I'm criticizing the writing (I'm allowed to do that) because I think they could do better.
No consequences and transparent, friendly Wardens just doesn't sound like Dragon Age or dark fantasy to me.
This is the power Corypheus has. It's established, not fan fiction. He didn't need a nightmare demon ally to do what he did in Legacy, asleep and confused as he was.
Grey Wardens got a serious character assassination in DAI.
No they didn't. They where never the idealistic heroes Alistair painted them to be in DAO. Their actions in DAI make alot of sense.
It's more about staying true to your characters. There's a certain point where a story kind of writes itself because your characters can only act in so many ways. They really couldn't have feasibly written Corypheus in a million other ways. I'm criticizing the writing (I'm allowed to do that) because I think they could do better.
No consequences and transparent, friendly Wardens just doesn't sound like Dragon Age or dark fantasy to me.
This is the power Corypheus has. It's established, not fan fiction. He didn't need a nightmare demon ally to do what he did in Legacy, asleep and confused as he was.
That's true. This is what he can do to Wardens that are in close proximity. The false Calling isn't the same thing; the Nightmare demon is playing on the fear every Warden has of the time when the taint will begin to overtake them. Also, its happening over most of an entire continent, since the Wardens in both Ferelden and Orlais all disappear. Presumably, they're all hearing this false Calling, though its never quite spelled out that the Ferelden Wardens were at Adamant.
Hell. Now I'm suddenly worried that Nathaniel was turned into fodder for some idiot to summon and bind a demon (and become Cory's slave).
EDIT: I forgot to mention that while I may not agree with some of your points, the one that kind and transparent Wardens being at odd with Dragon Age's flavor, is a good one.
You do understand why they did what they did?
They were dying and had a plan to stop the blight forever.
Yea how absurd I know. The Wardens were to adventure the deep roads and what not to stop the blight for good. They did not make a demon army to rule over Thedas. Their intentions were not as malicious as their methods. Blood Magic is accepted within the order.
How many times have Wardens became the enemy throughout the history of time? Not even in this story are they the enemy.
Try to understand the why and the many other factors that should weigh in on any decision. O I saw a single thing i do not agree with, that's it condemn them for life!
There methods were wrong, yet from certain perspectives so are the inquisitions methods even though their goals may not be.
Try to understand the why and the many other factors that should weigh in on any decision. O I saw a single thing i do not agree with, that's it condemn them for life!
There methods were wrong, yet from certain perspectives so are the inquisitions methods even though their goals may not be.
It was an odd plan to come up with considering the wardens in Orlais were not the entirety of the order. Also, the fifth blight started because of a nearly identical plan, however only the Wardens would know this which makes Clarel's agreement to Erimond's plan even more reckless.
Sorry, but you brought it up. I was, after all, replying to your post. The point being, they are not the white knights that some want to believe. We really don't need much in the way of evidence, considering the events in this game. They weren't just manipulated, they were easily manipulated. Keeping them can represent a clear and present danger to the Inquisition. We, of course, have the advantage of metagame, but really, if we're putting ourselves into our Inquisitor's shoes, there is no right or wrong answer. I have two games past this point, and have done both versions. My Dalish didn't trust that it couldn't happen again, and exiled them, my Human kept them around, hoping that defeating the avatar of the Fear Demon would suffice to keep them from Cory's sway.
I brought up the Fereldan exile to make a point about the state of Fereldan during the Fifth Blight, not the long ago reason for the exile. I don't care about the reasons and never once argued them as any Inquisitor would be justified in exiling them if they choose to. So bringing up the reason for a past exile in Fereldan is moot. My entire point is all about the future implications of said exile. And no one can convince me that Fereldan was in a great place sans the Wardens during the Blight. The country was lucky. If the HoF was never recruited or even saved by Flemeth. The country would be a stain. Period.
I have never called the GWs white knights, nor do I see them as such. My own warden let the Architect live, allows Avernus to continue his research unchecked et al. To consider them some noble knights would be the same as calling my own Warden a white knight and he most certainly wasn't.
