93 réponses à ce sujet

[Monica21]

I don't really understand the thought process behind removing healing in the first place. It's a staple of RPG mechanics.

 

I feel they needed to add too many defensive "things" to the game in order to compensate for no healing. This results in a steep difficulty curve at the start of the game that swiftly drops off once you can reliably apply barriers and guard. The game then becomes easy mode.

 

I'm still trying to figure out why they bothered with the supply caches during the longer, fighty-er quests when they could have just have passive regen. "We're not going to have passive regen but we're definitely going to put a supply cache in this cave no one's been in for 10 years."

[(Disgusted noise.)]

I'm still trying to figure out why they bothered with the supply caches during the longer, fighty-er quests when they could have just have passive regen. "We're not going to have passive regen but we're definitely going to put a supply cache in this cave no one's been in for 10 years."

That was silly. I definitely would have preferred to have regen outside of battle than having to cycle through and have everyone chug a potion even if they're only missing a fraction of a chunk of health every time I stumble upon a cache.

 

Otherwise, I think the health system is vastly superior to the other games and I do not miss heal spells at all. I would much rather see assignable skill points and full tactics return.

[woofyhugger]

Between Upgraded Healing/Regeneration Potions/Barrier/Guard and the immune to damage Knight Enchanter.. how much more healing do you need?!?

L2P!

[AlexMBrennan]

Between Upgraded Healing/Regeneration Potions/Barrier/Guard and the immune to damage Knight Enchanter.. how much more healing do you need?!?
L2P!

So exactly what's your argument for why barrier is better than healing? Having both is too much, therefore healing is bad and barriers are the pinnacle of game design brilliance? If they had cut barriers and kept healing, it would have been just as "balanced".

[cindercatz]

I think it's nice as a specialization, but I also like the whole guard thing, makes more sense for melee. But yeah, I like spirit healer and the way it works with the lore. I don't really think it makes much difference gameplay wise.

[Teddie Sage]

Current results for OP:
 

Should Dragon Ade Inquisition re-introduce healing magic??embed

1. Yes, same as other DA games from the start.

 

 245 votes (38%)

2. No potions are fine.

 

 216 votes (34%)

3. Yes, but only as a specialization, ie Spirit Healer.

 

 114 votes (18%)

4. I dont care either way.

 

 62 votes (10%)

637 total votes

[Wintermist]

Yeah I do prefer to have healing magic. It's an option, lose DPS but heal, or do more DPS but not heal. I wouldn't mind a simple heal, with a long cooldown, and to become a proper healer you'd need the specialization. That way you won't get the other more DPS focused ones, but have to settle for a healing focused specialization.

 

Mostly I want it to have the OPTION to have it. It's not mandatory to use it.

[Elhanan]

I prefer to have a base Healing spell, as well as Spirit Healer, but added to the current system. And I am all for tinkering with it all to find a relative balance.

[Spellbound7]

I do think healing should make a comeback, not because the combat doesn't work without it, but for the sake of lore consistency. I also find the DA:I potion mechanic kinda pointless, since you can just replenish them whenever you feel like it. Running out of pots? Good thing there's this camp around. Or nevermind, here's a supply cache of potions. IN THE FADE.

 

Yeah, not, bring healing spells back. you traded spamming heals to spamming Barriers.

 

I actually tried re-imagining the Mage ability trees here since I found the current ones boring and lackluster. Healing spells be present in Spirit tree.

[(Disgusted noise.)]

I do think healing should make a comeback, not because the combat doesn't work without it, but for the sake of lore consistency. I also find the DA:I potion mechanic kinda pointless, since you can just replenish them whenever you feel like it. Running out of pots? Good thing there's this camp around. Or nevermind, here's a supply cache of potions. IN THE FADE.

 

Yeah, not, bring healing spells back. you traded spamming heals to spamming Barriers.

 

I actually tried re-imagining the Mage ability trees here since I found the current ones boring and lackluster. Healing spells be present in Spirit tree.

Actually not having every mage be a potential healer is much more lore consistent. It's not supposed to be something everyone can do.

[Spellbound7]

Actually not having every mage be a potential healer is much more lore consistent. It's not supposed to be something everyone can do.

 

All mages could become healers (as in, cast a healing spell) in DA:O and DA2.

[Abraham_uk]

I do think healing should make a comeback, not because the combat doesn't work without it, but for the sake of lore consistency. I also find the DA:I potion mechanic kinda pointless, since you can just replenish them whenever you feel like it. Running out of pots? Good thing there's this camp around. Or nevermind, here's a supply cache of potions. IN THE FADE.

 

Yeah, not, bring healing spells back. you traded spamming heals to spamming Barriers.

 

I actually tried re-imagining the Mage ability trees here since I found the current ones boring and lackluster. Healing spells be present in Spirit tree.

 

This is a good thread. Thanks for the link.

[(Disgusted noise.)]

All mages could become healers (as in, cast a healing spell) in DA:O and DA2.

Actually, Merrill couldn't and the fact that all mages could be potential healers in the game play of DAO/DAA is contradictory to the actual lore of Thedas. 

 

Game mechanics =/= lore

[Spellbound7]

Actually, Merrill couldn't and the fact that all mages could be potential healers in the game play of DAO/DAA is contradictory to the actual lore of Thedas. 

 

Game mechanics =/= lore

 

Oh I forgot about Merill, but do you have the source that points to not all mages being capable of healing? I always saw this as a specialisation thing in the sense that all humans can become doctors, but few do; all mages can become healers, but few do. Y'know, kinda like that.

 

 

This is a good thread. Thanks for the link. 

