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[Baerdface]

I opened the first tier of each and one of the second tier, got pretty decent loot and bonuses from it which made the whole thing seem like it'll be worthwile endeavor in the long run. These shards are not something i go out of my way to collect now, just something i pick up when i see them while doing other more pressing tasks in the area because it doesn't hurt me and there's still curiosity what's behind the last set of doors.

It's nevertheless still more depth than "do it because you must".

 

That's the problem with the game to me, they replaced interesting side quests with NPC interactions with grindy "collect a bunch of stuff" ones. It breaks up the momentum of the game and it seems less epic when in between big story missions you spend 70 hours collecting rocks and doing meaningless chores for people.

 

I know "you don't have to do it", but then you would miss out on the stuff that the developers clearly spent most of their time on. Instead of better AI, tactical combat and main story.

[BammBamm]

Why make such a huge world if they can't fill it up meaningfully?

 

because its not necessary. there have to be meaningful things in it (or at least special things like the quests in the picture of a painter in oblivion) but not JUST meaningfull things. there are big adventures and everyday life things in a world, its up to you to decide if you want them to do or not. and sometimes even a breathtaking enviroment can be meaningfull by itself.

and so many things are connected to each other in da:i. sometimes things on the maps influence things in skyhold or your companions and it works the other way around too. they did a really good job at connecting things, more than i have ever experienced in a tes game or old classics like baldurs gate or fallout. the only two weakpoints are the presentation of some quests and the reward of it. that sometimes make the quests feel dull (some really are) although they arent. 

[Darkly Tranquil]

@Darkly Tranquil:  
- Do you consider Venatori activity in the Hissing Wastes "tenuously connected"?  I don't.  
 
- Do you consider saving Orlesian soldiery from "Freemen" rebels who are being spurred on by Venatori and bringing peace to the Exalted Plains by stopping Necromantic plots "tenuously connected"?  I don't.
 
Just because you don't get big sign after doing the Hissing Wastes that says: "GOOD JOB, YOU'RE ADVANCING PLOT!"  Doesn't mean it isn't part of the story.
 
People seem to need a race track where they can only run in one direction and not advance any further unless "this part of the track" is completed.

Well, considering I can defeat the final boss and finish the game without ever doing so, then yeah, that seems pretty tenuous. If they have no direct bearing on the main plot, they are functionally irrelevant. They might add little garnishes of lore, but that alone is not reason enough for me to be willing to spend the time to chase down every shard, mosaic piece, bandit, or kitten in tree.

I liked the way the side quests in ME3 boosted the strength of your forces for the final battle, it gave you a tangible reason to want to go and do all those little missions as felt like it really was adding to your army. In DAI there is no real sense that any of what you are doing in the side quests is really achieving anything useful in the grander scheme of things. Sure, there might be fewer bandits wandering around, but it's not like that does anything for you in your main mission, and the extra power you accrue can't be used for anything anyway.

[BammBamm]

That's the problem with the game to me, they replaced interesting side quests with NPC interactions with grindy "collect a bunch of stuff" ones. It breaks up the momentum of the game and it seems less epic when in between big story missions you spend 70 hours collecting rocks and doing meaningless chores for people.

 

I know "you don't have to do it", but then you would miss out on the stuff that the developers clearly spent most of their time on. Instead of better AI, tactical combat and main story.

 

and thats the hyperbole attitude that no one can take serious. everybody that played the game KNOWS there is no need to run around for hours collecting rocks to advance the mainstory, so whats the point of such statements? make your opinion invalid? i just dont get it why people have to throw around such overstatements when everybody know its a lie

[Baerdface]

Tbh I don't really care anymore, Bioware is going a different direction and is aiming for a different audience, fair enough. Combat in terms of being "Actiony" isn't up to par as many other games in that category like Witcher 2, Dragon's Dogma, Dark Souls. Combat in terms of "tactics" is inferior to Divinity Original Sin, Wasteland 2, etc.. Story and decisions lack ambiguity, Telltale games do it better, so did Witcher 2. Bioware isn't the king of RPG's anymore. They spread out too thin trying to shove as much as stuff possible resulting in each aspect lacking.

