I don't think ever really wanted to be a hero. They kind of just seemed to be dragged into things or be at the wrong place at the wrong time.
And that's the thing. Everything in Kirkwall went to hell in a handbasket. It was nothing that Hawke did. But everything degraded over the....what...few years period (see rapidly)? And Hawke got caught in the middle of it. Hawke wasn't looking for the accolades. He/She just wanted to get out of it alive and protect what family/friends/loves they had left.
"Brutally murdered" is not the same as "unleashed upon the world," varric
Hawke failing at nearly everything is part of Hawke's charm, dang it!
Merrill still has the Eluvian mirror and summon a demon
My Meryll gave up the Eluvian, because I told her to. >.<
I felt that Hawke just tried her best to keep from getting squished by the circumstances surrounding her in Kirkwall and provide for herself and her family. Never got the vibe that she was out to be any sort of hero. Things just escalated and got completely out of hand by the end of chapter 3. It's actually an interesting narrative in the 'Life of Brian' kinda way.
Hello thread from a few weeks/months/years ago. We knew you'd be back. So we brought all of our logic and reasoning in the posts above. I will not add, because everyone here saying "Anti-hero", "Person just trying to get by." "Out of control Circumstances" have the exact same opinions I do. I'll let them speak for me.
You're selling Hawke short, OP. I don't know how you played your game, but in mine, Aveline couldn't stop praising all the good deeds my Hawke had performed. While it's true that Hawke couldn't stop Anders, he did help to minimize the damages after the explosion. He stopped Meredith and Orsino, and managed to gain support from just about everyone in town who wasn't a zealot or a bloodmage.
Here's just a small list of enemies that Hawke fought against to protect his friends and the general public: slavers, raiders, thugs, darkspawn, assassins, demons, corrupt Templars, bloodmages, abominations, Qunari, Tal-Vashoth, and rock wraiths.
No, he couldn't save everyone and he couldn't stop everyone. Most of his family died, but the hardships Hawke suffered in life helped mold him into such a remarkable person. Despite all the tragedy and looming dangers, he managed to rise from rags to riches and become one of the most powerful and influential people in Kirkwall. Nobody is trying to claim that Hawke is godlike, least of all Cassandra. But the feats he's pulled off aren't anything less than heroic. A lesser man would've died before even going on Bartrand's expedition.
Hawke saved lives. There are people who are alive and well today because of Hawke, and I don't think it's fair to neglect this fact just because he wasn't able to save everyone. Feynriel now lives in Tevinter and helps save people through his dreams; Lia was rescued from a crazed murderer and joined the Guard; Orana was saved from slavery and was given a paying job by Hawke; Emile de Launcet was aided in leaving the Circle; Ella was rescued from Ser Alrik and has become good friends with Bethany; Alain was saved twice by Hawke, and received a pardon from execution; Keran was proven to be free of demon possession and was allowed to remain a Templar.
Those are all the people I could think of off the top of my head of whom were saved by Hawke.
If we're going to start labeling people as heroes only when they pull off extraordinary, godlike feats that prevent all deaths, tragedy, and warfare, then the pool of heroes just became so exclusive that even Spider-Man and Superman aren't on the list. Both of these heroes have suffered tragic losses in their lives, have witnessed catastrophic horrors that they couldn't prevent, and they even at one point became enemies of the public.
Bottom line: Hawke was dealt a bad hand. He lost his father and home to the Blight, lost his brother to an Ogre, lost his sister to the Circle, lost his mother to a serial killer necromancer. He was dirt poor when he arrived in Kirkwall and his opportunistic uncle sold him into indentured servitude for a year. Out of all that, Hawke was able to rise up to be the Champion of Kirkwall. No, he couldn't stop the inevitable, but he at least managed to dampen the blow and make sure Kirkwall wasn't wiped off the map.
Varric was the one telling the story, so you can blame Varric for making hawke sound like the Hero.
Guest_TheDarkKnightReturns_*
The thing about Hawke is this... it's not their (in my case his) futility against overwhelming odds that make him a failure as hero. ****, that's what a hero's defining trait is reluctant or otherwise. It's the lack of a single proactive bone in his body. He doesn't do anything, at all, until the last minute and by then it's too damn late.
"Oh, there's a necromantic serial killer thriving in the city you say? I know, I'll tell the guards and forget about it for three years until my mother is kidnapped! What's the worst that can happen?"
"A corrupt spiritual leader purposefully spreading hate in an attempt to kick start a holy war? Let me just pretend she's a non-issue until hundreds upon hundreds of people die from an attempted foreign occupation! What's the worst that can happen?"
"One of my best friends is always talking about freedom and oppression and contstantly rages about the status quo while writing manifestos? He's also possessed by a spirit that doesn't understand right and wrong like the rest of the world you say? Let me give him a pat on the back and pretend like nothing bad can happen! What's the worst that can happen?"
It's this lackadaisical attitude that makes Hawke a failure as a hero. Not the failures themselves.
The thing is, Hawke is not a world-saving hero. She never wanted to be that either. She just wanted to get a life for her family, which was pretty much impossible due to the hard situations in which she got involved (without even wanting to).
That's what's original about DA2. We watched/played the world-saving hero (or galaxy saving hero) a hundred times. It was great to just play the story of someone trying to get a life for a change.
Hawke is actually an anti-hero. Not that he/she is evil, just they aren't the Hero of Fereldan or the Herald of Andraste. And Hawke wasn't trying to be. As someone else said, Hawke was/is supposed to be a tragic character. Not all stories have a happy ending. Yes, I know, moral dilemma.
Hawke is actually an anti-hero. Not that he/she is evil, just they aren't the Hero of Fereldan or the Herald of Andraste. And Hawke wasn't trying to be. As someone else said, Hawke was/is supposed to be a tragic character. Not all stories have a happy ending. Yes, I know, moral dilemma.
