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[rigron]

It seems Bioware may have been grinding an axe for her since she opts to ignore whatever the new Divine intends except for Freedom (Leliana) in which she still ends up building a mage conclave which may become a threat in future.

Which is precisely against a lot of what the Mages whom have seen what Uncontrolled Magic causes (Connor, Viv, several different former Apostates and Circle members)

Fiona comes off in DA: I as an incredibly selfish and incompetent leader that puts her own desires and vision of mages against the others (why in the Viv as Divine ending, a large bulk of the Mages outright disown her and walk away)

 

The confirmed (both by the books and in the game itself) majority of mages support Fiona and her visions on the freedom of mages. Of course she ignores whatever Cassandra or Female Montgomery Burns intend as new divines and only accepts Leliana, why would she accept what the other 2 offer when it goes against the majority of mages will and their rights?

 

Fiona comes off in DA:I as a great leader who had (and has) to take big hard choices in the past affecting her destiny and the destiny of the majority of mages yet is willing to do anything she is capable of if that means a better tomorrow for her kind and bears in mind over any other matter the safety of mages. If anyone plays the Mages side quest anyone can see that what "fucked off" everything is Alexius with his time magic (performed after your meeting in Val Royeaux with Fiona), changing the past promising Fiona safety for the weak mages and the children mages under the wing of the Tevinter Imperium. Because yeah, Templars kill innocent childrens too under their stupid justification of "what if...?"

[Steelcan]

so Vivienne's talk of mage fighting mage in the rebellion, and how Fiona barely mustered 50% in order to carry out her vote should be ignored...

[Mr.House]

The confirmed (both by the books and in the game itself) majority of mages support Fiona and her visions on the freedom of mages. Of course she ignores whatever Cassandra or Female Montgomery Burns intend as new divines and only accepts Leliana, why would she accept what the other 2 offer when it goes against the majority of mages will and their rights?

 

Fiona comes off in DA:I as a great leader who had (and has) to take big hard choices in the past affecting her destiny and the destiny of the majority of mages yet is willing to do anything she is capable of if that means a better tomorrow for her kind and bears in mind over any other matter the safety of mages. If anyone plays the Mages side quest anyone can see that what "fucked off" everything is Alexius with his time magic (performed after your meeting in Val Royeaux with Fiona), changing the past promising Fiona safety for the weak mages and the children mages under the wing of the Tevinter Imperium. Because yeah, Templars kill innocent childrens too under their stupid justification of "what if...?"

Please. A great leader does not betray their people and sell them into slavery and then makes shitty excuses for it.

[Mr.House]

so Vivienne's talk of mage fighting mage in the rebellion, and how Fiona barely mustered 50% in order to carry out her vote should be ignored...

Vivie is a great leader, Fiona is a moron who's whole faction crumbled into ashes.

[EmissaryofLies]

She's just another casualty in Bioware's bid to make libertarians and like-minded mages look like Hitler. It's Anders x100 and it's very lazy writing.

[Steelcan]

She's just another casualty in Bioware's bid to make libertarians and like-minded mages look like Hitler. It's Anders x100 and it's very lazy writing.

if they really wanted to discredit the libertarians they'd have written in a lot of abominations

[Giantdeathrobot]

http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Fiona

 

"If the Inquisitor chooses to meet with the templars instead of the mages, then Fiona and her compatriots would be brainwashed by the Venatori and used in the attack on Haven, in which the Inquisitor is forced to kill her." 

 

Unless some other source says otherwise, I'm going to trust the Wiki.

 

Wikis can be edited by anyone. Until a dev says so, this is as much speculation as anything else.

 

Plus, the only blood magic ritual we saw Corypheus's forces use that branwashed mages requires a willing mage. Nowhere in lore, anyway, is it said that a blood mage could completely brainwash someone as skilled as Fiona. She was either in Haven willingly or submitted to the binding ritual. Both cases don't help her seem any less of a failure.

[EmissaryofLies]

if they really wanted to discredit the libertarians they'd have written in a lot of abominations

 

Selling out to Venatori of Tevinter; they might as well be.

[hellbiter88]

.

[hellbiter88]

Wikis can be edited by anyone. Until a dev says so, this is as much speculation as anything else.

