1570 réponses à ce sujet

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

You are right, of course. I don't know. Nobody does. But I've yet to hear an interpretation that is consistent with the theme of DA:I (every institution crippled or destroyed, leaving the vacuum for the Inquisition to step into) and that ends up with some kind of positive outcome, without stretching credulity. In my humble opinion, if that wasn't clear before, the Epilogue reads sinister to me, not hopeful, in the context of everything else that has gone on before.

I'm not saying that I think that this is leading to anything good, but I don't think contact being lost means that they're going to be destroyed as you'd previously asserted. I was more afraid that they'd recognize all the good their Order has done humanity over the centuries and decide they hadn't been honored, paid, laid, and just generally obeyed enough to properly reward them for it.

[midnight tea]

To be honest, I'm torn on this one - both options seem to have a good chance to either save or doom the order.

 

Conscripting - means that Wardens are given another chance (and my IQs generally give people second chances) and Inquisition might help them recover from the brink.... or doom them. It might be that most of them would feel that being given a chance by the Herald of Andraste means absolution (well, Inquisition's protection will should probably be enough to shield them from consequences of their foolish plan), which would mean that they might never really consider reforming the Order.

 

Exile - exile doesn't mean destruction. They've been exiled before, so it's not like news to them. And time they'd spend scattered or fighting for Inquisition (while avoiding Cory and his blight magic) might be used better for them to be all called back and try and save and rebuild the Order from the inside.... Or it might destroy them as well.

 

I usually exile them, but I don't really have a nug in this race. I suppose we'll see where the story would go.

[sorentoft]

Why would you exile them? They only did their job: To end the blights. They are good soldiers and probably the only ones who have some idea on how to actually kill Corypheus, and if not that then they are some of the few with good insight on darkspawn. To exile them out of petty emotion when everyone knows what will happen if the wardens are gone is foolish to say the least, I'd go as far as to say it is criminal. By conscripting them you can at least make sure they don't make more unfortunate decisions.

[midnight tea]

Exiled Wardens can still return, you know. It's not like Inquisition is executing them all  - question is whether they'd return stronger or weaker. There's a real possibility that they NEED some time for themselves, in order to fix things within their Order.

 

(I assume that the result will be influenced by who we return with from the Fade. Highly possible that if we sacrifice Hawke and save the Warden, they might still return victorious - less so if it's the other way around. Or maybe the opposite is true?)

[robertthebard]

Why would you exile them? They only did their job: To end the blights. They are good soldiers and probably the only ones who have some idea on how to actually kill Corypheus, and if not that then they are some of the few with good insight on darkspawn. To exile them out of petty emotion when everyone knows what will happen if the wardens are gone is foolish to say the least, I'd go as far as to say it is criminal. By conscripting them you can at least make sure they don't make more unfortunate decisions.

Did you play Legacy? If the Wardens could have killed Cory, or knew how to kill Cory, don't you think they would have way back when they first imprisoned him, instead of doing what they did? The only thing they are to him are "get of Death free" cards.

[PapaCharlie9]

Why would you exile them? They only did their job: To end the blights. They are good soldiers and probably the only ones who have some idea on how to actually kill Corypheus, and if not that then they are some of the few with good insight on darkspawn. To exile them out of petty emotion when everyone knows what will happen if the wardens are gone is foolish to say the least, I'd go as far as to say it is criminal. By conscripting them you can at least make sure they don't make more unfortunate decisions.

Sorry, I can't agree with your characterization of the Order. They are "good soldiers" only in the sense that they know how to fight. And the exile isn't petty -- it's because they were trusted and tolerated since only they can save the world, but they betrayed that trust and nearly destroyed the world in the name of saving it.

 

And, in my personal reading between the lines, there is an element of wanting to end Blights once and for all because, heck, they are tired of the Oath, the Calling, and everything crappy about being a Warden. That might be bleed-over influence from The Calling, though. Bregan loathed being a Warden.

[Cobra's_back]

I haven't done this myself, but I understand that Leliana knows about the Dark Ritual in Inquisition if she was romanced, and is grateful for it saving the Warden's life, which would imply knowledge of the rest. She certainly knows about the Calling if romanced.

Also, I believe it is known that Grey Wardens are needed to defeat the Blight, just not specifically why. Of course, that lack of specificity does deprive it of much of it's credibility and force

 

 

I thought in the first game the people knew Wardens were needed to fight the blight. I always keep them for that reason alone.

[In Exile]

I thought in the first game the people knew Wardens were needed to fight the blight. I always keep them for that reason alone.

 

Only because they're kickass soldiers, not because they're all that can kill an AD. 

[Cobra's_back]

Only because they're kickass soldiers, not because they're all that can kill an AD. 

 

 

It doesn't matter. Get rid of them and now you don't have a kick ass group that kills Darkspawn. The key is they are still needed.

