207 réponses à ce sujet

[Enrychan]

You can't avoid Meredith talking about Hawke's mother. Every reaction is negative (diplomatic, aggressive, even sarcastic calls it a low blow). Hawke's father being forced to use blood magic is a fact. Leandra dying because of (all the events started by one) blood mage is unavoidable. These aren't head canon. They're fixed into the narrative. All players will engage with these. Two of the closest people to Hawke were subject to other people using blood magic. Sure, people have different decisions on their playthrough. But these are examples alone can contribute to Hawke despising blood magic.

 

Again, this is what you thought while playing. Some of my Hawkes thought the same, in fact. Others didn't. In Legacy nothing forces you to think that blood magic is bad. On the contrary, blood magic is what held Corypheus for hundreds of years. Hawke can be pissed off by the fact that the Wardens FORCED Malcom to perform the ritual and threatened his family to convince him, NOT by the fact that he used blood magic per se.

The number of blood mages you kill during the game has literally 0 to do with this. You also kill dozens of raiders for example but I don't see Hawke hating raiders specifically. And Merrill? You can actually support her during the entire game, so. Roleplaying!

[Arakat]

Not really.  Even without the class tree, you could support Merrill's blood magic.  You could cut deals with demons.  You could read the forbidden tomes.  There was a whole side of the game that allowed you to support blood magic.

 

Exactly. I have an evil Hawke who did all of those things, and she's going to sound like such a hypocrite in Inquisition. I actually find it more hilarious than annoying, though, because I can headcanon her just saying all those anti-blood magic things to troll people. But I still wish Hawke's reactions were more variable.

[Treacherous J Slither]

All this hating on blood magic is ridiculous. It has no agency and can do nothing on it's own.

 

What happened to Hawke's mother was a tragedy but blood magic isn't responsible for that. The mentally ill mage Quentin is the one responsible.

 

People all over Thedas are killing each other with mundane weapons every day yet no one blames these weapons for an act and not the people that wield them.

 

Railing against bandits makes sense because a bandit is someone who preys upon others. This is something they chose to do. Railing against blood mages makes no sense unless the individuals in question have committed some vile act. Being a blood mage isn't something inherently negative itself since the person has to make the actual decision to harm others and it's entirely possible for them to choose not to.

[robertthebard]

I'll start of by saying that I really enjoyed having Hawke return and make an appearance in Inquisition.  It was one of my favorite moments in the game when Varric said "Inquisitor, meet Hawke - Champion of Kirkwall."  It was really cool to fight along side one of the previous game's protagonists, and I really wish the Hero of Ferelden had been there as well.
 
But, Bioware completely failed to bring into account if you played Hawke as a Bloodmage or not (or if you were not a blood mage, but played as a character who supported it).  In Inquisition, Hawke chastises the Wardens and generally complains a lot of about blood magic... even if he was a blood mage himself! 
 
I didn't notice this the first time I played, because my "good" Hawke was a snarky rogue.  But my "evil" Hawke was an aggressive blood mage.
 
While they did a good job of keeping the diplomatic, sarcastic, or aggressive personalities... they screwed up big time by making Hawke default to being anti-blood magic.  It almost makes me wish he didn't show up at all because they did a half-assed job with him. 
 
In short, main-protagonist cameos are great, but make sure you invest the time a resources into getting them right!  It would have been easy to add a tile to the Keep to show whether Hawke supported Blood magic or not.

This post right here? This is exactly the reason they can't bring the Warden back. Check out the rage about blood mage or not, and imagine that, amplified with "But my Warden wouldn't say that", "My Warden didn't sound like that", "My Warden didn't look like that", and you'll see why they gave the HoFs that survived Origins a mission on the War Table, and nothing else. Oh, that blood mage rage? It's sort of ironic in that even if you were a blood mage, the game never acknowledges it, in either game.

[Teddie Sage]

Maybe he was in character and you didn't understand his character in the first place while playing DA2? Just my two cents.