 

Plus, the only blood magic ritual we saw Corypheus's forces use that branwashed mages requires a willing mage. Nowhere in lore, anyway, is it said that a blood mage could completely brainwash someone as skilled as Fiona. She was either in Haven willingly or submitted to the binding ritual. Both cases don't help her seem any less of a failure.

 

 

I'm late to this party but it also states this on p. 39 of the official guide.

[Mr.House]

I'm late to this party but it also states this on p. 39 of the official guide.

A guide is not a true source, it is there to help you in the game, what it says about writing is very debatable.

[hellbiter88]

A guide is not a true source, it is there to help you in the game, what it says about writing is very debatable.

 

says you. anyway i was just confirming two sources as opposed to the one.

[Giantdeathrobot]

She's just another casualty in Bioware's bid to make libertarians and like-minded mages look like Hitler. It's Anders x100 and it's very lazy writing.

 

Eh? Two of the three mages in the party would be instantly killed by most Templars for heresy or apostasy. Solas is almost constantly shown as being more knowledgeable about magic than, well, anyone else (as he should be, considering), while Dorian is a mage who wants freedom but isn't stupid about it either and recognizes things are more complicated than ''hurr durr MY freedoms!''. 

 

Bioware is less showing that all non-Circle mages are idiots, and more than Fiona herself is just a bad leader who has made bad decisions time and again. Just like the Templars has a long procession of bad leaders until Barris entered the picture.

[MadMaximoff]

The confirmed (both by the books and in the game itself) majority of mages support Fiona and her visions on the freedom of mages. Of course she ignores whatever Cassandra or Female Montgomery Burns intend as new divines and only accepts Leliana, why would she accept what the other 2 offer when it goes against the majority of mages will and their rights?

 

Fiona comes off in DA:I as a great leader who had (and has) to take big hard choices in the past affecting her destiny and the destiny of the majority of mages yet is willing to do anything she is capable of if that means a better tomorrow for her kind and bears in mind over any other matter the safety of mages. If anyone plays the Mages side quest anyone can see that what "fucked off" everything is Alexius with his time magic (performed after your meeting in Val Royeaux with Fiona), changing the past promising Fiona safety for the weak mages and the children mages under the wing of the Tevinter Imperium. Because yeah, Templars kill innocent childrens too under their stupid justification of "what if...?"

 

 

Lest we forget she allowed Mages to commit atrocities under her leadership (killing Tranquil)

 

She openly incited Rebellion and was trying to vote for War before the Increased Tensions at Kirkwall and was heavily outvoted.

 

She made her personal relationship with the Grey Wardens worse by being smug about her situation rather than remaining sympathetic to them (several of the Wardens she has seen undergo the joining too)

 

She used Fear to Garner support several times, the Fear of "What Ifs" (Kirkwall & Redcliffe) making her no better than the corrupt leadership of the Templar Order.

 

Then after all that, she tries to start a 2nd Mage Rebellion if Viv is Divine (a highly successful mage that has insight into the plight of mages and how the Circle should be)

 

She's just Horrible and no better than Knight Commander Merridith

[Ranadiel Marius]

So for the few people who are actually defending Fiona, I am curious, what the fudge was her end game in all this? Her plan consisted of ally with Tevinter to save the mages from the Templars.....how exactly is Tevinter supposed to help against anti-magic troops? They have no contingencies to anti-magic because their Templars can't do that. So was she expecting them to send armies of non-magical soldiers to invade foreign territory just to rescue her useless ass? The plan was clearly not to just quietly go to Tevinter since they took over Redcliffe. So had the whole thing not just been a plan on behalf of Cory, what did she think was going to happen?

 

I'm late to this party but it also states this on p. 39 of the official guide.

Yes let's cite to the guide which claims that there are 73 mosaic pieces, because it has clearly been checked throughly to make sure that it is error free.....and let's ignore the fact that it wasn't actually written by Bioware. It is clearly a lore source as highly valued and accurate as the game itself!

[hellbiter88]

So for the few people who are actually defending Fiona, I am curious, what the fudge was her end game in all this? Her plan consisted of ally with Tevinter to save the mages from the Templars.....how exactly is Tevinter supposed to help against anti-magic troops? They have no contingencies to anti-magic because their Templars can't do that. So was she expecting them to send armies of non-magical soldiers to invade foreign territory just to rescue her useless ass? The plan was clearly not to just quietly go to Tevinter since they took over Redcliffe. So had the whole thing not just been a plan on behalf of Cory, what did she think was going to happen?

