241 réponses à ce sujet

[txgoldrush]

so you are arguing that ME's presentation of the same thing that had already existed is evidence of it being an influential and industry changing game?

 

It broke no new ground, in the case of ME1 and ME3 wasn't particularly well developed, and has been done better by numerous other series (including DA), but ME IS STILL THE BESTEST?

 

good lord

Wow you are daft. Name me a game that used paraphrasing for full voiced dialogue beofre Mass Effect, you can't.

 

The fact is that it did break new ground. Mass Effect paved the way to have dialogue choices presented cinematically and seamlessly. You just do not want to get that through your head. Of course ME1's wheel wasn't well developed. It was the first game to use such a wheel, and it was improved in later games and ME3 cut the fat, which was good.

[Steelcan]

 

And notice how I didn't use sales in my argument at all, I used influence with the industry, which is more important than even sales.

and also impossible to objectively verify

[Ashagar]

Things can't be facts just because you want them too. The consensus among cartographers were that the world was flat. See how that panned out. The consensus among drug manufacturers of the late 1800's was that cocain had no adverse side effects. The point is just because people share opinions it's still just that, opinion.

Sales are another area that show nothing in terms of fact. If it did then Destiny is the best game ever. Seriously, you have an opinion and that's ok but don't feed me **** and tell me it's steak sir.

 

And that bit about believing the world was flat makes me wince as it wasn't true, people knew the world wasn't flat. What they belived was the world was far bigger than people like Columbus was claiming it was which is why they thought he was going to die because nobody knew the Americas was there and he'd run out of food and water long before he reached the east indies.

 

That being said comparing the two series is just silly, one is a dark fantasy RPG and other is a space opera Sci-Fi RPG series.

[txgoldrush]

and also impossible to objectively verify

So, seeing other games influenced by the game is impossible to objectively verify? Get real.

[Steelcan]

Wow you are daft. Name me a game that used paraphrasing for full voiced dialogue beofre Mass Effect, you can't.

 

The fact is that it did break new ground. Mass Effect paved the way to have dialogue choices presented cinematically and seamlessly. You just do not want to get that through your head. Of course ME1's wheel wasn't well developed. It was the first game to use such a wheel, and it was improved in later games and ME3 cut the fat, which was good.

ME3's wheel was the worst of the lot, but you can't admit that the game had any flaws whatsoever

 

ME took an existing system and prettied it up, it did not invent anything new, nor was it well implemented, so I continue to wait for your proof that ME is genre defining and industry modeling.

 

Its dialogue wheel was poorly done and has been done much better by others, its combat is directly lifted from other TPS, and its plot and lore are not unique either.

[KaiserShep]

Dragon Age as a universe is great, as a game series it fails, why ? answer is that its not consistent

Comparing consistency is pretty meaningless, because Mass Effect is about a single protagonist and a single main conflict over the course of a trilogy, whereas Dragon Age has a new conflict and protagonist for each game, so obviously there will be a different focus on certain themes.

[Steelcan]

So, seeing other games influenced by the game is impossible to objectively verify? Get real.

yes it is, there is no way to verify the idea wasn't an in-house idea that someone beat them to punch on.

 

And barring a dev admission you can't say for sure something was influenced by another game.  You can guess, but that's all it is.  You only go to the extreme because your fanboyism puts bronies to shame

[Rannik]

Calling DA2 hack&slash makes Bayonetta cry.

 

Please stop 

[OHB MajorV]

says the Dragon Age fanboy. You proved nothing.

And notice how I didn't use sales in my argument at all, I used influence with the industry, which is more important than even sales.

I don't believe I've given any indication on my feelings about the franchise. While I like it, I'm far from a fanboy. You on the other hand give numerous examples of being sheps boy toy.

ME didn't pave the way for anything honestly. KOTOR did. Revan is my generations Shepard. Dragon age does a lot of things well. It's easy to come and bash the things left out. Yet all the inspiration that ME supposedly bestowed on you I don't see your game for sale. Oh well, maybe one day someone will live up to your expectations.

[txgoldrush]

I don't believe I've given any indication on my feelings about the franchise. While I like it, I'm far from a fanboy. You on the other hand give numerous examples of being sheps boy toy.