 

There are a bunch of good RPG's coming out next year anyway, maybe that's why DA:I got realeased earlier, they knew they wouldn't be able to compete with Bloodborne and Witcher 3. Why? Because those games have focus. Pick a central theme and flesh it out, instead of trying to spin 50 plates at the same time.

 

Overall DA:I was a good way to spend some hours running around and "doing stuff" but is ultimately quite a forgettable experience. 5 years from now people will still be talking about Dragon Age Origins and then they'll be like "what? It had a sequel?"

[BammBamm]

Well, considering I can defeat the final boss and finish the game without ever doing so, then yeah, that seems pretty tenuous. If they have no direct bearing on the main plot, they are functionally irrelevant. They might add little garnishes of lore, but that alone is not reason enough for me to be willing to spend the time to chase down every shard, mosaic piece, bandit, or kitten in tree.

I liked the way the side quests in ME3 boosted the strength of your forces for the final battle, it gave you a tangible reason to want to go and do all those little missions as felt like it really was adding to your army. In DAI there is no real sense that any of what you are doing in the side quests is really achieving anything useful in the grander scheme of things. Sure, there might be fewer bandits wandering around, but it's not like that does anything for you in your main mission, and the extra power you accrue can't be used for anything anyway.

 

some people just doesnt need the "motivation" that everything what you do helps you to make the game easier. when i see i have changed the things on a map its pretty satisfying, doesnt matter if it helps me or not. and sometimes playing a game just for playing a game without the expectation of rewards can be really delivering.

[BammBamm]

There are a bunch of good RPG's coming out next year anyway, maybe that's why DA:I got realeased earlier, they knew they wouldn't be able to compete with Bloodborne and Witcher 3.

 

its always an easy thing to hype games that arent released (flaws are hard to find when nobody can play it) what was the last hyped rpg that expected to be so good.......oh yes, dragon age inquisition

 

i bet more on pillars of eternity, but still dont preorder it. but i know one game i would never buy before release, witcher 3, have not forgotten what happened at release from the former games. but i really looking forward to see the same whiners here whining in the witcher 3 forums when its time.

[In Exile]

Personally I got more chuckle out of the complaining elf in the refugee camp, than the Rhyming Tree ever gave me. Does it count? Also I don't know if I'd call "go fetch me an acorn" an imaginative quest.

While there's no Rhyming Tree in the Emerald Graves I appreciated some nuance put in the Freemen leader's backstory, and some of the vignettes (like that rift researcher) were downright depressing.

But we learned that people like fetch quests that are covered up in imaginative ways. Perhaps it helped that the DAO UI didn't flash a "Collect Acorn 0/1 bar"? To point out they are on a fetch quest?

[In Exile]

I don't mind fetch quests so long as there's a reasonable amount of content that is not simply "talk to X, find Y item, bring it to X".

As such, I don't think either game has that problem. For different reasons, but still.

You mean like "Bring Witherfang's heart to Zathrian"? Or what about "Bring the sacred ashes to Arl Ramon"?

[In Exile]

@Darkly Tranquil:

- Do you consider Venatori activity in the Hissing Wastes "tenuously connected"? I don't.

- Do you consider saving Orlesian soldiery from "Freemen" rebels who are being spurred on by Venatori and bringing peace to the Exalted Plains by stopping Necromantic plots "tenuously connected"? I don't.

Just because you don't get big sign after doing the Hissing Wastes that says: "GOOD JOB, YOU'RE ADVANCING PLOT!" Doesn't mean it isn't part of the story.

People seem to need a race track where they can only run in one direction and not advance any further unless "this part of the track" is completed.

The big sign is a cutscene that talks about the plot. It seems that for some people this is very important. I understand that feeling. I prefer more cutscenes. I just don't mind their lack when the combat isnt pure garbage like Skyrim or FO3, which I play in spite of the actual gameplay.

[In Exile]

Is this how you experience it, a marker in the quest log you follow without any idea why? Well, no wonder it feels dull then, i don't think I'd personally even bother.

The way it played for me was, i found this skull thing in the wilds. It showed a couple shards i picked up out of curiosity. I then got an option to investigate the purpose of these shards. I took it, and it pointed me to desolate area with a temple that was apparently of interest to the faction i happen to be at war with. Turned out the shards are needed to enter and explore that place. So for my character it seemed like a good idea to try and collect these shards from then on, to see what's inside that place her opponents wanted so badly, and to hopefully mess up their plans.