[Lazarillo]

My perspective on it is that the Wardens were a problem more or less solely because of the Nightmare, and after HLtA, the Nightmare is no longer a problem.  There might still be a few under mind control (obviously, since they make up Cory's elite guard later on), but the order as a whole is really more of a boon to have around when you consider there's a maniacal ancient Darkspawn running around messing things up.

 

Granted, said maniacal ancient Darkspawn is also able to use the Wardens to cheat death, but he can apparently do that regardless of whether they get exiled or not.

[Sunnie]

Nice necro.

 so more ?

[X Equestris]

Granted, said maniacal ancient Darkspawn is also able to use the Wardens to cheat death, but he can apparently do that regardless of whether they get exiled or not.

Indeed. Cory doesn't even need Wardens, all he needs is one darkspawn or ghoul in the world. The only reason we're able to kill him is because pride led him to invest part of himself in the red lyrium dragon.

[SgtSteel91]

In the end it doesn't really matter. The epilogue pretty much implies it's not looking good for them no matter what, so it's really what you think is best for Fereldan, Orlais and the Inquisition.  After finding an OG in The Western Approach and DLC hints about the Deep Roads, I'm glad I kept the Wardens, but who really knows what's the best choice? I just go with how my Inquisitor is, and RP it.

 

To me, it's slightly better for the Southern Wardens is they're allied with the Inquisition. Even if there's a rebellion with the Wardens in the Anderfels they, at least, seem to clear their blemish for the Demon Army and start being less secretive to the rest of the world.

[Sunnie]

Thread was already "necro'd" a week earlier, try comtributing something useful to the topic for once?

 
Last post prior; 01 May 2015 - 06:43 PM;  =/= a week earlier. 24 days is just short of 4 weeks.

There's nothing useful to add to this thread, it died already and anything else said now is just beating a dead horse. Or, are you just bored and looking to increase your post count by starting a fight?

[Kakistos_]

In the end it doesn't really matter. The epilogue pretty much implies it's not looking good for them no matter what, so it's really what you think is best for Fereldan, Orlais and the Inquisition.  After finding an OG in The Western Approach and DLC hints about the Deep Roads, I'm glad I kept the Wardens, but who really knows what's the best choice? I just go with how my Inquisitor is, and RP it.

I agree that in the end it doesn't matter for the Wardens not so sure about the Inquisition though. The Wardens are not allies that I would pass on. I disagree about things not looking good for the Wardens. Sure, they have been diminished in Orlais, much more so in Ferelden but they have recovered from such before. The issues in weishaupt, which we really don't know much about, don't exactly spell doom for the Wardens either.

 

With the 5th Blight fresh in people's minds, the Wardens are enjoying wide spread acclaim, new recruits and a foothold back into the public eye outside of a Blight thanks to either or both Amaranthine and Vigil's Keep being saved or eventually being rebuilt with a Warden, possibly The HOF owning land and being an important figure in politics and society.

 

Consider also that while the Order was nearly eliminated in Ferelden, has suffered losses in Orlais and probably more in this alleged infighting, they have not lost nearly as many as they would have had the Blight not been stopped in Ferelden and lasted longer than a year. Past Blights lasted decades and longer with scores of Wardens dying before they could strike at the Archdemon. All of this on top of the SPOILER discovered in Last Flight. I would say that, despite the turmoil in Orlais and Weishaupt, things are actually looking up for the Wardens.

[DDJ]

I've taken the time to read every comment and while I may have missed it there is one overriding factor that I had not considered when I was deciding to exile the Wardens.  Despite the murder of the Divine and the thousands of deaths that resulted from their actions, despite the murder of Ser Jory and numerous other thug like actions such as abandoning Kirkwall to its fate, I have actually changed my mind.  Now, please do not misunderstand me.  My lack of fondness for the Wardens and their drink or die / drink and die philosophy which I still regard as a totalitarian concept, I will no longer exile the Wardens.  To do so prevents the Inquisitor from ferreting out their dirty secrets and laundry, airing it and improving the Wardens who are sadly in need of improvement in my mind anyway.  It also permits me the thought that the Inquisition can provide, as someone once said, adult supervision for them.  In short, no more secret murders in secret places, no more dark secrets such as the one Alastair keeps until the end of the game in DAO - ie:  "oh, now that you have raised an army to fight the Blight I forgot to tell you that we murdered you with this delayed poison that makes you rot externally.  You understand of course."  I for one surely do and my response is always predictable.  I tell Alastair that Duncan got what he deserved, buy his favor back with gifts, don't speak to him again and tell him he can go to hell.  I put him on the throne so he is forced to rot in public,  I never stay in Ferelden and insure I don't die so he can keep yet another dirty secret.

 

Sorry guys, the Grey Wardens espite the entreaties of the game masters do not rank very high in my book.  I realize a lot of you think highly of them, and you are most welcome to.  I can't really share it.  Still, these games remain great, and I wait to see what the next installment brings.

[Darkstarr11]

My thoughts on the matter:

 

I keep them.  

 

Why?  Sure, exiling them DOESN'T mean destruction...you are just kicking them out.  They go off to where ever Wardens go.