Keeping the wardens is no more dangerous than siding with the mages and keeping the Venatori's possibly mind controlled leader(Fiona) right below your spy network and messenger birds or siding with the Templars who are at danger of taking the red Lyrium. Or allowing a Qunari spy who openly admits he wears masks to hide his true intent into your inner circle and bed. Name one alliance in this game that doesn't come with potential consequences.
One I gave my opinion and did not tell you how to think, absurdity like that gets you ignored from this moment. My opinion clashed with yours so I must be forcing it upon you? Did I say you must think this way? Did I say ignore the possibility of it happening again? No I think you missed the point. Completely, as I am stating I think people should look at it from a multitude of perspectives before making a decision based solely on a single aspect of something bigger than a singular idea. Which... you seem to be doing. Still this is only my opinion and in no way is it being forced upon anyone..
I agreed the plan is wreckless and their methods were malicious. I said their intentions were not as malicious as their methods. My post was a reply to the topic at hand. Why would anyone save the wardens? I answered with my opinon....
I brought up the Fereldan exile to make a point about the state of Fereldan during the Fifth Blight, not the long ago reason for the exile. I don't care about the reasons and never once argued them as any Inquisitor would be justified in exiling them if they choose to. So bringing up the reason for a past exile in Fereldan is moot. My entire point is all about the future implications of said exile. And no one can convince me that Fereldan was in a great place sans the Wardens during the Blight. The country was lucky. If the HoF was never recruited or even saved by Flemeth. The country would be a stain. Period.
I have never called the GWs white knights, nor do I see them as such. My own warden let the Architect live, allows Avernus to continue his research unchecked et al. To consider them some noble knights would be the same as calling my own Warden a white knight and he most certainly wasn't.
Keeping the wardens is no more dangerous than siding with the mages and keeping the Venatori's possibly mind controlled leader(Fiona) right below your spy network and messenger birds or siding with the Templars who are at danger of taking the red Lyrium. Or allowing a Qunari spy who openly admits he wears masks to hide his true intent into your inner circle and bed. Name one alliance in this game that doesn't come with potential consequences.
During any other time, the Wardens' plan wouldn't even have been all that reckless. Everyone knows that two more Blights will come. Why wait them out? Why not take the fight to the enemy? Risky, for sure, but if you felt you had the strength for it ... some would say it's better than waiting around.
Doing it while the world is literally coming apart was the really reckless thing.
As I pointed out in that same post, however, there were far more than 2 Wardens at Ostagar. We're never shown how many, but we're told that they are in a camp that we don't have access to. Contrary to what you seem to be saying, which I could be missing, at Ostagar there were more than three. The exile is not to blame for the shortage post Ostagar, Loghain is.
...and you are not forced to choose any of them, but are free to select your poison, as it were, which in no way goes against anything I've said. I'm 50/50 on the issue now, and have stated, multiple times, that there is no "right" answer.
Does it matter that there were more GWs at Ostagar? All it proves is that the few that were there weren't enough. It doesn't change the fact that them being exiled is what caused the low numbers and potentially doomed Fereldan from the beginning. Sure Loghain was at fault but not entirely. He took advantage of them having to ship GWs in from the start.
I know I'm not forced to choose, no one is forced to do anything except make what they believe to be the right choices for themselves. As I've stated before, exiling them is justified. My disagreement with exiling them is not the same as me saying there is a right or wrong answer.
Well, to fight the next Blight seems a pretty compelling reason.
we gonna need them for the blight which is around the corner i think.
Actually summoning demons to fight darkspawn wasn´t a terrible idea, if done properly. Just the situation (Corypheus at large) was bad, but the idea was sound. Just summon several Rage demons (the fire ones) and bind them with mages. The darkspawn are vulnerable to fire, so use a host of them as vanguard to clear the deep roads section by section, with dwarven help. Like Duncan in the dream at Weisshaupt said "setting the underground lairs ablaze". Also, nobody cares if the demons die while at it. Well maybe Solas does, but who cares about him.
its pretty idiotic they have not tried to kill all the old gods already there cause of the great fear of the blight once there gone no more archdemons ,using demons was smart the problem was trusting someone outside the wardens in a complete stranger they should have found a spell they know wont have them be controlled now that they i say they should do it again this time add the undead too the darkspawn need to be wiped out already.