 

Yes let's cite to the guide which claims that there are 73 mosaic pieces, because it has clearly been checked throughly to make sure that it is error free.....and let's ignore the fact that it wasn't actually written by Bioware. It is clearly a lore source as highly valued and accurate as the game itself!

 

Not sure where the sarcasm is coming from. Is it no more or less reliable than a wiki with no author? And as I stated above, I'm not taking a stance on this one way or another (I don't really care). Just pointing out another source.

[eyezonlyii]

I just want to know wh teveryoy some think the time magic screwed her up. The only thing the time magic did was erase the meeting between her and the inquisitor, not the fact that they were already under fereldan protection. So as somebody said upthread, she should recognize she was safe everyday she woke up with food, water and shelter for her and her charges.

SN: I would have loved it more if Vivienne's recruitment had to do more with loyalist mages. Just so we could get the sense that she too was a leader. As it is now, they tell you she is, but it's hardly shown.

[Ranadiel Marius]

Not sure where the sarcasm is coming from. Is it no more or less reliable than a wiki with no author? And as I stated above, I'm not taking a stance on this one way or another (I don't really care). Just pointing out another source.

Sarcasm is coming from me because I am a snarky person. I'd say it is just as reliable as the wiki because the wiki author probably got the idea from the guide. Point I was making is simply that the guide is not an official source and has horrible editing so it is hardly a reliable source (other than the maps which seem to be half decent).

[EmissaryofLies]

Eh? Two of the three mages in the party would be instantly killed by most Templars for heresy or apostasy. Solas is almost constantly shown as being more knowledgeable about magic than, well, anyone else (as he should be, considering), while Dorian is a mage who wants freedom but isn't stupid about it either and recognizes things are more complicated than ''hurr durr MY freedoms!''. 

 

Bioware is less showing that all non-Circle mages are idiots, and more than Fiona herself is just a bad leader who has made bad decisions time and again. Just like the Templars has a long procession of bad leaders until Barris entered the picture.

 

Solas is an anomaly and Cassandra spends half the game complimenting him on being a 'good mage'. Not sure about Dorian; he seems much more concerned with his countrymen than the Mage/Templar issue. Fiona did not operate alone in Asunder and in Inquisition her mages were complicit with her short sighted decision making.

 

The Templars had multiple veterans who fought against the threat and fessed up to their mistake. Not to mention Cullen having a good head on his shoulders and being as fair as possible. All in all they appeared to be a faction who screwed up but were ultimately redeemable.

 

Fiona's faction couldn't have looked worse if they had all become abominations in the middle of Skyhold. That and the game constantly reminding you that a free mage, a Tevinter, was the root of all evil. And if that is somehow not enough, I have Cassandra, Sera, Iron Bull, Vivienne, and Cullen to reinforce negative opinions of the unyielding magi. With the charitable Alistair to really bring home just how horrible Libertarians truly are.

[Giantdeathrobot]

Solas is an anomaly and Cassandra spends half the game complimenting him on being a 'good mage'. Not sure about Dorian; he seems much more concerned with his countrymen than the Mage/Templar issue. Fiona did not operate alone in Asunder and in Inquisition her mages were complicit with her short sighted decision making.

 

The Templars had multiple veterans who fought against the threat and fessed up to their mistake. Not to mention Cullen having a good head on his shoulders and being as fair as possible. All in all they appeared to be a faction who screwed up but were ultimately redeemable.

 

Fiona's faction couldn't have looked worse if they had all become abominations in the middle of Skyhold. That and the game constantly reminding you that a free mage, a Tevinter, was the root of all evil. And if that is somehow not enough, I have Cassandra, Sera, Iron Bull, Vivienne, and Cullen to reinforce negative opinions of the unyielding magi. With the charitable Alistair to really bring home just how horrible Libertarians truly are.

 

Yeah, meanwhile you have Leliana, Solas, Josephine, Cole, Blackwall and Dorian who all sympathize with the rebel mages to varous degrees. Morrigan is also a non-circle mage with a head on her shoulders and crucial to the plot. Dorian considers the Circles a prison and highly dissaproves if you conscript the Mages, so yes he has a stance on the issue.