ME didn't pave the way for anything honestly. KOTOR did. Revan is my generations Shepard. Dragon age does a lot of things well. It's easy to come and bash the things left out. Yet all the inspiration that ME supposedly bestowed on you I don't see your game for sale. Oh well, maybe one day someone will live up to your expectations.

KOTOR paved the way as well, but not its dialogue wheel. KOTOR served as a norm change between 2d and 3d, with fully voiced characters. Mass Effect found a way to involve the dialogue from the protagonist more cinematically. Its a step forward from KOTOR. Look at the difference between DAO and DAI.

[o Ventus]

Critic scores, the consensus of them, is a fact. That the Mass Effect series outscored the DA series is a cold hard fact.

That doesn't make one actually better than the other, because quality differs on a person-to-person basis. Why do you insist on completely ignoring that? A blanket statement like "DA is bad but ME is really good" is beyond incompetent.

[txgoldrush]

Why is it being claimed as some sort of objective truth  that spoken dialogue with a wheel is superior to unspoken with a list of responses?  I like both and see advantages to both.  If you "need" a spoken voice for your character, I'd say your suffering from a lack of imagination.

When did I even make that argument. But for Bioware games, th enew system is better. For other games like New vegas, the old system works fine.

[Steelcan]

What do you mean by cinematically?  In cutscenes?  KotOR did it

[txgoldrush]

That doesn't make one actually better than the other, because quality differs on a person-to-person basis. Why do you insist on completely ignoring that? A blanket statement like "DA is bad but ME is really good" is beyond incompetent.

I don;t, but there are reasons why ME outscored DA....its the DA fanboys that want to ignore this.

[Rip504]

Yawns.

[txgoldrush]

What do you mean by cinematically?  In cutscenes?  KotOR did it

Not dialogue trees. Action maybe, but they have to pause the action for dialogue. Now after Mass Effect, they can have dialogue during for example, a shootout.

[Bann Duncan]

Meh.

 

Stupid as this thread is, the Mass Effect haters who have flooded it are no less annoying than the open trolls.

[Steelcan]

I don;t, but there are reasons why ME outscored DA....its the DA fanboys that want to ignore this.

reviews are poor way to determine quality, especially in this day and age

[txgoldrush]

Oh, sorry.  I'll admit I probably just inferred you felt that way by your posts and figured it was one of the reasons you felt DA:O was inferior.

I do think DAO's way is inferior, but thats because it doesn't work as well in a Bioware type game. For a Fallout game, the old system still works and works well. I wish Bethesda learned more from New vegas.

[o Ventus]

I don;t, but there are reasons why ME outscored DA....its the DA fanboys that want to ignore this.

ME scoring higher than DA has nothing to do with anything.

 

Gears of War 3 has a 91 on Metacritic, whilst Halo 3 has a 94 on the same site. Does this mean that Halo 3 is better than Gears? No, because the two games are vastly different from one another outside them both being shooters. Likewise, both DA and ME are a series of RPGs, but neither is better than the other. Why do you insist on embarrassing yourself with these asinine threads?

[txgoldrush]

reviews are poor way to determine quality, especially in this day and age

and fan and user reviews are even worse. So critics are better to go by. And they articulate better.

[Steelcan]

Not dialogue trees. Action maybe, but they have to pause the action for dialogue. Now after Mass Effect, they can have dialogue during for example, a shootout.

conversation options are still chosen during a "pause" this isn't Telltale where dialogue options are timed

[slimgrin]

Evidence is up there in my XCOM Declassified photo.

 

The dialogue wheel is an innovative feature that influenced the industry as well as its cinematic nature when it comes to WRPGs. Mass Effect paved the way in how to do cinematics and dialogue choices at the same time.

 

The Witcher 2 (and 3), Deus Ex HR, Alpha Protocol, XCom Declassified, Dreamfall Chapters, The Walking Dead, hell even FFXIII-2 all have similiar or the same systems.

 

The dialog wheel is an abomination that should fry in hell. But you're right about the cinematic touch in conversation cut scenes. Mass Effect was heavily influential in that regard. OT: Mass Effect is Bioware's flagship IP after Baldur's Gate and always has been.