I kept them because darkspawn. I mean, I guess I could do -everything- by myself, but I'd rather not.
Stroud/the few stragglers who fought alongside me also sort of redeemed them in my eyes. Clarel also zapped that dragon for me before she died, so...
I never saw it as exiling them forever. More like "You go back to Weisshaupt and tell your parents what you've been doing down here!" and hope Weisshaupt whips them back into order and reestablishes something more stable in the south.
Because why lose a possible aspect for an advantage? Exile means whatever use they may have has gone also i like to give them the possibility to redeem themselves. But if you want you can kill every last warden through war table missions. There is a small chain of missions where you can use wardens, in my playthrough they went on three missions and the last one was a bloody massacre where everyone died. Strangely after that nobody noticed and for example Morrigan was still thankful to me.
So you agree. Wardens are just tools and if a tool is no longer working, it should be replaced.
Good talk, good talk.
The Grey Wardens are the only tool that can defeat a Blight. And there still two Old Gods on the loose.
Damn, does everybody just up and forget the blights??!!! Thedas is one ungrateful continent, "Thanks for saving the world from the ghoulish creatures that only you can defeat now f*ck off!". Maker's breath, show some respect for the greatest order in Thedosian history.
Guest_Puddi III_*
Lingering gratefulness for stopping the blight even if the leader of the Orlais branch had her head 10 miles up her own ass and shoved all her subordinate mages up there too. Said political capital plus their value as an elite fighting force could earn them a chance at redemption.
Honestly, if you can't grasp the importance of Grey Wardens in Thedas, then you're not a real Dragon Age fan.
The Grey Wardens are the only tool that can defeat a Blight. And there still two Old Gods on the loose.
Ah ah ah.
The RITUAL to become a Grey Warden, and Archdemon blood, are the only tools that can defeat a Blight.
Hence my desire for a DLC wherein I can cleanse Weisshaupt of the corrupt Grey Wardens and take the ritual and the blood for safekeeping in the Inquisition, thus providing a new, stable order with which we can properly defeat the Blights.
The Grey Wardens themselves aren't needed.
Damn, does everybody just up and forget the blights??!!! Thedas is one ungrateful continent, "Thanks for saving the world from the ghoulish creatures that only you can defeat now f*ck off!". Maker's breath, show some respect for the greatest order in Thedosian history.
Its human nature. Happens in the real world too.
Tommy
By Rudyard Kipling
I went into a public-'ouse to get a pint o' beer,
The publican 'e up an' sez, "We serve no red-coats here."
The girls be'ind the bar they laughed an' giggled fit to die,
I outs into the street again an' to myself sez I:
O it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, go away";
But it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins", when the band begins to play,
The band begins to play, my boys, the band begins to play,
O it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins", when the band begins to play.
I went into a theatre as sober as could be,
They gave a drunk civilian room, but 'adn't none for me;
They sent me to the gallery or round the music-'alls,
But when it comes to fightin', Lord! they'll shove me in the stalls!
For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, wait outside";
But it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide,
The troopship's on the tide, my boys, the troopship's on the tide,
O it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide.
Yes, makin' mock o' uniforms that guard you while you sleep
Is cheaper than them uniforms, an' they're starvation cheap;
An' hustlin' drunken soldiers when they're goin' large a bit
Is five times better business than paradin' in full kit.
Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, 'ow's yer soul?"
But it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll,
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll.
We aren't no thin red 'eroes, nor we aren't no blackguards too,
But single men in barricks, most remarkable like you;
An' if sometimes our conduck isn't all your fancy paints,
Why, single men in barricks don't grow into plaster saints;
While it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, fall be'ind",
But it's "Please to walk in front, sir", when there's trouble in the wind,
There's trouble in the wind, my boys, there's trouble in the wind,
O it's "Please to walk in front, sir", when there's trouble in the wind.
You talk o' better food for us, an' schools, an' fires, an' all:
We'll wait for extry rations if you treat us rational.
Don't mess about the cook-room slops, but prove it to our face
The Widow's Uniform is not the soldier-man's disgrace.
For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Chuck him out, the brute!"
But it's "Saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot;
An' it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please;
An' Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool -- you bet that Tommy sees!
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