[Wulfram]

Yes, I wasn't very satisfied with Hawke.  Even aside from the blood magic issue, I just didn't think they seemed much like my character.

 

Warden would certainly be worse, since they don't have the advantage of the voice actor to provide continuity.

[Teddie Sage]

Well, there's also the fact you can't upload your Hawke directly to the game and are forced to make decisions on the Keep, so by default a Hawke that used to be a Blood mage is now just a mage and has been written like someone who doesn't like blood magic.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

I was more disappointed that sarcastic Hawke wasn't half the lovable sociopath she was in DA2

[Treacherous J Slither]

I don't want my dagger Hawke to soapbox about how horrible blood magic is because she wouldn't do that sort of thing. It's very out of character. Her father was a blood mage and a good man.

 

When Merrill took down that barrier in the mountains she had summoned a demon to do so. Demons have minds of their own and many are treacherous by nature. What she did risked all our lives and she did so without warning. If the demon turned on her we'd have been caught unawares. That's what my Hawke was upset about.

[Dabrikishaw]

I'm with you Fardreamer. I'm convinced Bioware made Hawke default to anti-Blood Magic because they needed a character fans cared about to argue against the Grey Wardens.

 

Before any confusion shows up, I'm not saying I agree in the roleplay sense because that's nonsensical. I'm saying the defaulted opinion was done for the story.

[Kirikou]

I don't want my dagger Hawke to soapbox about how horrible blood magic is because she wouldn't do that sort of thing. It's very out of character. Her father was a blood mage and a good man.
 
When Merrill took down that barrier in the mountains she had summoned a demon to do so. Demons have minds of their own and many are treacherous by nature. What she did risked all our lives and she did so without warning. If the demon turned on her we'd have been caught unawares. That's what my Hawke was upset about.

No! NO! Malcolm Hawke was not a blood Mage, he was forced to use it but he never used it again or before. If you listen to his ghost or take Bethany with you they clearly say that. Bethany is shocked by his use of it saying he taught her better and Malcolm doesn't like it one bit.

It's been four years, stop thinking the mind set of your Hawke is the same as it was. Things change and people change.

[Fardreamer]

You don't change your lifestyle and ideals in just 4 years, unless you're an impressionable student.

[Kirikou]

You don't change your lifestyle and ideals in just 4 years, unless you're an impressionable student.

Or you've suffered great hardships and tragedies, it's totally possible.

[Treacherous J Slither]

No! NO! Malcolm Hawke was not a blood Mage, he was forced to use it but he never used it again or before. If you listen to his ghost or take Bethany with you they clearly say that. Bethany is shocked by his use of it saying he taught her better and Malcolm doesn't like it one bit.

It's been four years, stop thinking the mind set of your Hawke is the same as it was. Things change and people change.

 

Did the Wardens teach him blood magic or did he know it already?

 

My Hawke would never start blaming the tools and not the people who use them because she prided herself on her logical, pragmatic view of the world. Mages NOT using blood magic seemed silly to her. Why would you not use your most powerful weapon in a fight for your life?

[Teddie Sage]

I figure they summoned a demon to teach him blood magic... *shrugs*

[Palidane]

Well, for the record, I loved seeing Hawke again, and felt he was perfectly in character. Maybe it would have been nice for him to have some more sarcastic diologue, but other than that, I have no complaints.

[robertthebard]

Did the Wardens teach him blood magic or did he know it already?
 
My Hawke would never start blaming the tools and not the people who use them because she prided herself on her logical, pragmatic view of the world. Mages NOT using blood magic seemed silly to her. Why would you not use your most powerful weapon in a fight for your life?

So your Hawke decided to completely disregard the events in Kirkwall.

[New Kid]

I can understand why some people felt this way, but I felt like the 'out of character' feel worked for my Hawke, it really felt like the 7-years of Kirkwall and being on the run had weighed her down. She didn't mind blood magic too much during the game, but based on all the **** it caused, especially Orsino, I like to think she has developed a fear of it.