 

You're welcome

[CDR Aedan Cousland]

For me it's a lack of consistency rather than necessity. 

 

DA:O and DA2 - Mages had access to one basic healing spell (DA2 mages didn't have Regenerate but did have Healing Aura as a Spirit Healer). Spirit Healers had a more powerful suite of spells for group healing, keeping party members from dying or reviving fallen members. Potions were never auto-replenished but could be crafted.

 

DA:I - Mages seem to have forgotten that they knew how to cast basic Healing magic in previous games and despite the many instances of dialogue mentioning Healing magic it is strangely absent in it's most basic form. We do have Revival and the KE has a super combo of Group Revival, Group Heal and Group Regeneration (a little too strong honestly, group revive at 50% health and stamina/mana would have been fine on it's own). 

 

The absence of Healing magic flies in the face of lore along with current and previous games' dialogue. It's been a part of the Dragon Age series from the beginning, even Guard and Barrier mechanics were there just not as health bars. It just seems wrong to me that it's missing so suddenly.

 

Edit: Most especially since the other mechanics survived in one form or another and were buffed (free health potion refills, Regeneration potion upgrades to heal the entire party, healing grenades (Kolto Bomb anyone?), Guard generation for all classes with crafting and little to no Barrier downtime with the right passives) to compensate for the lack of Healing spells.

 

Agreed. Despite the canon mention of mage healers, the blatant lack of simple healing spells almost made it feel like Bioware ret-conned mages being able to use magic to heal. A quick, simple healing spell is supposed to elementary (especially for circle mages). It's incredibly jarring and inconsistent. On that note, the currency change was really abrupt and jarring as well, even though, once again, it's still canonically the copper to silver to gold system. What is Bioware thinking when they do these things?

[CDR Aedan Cousland]

Oh I forgot about Merill, but do you have the source that points to not all mages being capable of healing? I always saw this as a specialisation thing in the sense that all humans can become doctors, but few do; all mages can become healers, but few do. Y'know, kinda like that.

 

 

As far as Merrill goes, I'd reason that her blood magic interferes with her ability to cast benevolent spells. (But, on the other hand, mage Hawke can still heal and use blood magic. Same with a mage Warden.)

[DomeWing333]

Agreed. Despite the canon mention of mage healers, the blatant lack of simple healing spells almost made it feel like Bioware ret-conned mages being able to use magic to heal. A quick, simple healing spell is supposed to elementary (especially for circle mages). It's incredibly jarring and inconsistent. On that note, the currency change was really abrupt and jarring as well, even though, once again, it's still canonically the copper to silver to gold system. What is Bioware thinking when they do these things?

Interestingly, mages in Inquisition can still learn Revival. In fact, all of them can despite the fact that Revival was a Spirit Healer-only spell in Origins and DA2. I guess the explanation for this is that lore-wise, the distinction between Heal and Revival doesn't really make much sense, so they just collapsed them into one spell. 

[Spellbound7]

As far as Merrill goes, I'd reason that her blood magic interferes with her ability to cast benevolent spells. (But, on the other hand, mage Hawke can still heal and use blood magic. Same with a mage Warden.)

 

That does make sense. Solas does mention that Blood Magic makes it hard to connect to the Fade (because it's a separate power source, I'd imgaine), therefore Fade-based healing magic would be difficult.

[Poisd2Strike]

Since I played a Mage in DAO, I was initially bothered by the lack of true healing magic.  Then I learned to use barrier, guard and healing potions more effectively in combat, and am no longer bothered by it.  However, it would have been nice to have health slowly regenerate outside of combat but IIRC there is a potion that will allow health to regenerate.  I just have never bothered to craft it.  Also, it would be nice if Barrier stayed at 100% until you actually start to take damage.   My Inquisitor is KE anyway and has crafted armor equipped that grants guard on hit, so the game isn't very difficult.

Modifié par Poisd2Strike, 30 mars 2015 - 12:36 .

[Morroian]

I'm still trying to figure out why they bothered with the supply caches during the longer, fighty-er quests when they could have just have passive regen. "We're not going to have passive regen but we're definitely going to put a supply cache in this cave no one's been in for 10 years."

 

My guess is that they weren't originally in the game but then they realised late that something like it was needed to get through some of those fights or areas. 
 

I voted the return of healing as in the previous magic because its my contention that potions aren't much different and there's too much busywork involved in DAI with potions.

[Cz-99]

The whole Mage 'tree' should have made a comeback, healing included. 

[Hexoduen]

The whole Mage 'tree' should have made a comeback, healing included. 

 

Hear hear!   There is too little variation with only 20 spells to choose from. The new protection spells are cool, but I'd wish they had been implemented as an addition to the old (rebalanced) spells, instead of throwing most of the old spells out the window.

 

One way to go about the problem with the healing spells Bioware wanted to fix, was to have given them X no. of uses per 'day' (before returning to camp). This way they could not be spammed as in Origins, they'd be limited like potions, but they would still be a lot more interesting than having to spam the same barrier spell over and over again.

 

(I'm ignoring KE because those spells won't do. I'm talking about standard healing spells)

[Spellbound7]

It's true that healing spells can be a bit overpowered sometimes. One way I imagine might balance things out a little was if you make them channelling. This way, you sacrifice damage potential to heal a team member, as opposed to just throw down a heal and immediately after resume attacking. You could add things like cast time to your spells as well, so if you take too much damage your spellcasting is interrupted, like in Origins.

 

Or just make it cost so much mana you can't use any spells for a short while after healing someone.

 

This is needs to be tested, ofc.