 

OH, and if another Archdeacon rises, kiss Orlais and possibly Ferelden goodbye.  Why?  You got rid of the Wardens.  

 

I hate insurance, do you know that?  It's a nasty bill every month that sucks.  More money gone that I could have used from something else.  Until I get into a car wreck. Or a family member gets injured...or worse.  Suddenly, insurance becomes my lifeline.  I have hope.  

 

The Blight nearly destroyed Ferelden.  If not for the Warden, it would have been destroyed.  And considering by the end of the game, the Inquisitor knows quite a bit about the Wardens (seeing as the Warden friend of Hawke gave you some information) and you had Morrigan at your disposal (who knew all their secrets ALREADY) it doesn't take a lot to realize that without Wardens at  your disposal, it could go belly up fast.  

 

Second thing.  By keeping them, you get the chance to influence them.  By the end of the game, they are Grey Wardens sure...but they are the Inquisitions Grey Wardens.  They seemingly split off from Weissaupt.  Forming them into a better Order.  You kick them out, they go right back to being the secretive amoral bunch they were before.  Why not take the chance to make them better?

[Aren]

Only because they're kickass soldiers, not because they're all that can kill an AD. 

Actually aside from few of them (who suffer from the inevitable invincibility of the plot especially for DAO) i have yet to see a kickass warden

(Duncan,Riordan,Janeka and co all failures) ,maybe Loghain since he has accomplished something when he was not under our control,while AListair,PC ecc are simply guided by the plot.

[Yaroub]

Actually aside from few of them (who suffer from the inevitable invincibility of the plot especially for DAO) i have yet to see a kickass warden

(Duncan,Riordan,Janeka and co all failures) ,maybe Loghain since he has accomplished something when he was not under our control,while AListair,PC ecc are simply guided by the plot.

 

 

 

Duncan is Obi Wan Kenobi of the franchise, the man's legit.

[Apo]

Actually aside from few of them (who suffer from the inevitable invincibility of the plot especially for DAO) i have yet to see a kickass warden

(Duncan,Riordan,Janeka and co all failures) ,maybe Loghain since he has accomplished something when he was not under our control,while AListair,PC ecc are simply guided by the plot.

 

Duncan kicked ass before the events of DA:O in the novel "The Calling" and Riordan weakened the Archdeamon by hurting the beast very badly, sure he dies, but his sacrifice was essential in the final battle atop fort Drakon.

[KCMeredith]

Duncan kicked ass before the events of DA:O in the novel "The Calling" and Riordan weakened the Archdeamon by hurting the beast very badly, sure he dies, but his sacrifice was essential in the final battle atop fort Drakon.

I played Origins ~50 times

 

I still tear up when Riordan falls to his death

 

I can't help it

[robertthebard]

My thoughts on the matter:
 
I keep them.  
 
Why?  Sure, exiling them DOESN'T mean destruction...you are just kicking them out.  They go off to where ever Wardens go.
 
OH, and if another Archdeacon rises, kiss Orlais and possibly Ferelden goodbye.  Why?  You got rid of the Wardens.  
 
I hate insurance, do you know that?  It's a nasty bill every month that sucks.  More money gone that I could have used from something else.  Until I get into a car wreck. Or a family member gets injured...or worse.  Suddenly, insurance becomes my lifeline.  I have hope.  
 
The Blight nearly destroyed Ferelden.  If not for the Warden, it would have been destroyed.  And considering by the end of the game, the Inquisitor knows quite a bit about the Wardens (seeing as the Warden friend of Hawke gave you some information) and you had Morrigan at your disposal (who knew all their secrets ALREADY) it doesn't take a lot to realize that without Wardens at  your disposal, it could go belly up fast.  
 
Second thing.  By keeping them, you get the chance to influence them.  By the end of the game, they are Grey Wardens sure...but they are the Inquisitions Grey Wardens.  They seemingly split off from Weissaupt.  Forming them into a better Order.  You kick them out, they go right back to being the secretive amoral bunch they were before.  Why not take the chance to make them better?

Firstly, there is no "right" or "wrong" answer, since we all know there are no Thedas shaking consequences, either way.

However, the First Blight says hello. What's so special about the First Blight? There were no Wardens, at all. While the Anderfels are still a wasteland, purportedly, they're still there, and people still manage to live there. In the Fifth Blight, how many Wardens were at the archdemon fight? As many as what, 2? With only 3 going in to the Battle of Denerim. The Inquisitor that banishes the Wardens isn't dooming Thedas any more than the Inquisitor that keeps them. The only difference being where the Wardens are. If people that held the remaining archdemons up as some kind of proof that banishing them is bad, there would be no Thedas, because the first archdemon would have destroyed it. It lasted over a century, and there truly were no Wardens to stop him, until the very end. In order for banishing to mean the doom of the "known" world, or at least Orlais and/or Ferelden, it would have to mean that somehow Thedas lost the ability to hold the darkspawn until the Wardens could return. Nothing presented in the time of the choice, or afterwards, supports this.