[Arakat]

The general assumption here seems to be that Hawke is a (relatively) good person who reacts to things like normal, good people do. In that case, yes, he/she probably makes sense in Inquisition. But really, as I mentioned earlier, my Hawke who made deals with demons and owned a slave has no reason to start preaching about the dangers of blood magic.

[2leggywillow]

Hawke has been canonically against blood magic since DA2's Legacy DLC.  Blood magic was included pretty reluctantly, I believe, and probably intended to be taken as a game mechanic separate of the character herself.  I'm pretty sure several of the team members said they wished it hadn't been included at all (a wish we now see fulfilled by not including it in DAI) but given DA2's short development time... who knows?  Maybe they didn't have time to develop another mage spec.

 

Point is, I think Bioware's always been pretty matter-of-fact about blood mage not making much sense in the DA2 narrative and that while it's fine if you want to play with that game mechanic, don't expect the narrative to match up with it.

 

There's also a simple headcanon around it that makes it not OOC at all: Hawke is lying when she decries blood magic, which is what any smart blood mage would be doing anyway given the circumstances.  Bam, OOC problems solved.

[Treacherous J Slither]

So your Hawke decided to completely disregard the events in Kirkwall.

 

My Hawke didn't disregard anything. There were a lot of bad people in Kirkwall doing bad things. Some used magic and others swords, daggers, axes, or bows.

 

The tool used is irrelevant. What the person decides to do with the tool is what matters. Why is that so difficult to understand?

[robertthebard]

My Hawke didn't disregard anything. There were a lot of bad people in Kirkwall doing bad things. Some used magic and others swords, daggers, axes, or bows.
 
The tool used is irrelevant. What the person decides to do with the tool is what matters. Why is that so difficult to understand?

I'm not having a problem grasping anything. I just recall spending an entire chapter fighting blood mages/abominations. Why are the actual events in the game so hard to remember, but we have a thread saying Hawke was OOC? I mean, seriously, can anyone that can't remember events in the game actually remember if Hawke is in or out of character?

[Reznore57]

I didn't like the idea , but I warmed up to it after a while , it ended in me being royally fed up with Hawke.

I felt better when I let her die , (except for the whole Varric mourning thing ) , but it got the point of painful and I just didn't want to see her anymore.

 

So I'm back to square one , please Bioware don't turn pc into npc , it's not fun.

It didn't bring anything to the table for Hawke story , and if you let her live , it's just sad how she says she's responsible for Cory , and all the mess the Inquisitor is dealing with but decide to go deal with the wardens for no reasons at all.

The wardens have higher up in Weisshaupt , she goes to the north when all the trouble she's more or less responsible for happens in the south.

How is this even supposed to make sense ?

 

Also the female voice actress was bordeline awful at times.

[Treacherous J Slither]

I can understand why some people felt this way, but I felt like the 'out of character' feel worked for my Hawke, it really felt like the 7-years of Kirkwall and being on the run had weighed her down. She didn't mind blood magic too much during the game, but based on all the **** it caused, especially Orsino, I like to think she has developed a fear of it.

 

Blood magic didn't cause anything. It cannot think for itself or even perform the simplest of tasks. It is simply a school of magic.

 

People have used blood magic for a variety of things good and bad and whatever issues anyone has with any of the events that have taken place involving the use of blood magic should take these issues up with these particular individuals and attribute whatever blame there is to them and their actions.

[daveliam]

And it's ultimately the reasons in the OP that they are better off just leaving past protagonists in the past.  If we play as a different protagonist in DA4 (which i hope), I really don't need to see the Inquisitor popping up.  Send me a letter letting me know what he's up to and explaining why he can't be there and I'll be happy.  I'm much happier with the way that The Warden was portrayed in this game than Hawke.  Although I did appreciate being able to kill him off so that I don't have to worry about him popping his bumbling head up in a future game.