Not to be pedantic, but technically that isn't what an antihero is. The term antihero would apply to someone like Thomas Covenant.
Yeah, I don't recall Hawke ever really wanting to be a hero and pretty much stayed out of things until he/she was brought in at the last minute. Hawke pretty much was more concerned about his/her life and his/her family and friends than actually playing the hero. Usually when Hawke was brought in to solve a problem, things were going bad regardless.
Really, I'd say the Seekers and Chantry were more responsible for Kirkwall because it was their job to prevent these sorts of things. Hawke was just the scapegoat for it in my opinion.
Really, I see Hawke;s "failures" as more of an indictment of Kirkwall than of him.
The thing about Hawke is this... it's not their (in my case his) futility against overwhelming odds that make him a failure as hero. ****, that's what a hero's defining trait is reluctant or otherwise. It's the lack of a single proactive bone in his body. He doesn't do anything, at all, until the last minute and by then it's too damn late.
"Oh, there's a necromantic serial killer thriving in the city you say? I know, I'll tell the guards and forget about it for three years until my mother is kidnapped! What's the worst that can happen?"
"A corrupt spiritual leader purposefully spreading hate in an attempt to kick start a holy war? Let me just pretend she's a non-issue until hundreds upon hundreds of people die from an attempted foreign occupation! What's the worst that can happen?"
"One of my best friends is always talking about freedom and oppression and contstantly rages about the status quo while writing manifestos? He's also possessed by a spirit that doesn't understand right and wrong like the rest of the world you say? Let me give him a pat on the back and pretend like nothing bad can happen! What's the worst that can happen?"
It's this lackadaisical attitude that makes Hawke a failure as a hero. Not the failures themselves.
Not to mention that if Hawke was an failure for not being able to prevent disasters, doesn't that make an Cousland warden an failure for not preventing Howe from murdering their entire family? Or Aeducan for getting double crossed by Bhelen and exiled? I would say Kirkwall was more of an failure then Hawke himself. So much that for half an second I contemplated in asking the Arishok "hey, can I join you guys?"
My Hawke succeeded in love with Isabela and he succeeded in lopping an Arishok's head off which felt very satisfying(making the Qunari scurry home with tails between legs). He made a bunch friends and helped solve their own personal crises. Kirkwall was on auto destruct before he arrived and i found it interesting playing the character dragged into the maelstrom, doomed to an unwinnable fight.
Hawke is akward in Dragon Age: Inquisition.
I don't know if it was a mistake to bring this hero into the next story?
When you bring in a hero - like Hawke is supposed to be - he/she should have a much larger role in the game. A sidequest is not enough.
If Hawke was made a companion it would have been quite another story. But I guess this demands something extra. And perhaps the story would hang too much in Dragon Age 2?
Maybe Hawke should have had a major role in the end against Corypheus?
He doesn't mean to take over the role of the main character, but a supporting hero? After all Hwake is older and maybe not quite as active as he once was. Everything has its time.
Technically it shouldn't be a problem as you can import your Hawke stats from the Dragon Age Keep.
I know many fans like the idea of Hawke's apperance. But I am not sure if this was a good idea? Maybe it was even better to save this hero for the next sequel where 'a lot more is at stake'?
Guest_TheDarkKnightReturns_*
Hawke is akward in Dragon Age: Inquisition.
I don't know if it was a mistake to bring this hero into the next story?
When you bring in a hero - like Hawke is supposed to be - he/she should have a much larger role in the game. A sidequest is not enough.
If Hawke was made a companion it would have been quite another story. But I guess this demands something extra. And perhaps the story would hang too much in Dragon Age 2?
Maybe Hawke should have had a major role in the end against Corypheus?
He doesn't mean to take over the role of the main character, but a supporting hero? After all Hwake is older and maybe not quite as active as he once was. Everything has its time.
Technically it shouldn't be a problem as you can import your Hawke stats from the Dragon Age Keep.
I know many fans like the idea of Hawke's apperance. But I am not sure if this was a good idea? Maybe it was even better to save this hero for the next sequel where 'a lot more is at stake'?
I think it was a great idea to bring Hawke back. People that enjoyed the character got to see him (or her) again. People that weren't particularly fond of him got to finally make him a hero. For me, he stayed in the Fade to fight the Nightmare so that the Inquisitor could escape with Loghain and stop Corypheus from controlling the Wardens.
Hawke is akward in Dragon Age: Inquisition.
I don't know if it was a mistake to bring this hero into the next story?
When you bring in a hero - like Hawke is supposed to be - he/she should have a much larger role in the game. A sidequest is not enough.
If Hawke was made a companion it would have been quite another story. But I guess this demands something extra. And perhaps the story would hang too much in Dragon Age 2?
Maybe Hawke should have had a major role in the end against Corypheus?
He doesn't mean to take over the role of the main character, but a supporting hero? After all Hwake is older and maybe not quite as active as he once was. Everything has its time.
Technically it shouldn't be a problem as you can import your Hawke stats from the Dragon Age Keep.
I know many fans like the idea of Hawke's apperance. But I am not sure if this was a good idea? Maybe it was even better to save this hero for the next sequel where 'a lot more is at stake'?
I wouldn't call it a sidequest but yeah I get you, I think in the same vein as the Meredith fight in DA2, more characters should have been involved in the final fight, that would have been a good way for Hawke to get involved in the fight against Corypheus.
congrats, welcome to three years ago
This, and everything regarding Protagonist vs Antagonist dynamic is something David Gaider quite frankly never really got right in my opinion. I'd say his strengths are by far world-building and character banter. Alistair and Morrigan are his creations, that in itself is enough to be very praiseworthy.
Retour en haut