 

So I'm really not sure where you get the idea Bioware wanted us to think all non-circle mages were idiots. They put dissenting voices in Redcliffe itself for a reason. They just showed mages make bad decisions like everyone else; hell if you don't save them the Templar order pretty much all become Red Templar monsters, they don't look much better. Cory is the Big Bad here, but guess what, the Big Back back in DA2 was a Templar.

 

They muddled up the issue by making sure it's not Nazi Templars vs freedom-loving Mages like it somewhat was in DA2. Doesn't mean every Mage that doesn't like the Circles is put in a bad light, far from it.

[MadMaximoff]

Yeah, meanwhile you have Leliana, Solas, Josephine, Cole, Blackwall and Dorian who all sympathize with the rebel mages to varous degrees. Morrigan is also a non-circle mage with a head on her shoulders and crucial to the plot. Dorian considers the Circles a prison and highly dissaproves if you conscript the Mages, so yes he has a stance on the issue.

 

So I'm really not sure where you get the idea Bioware wanted us to think all non-circle mages were idiots. They put dissenting voices in Redcliffe itself for a reason. They just showed mages make bad decisions like everyone else; hell if you don't save them the Templar order pretty much all become Red Templar monsters, they don't look much better. Cory is the Big Bad here, but guess what, the Big Back back in DA2 was a Templar.

 

They muddled up the issue by making sure it's not Nazi Templars vs freedom-loving Mages like it somewhat was in DA2. Doesn't mean every Mage that doesn't like the Circles is put in a bad light, far from it.

 

Leliana is in the middle of a Crisis of Faith and can become completely cookoo for coca puffs unless you guide her with a steady hand.

 

Blackwall is a Lying, Child Murdering, Dog Torturer.

 

Solas is well....Not exactly the best judge for this kind of thing.

 

Cole at that point is still more spirit than human so he sees it as "helping"

 

The only two with respectable opinions are Dorian and Josephine, yet Dorian understands that magic left unchecked is a dangerous thing and Josephine doesn't disagree with you conscripting.

[Giantdeathrobot]

Leliana is in the middle of a Crisis of Faith and can become completely cookoo for coca puffs unless you guide her with a steady hand.

 

Blackwall is a Lying, Child Murdering, Dog Torturer.

 

Solas is well....Not exactly the best judge for this kind of thing.

 

Cole at that point is still more spirit than human so he sees it as "helping"

 

The only two with respectable opinions are Dorian and Josephine, yet Dorian understands that magic left unchecked is a dangerous thing and Josephine doesn't disagree with you conscripting.

 

My point is that the game isn't one-sided in its portrayal of the rebel Mages if fully half of the roster sympathizes with them.

[BloodyTalon]

Leliana is in the middle of a Crisis of Faith and can become completely cookoo for coca puffs unless you guide her with a steady hand.

 

Blackwall is a Lying, Child Murdering, Dog Torturer.

 

Solas is well....Not exactly the best judge for this kind of thing.

 

Cole at that point is still more spirit than human so he sees it as "helping"

 

The only two with respectable opinions are Dorian and Josephine, yet Dorian understands that magic left unchecked is a dangerous thing and Josephine doesn't disagree with you conscripting.

Blackwall didn't torture the the dog, he did something far worse turned his back and ignored it.

[MadMaximoff]

My point is that the game isn't one-sided in its portrayal of the rebel Mages if fully half of the roster sympathizes with them.

 

Had they had an option to Detain or Demote Fiona so someone more competent could lead the Mages, then I could possibly see many more being open to alliance.

 

The problem is Fiona makes that incredibly hard to do because accepting an Alliance means she remains their leader and turning a blind eye on all the wrongs she has committed to get to the destination.

[Trickshaw]

[A.)] Firstly she is part of those Responsible for voting to start the Mage Templar War.

[B.)] She throws away the Mages Freedom in a heartbeat to Alexius and the Venatori.
 

 

A.) That war was happening no matter what.  You can't use and abuse the most powerful people in all of Thedas and *not* expect them to go off the hinge and start nuking sh*t.

 

B.) It's called blood magic.  It's why she doesn't remember ever even meeting the Inquisitor in Val Royeaux and why she has other holes in her memory in subsequent cut scenes.

 

And finally, you'd be a little b*tchy if you were conscripted too so get off your high horse.  Next time try making them allies instead of slaves?  That tends to make people a bit more accommodating.  Just sayin'.