So yeah, it's curiosity, emotional investment and some actual connection to the main plot. Who would've thought?

Not to mention they were Tevinter relics. Which given the plot as it develops becomes more relevant.

[Darkly Tranquil]

The big sign is a cutscene that talks about the plot. It seems that for some people this is very important. I understand that feeling. I prefer more cutscenes. I just don't mind their lack when the combat isnt pure garbage like Skyrim or FO3, which I play in spite of the actual gameplay.

Sadly, this is how I feel about Inquisition. I want to enjoy the story and the lore, but the gameplay makes me miserable.

[Baerdface]

Sadly, this is how I feel about Inquisition. I want to enjoy the story and the lore, but the gameplay makes me miserable.

 

Telltale should get the rights to Dragon Age tbh. Bioware clearly don't give a **** about gameplay anyway so why tiptoe around the subject when they can just do the sensible thing.

[Darkly Tranquil]

Telltale should get the rights to Dragon Age tbh. Bioware clearly don't give a **** about gameplay anyway so why tiptoe around the subject when they can just do the sensible thing.

I would kill for a Dragon Age game with Divinity: Original Sin's mechanics.

[Nefla]

You mean like "Bring Witherfang's heart to Zathrian"? Or what about "Bring the sacred ashes to Arl Ramon"?

If DA:I sideqests had the same level of detail and interaction as those quest lines I doubt anyone would be complaining. Go to a quest marker where generic enemies are found, with no fanfare or dialogue kill them, find a short note telling you "___ died, she always was weak. I'm hiding at ___" which gives you a new quest marker and the process repeats.

[zeypher]

No not divinity OS i hate turn based combat. Im sorry but a lot of other people hate it too. Real time with pause is just fine ty very much.

[Tsunami Chef]

If DA:I sideqests had the same level of detail and interaction as those quest lines I doubt anyone would be complaining. Go to a quest marker where generic enemies are found, with no fanfare or dialogue kill them, find a short note telling you "___ died, she always was weak. I'm hiding at ___" which gives you a new quest marker and the process repeats.

God...please do those quests again...and realize how confused your memory actually is. I think you all played Dragon Age before you had ever actually played another RPG, making your memories of it like losing your virginity. It was awkward and weird at times, but you imagine it like a porno.

[Giant ambush beetle]

I absolutely loved the semi open world approach, it worked really well. For the first time in the Dragon Age franchise the world feels as big as it is supposed to be. Please, make more of it. 

[Nefla]

God...please do those quests again...and realize how confused your memory actually is. I think you all played Dragon Age before you had ever actually played another RPG, making your memories of it like losing your virginity. It was awkward and weird at times, but you imagine it like a porno.

Your...vivid imagination aside, "get the ashes for Arl Eamon" for example involved investigating the disappearance of brother Genitivi (and in his house you could reveal his "assistant" as a traitor or not) going to haven, looking for clues, talking to people, confronting the male priest and his followers, finding and talking to Genitivi (who you can later kill or spare) doing the temple of sacred ashes dungeon, siding with, against, or tricking the cultists, fighting the dragon if you want, doing the trials (and getting to interact with the guardian) and there were several cutscenes as well as party comments on the situation and you could even potentially lose two followers permanently(there were also smaller quests you could do while there such as finding scrolls of banaster) To call this a fetch quest is just idiotic. If this had been a side quest in DA:I it would have been:

-NPC standing around somewhere with an exclamation mark over his head who tells you "please inquisitor I need the urn of sacred ashes for my sick son" and you can ask him "what are the sacred ashes" and "why can't you do it?" To each he will give a one or two line reply. (No cutscene of course and he continues to stand in the same spot the whole time)
-Quest market appears in a shallow cave which contains 3 nugs, two lumps of iron, a chest with common items you have already out leveled and the urn sitting on a desk. You have to kill a group of uninteresting enemy bandits or venatori to get to it.
-Return to the NPC who says "thank you so much, now my son will be ok" and gives you 1 power and a low level bow. If you talk to him again he just repeats the words "thank you."

[Rahelron]

I think the problem some people have is that the game didn't tell you what to do in these environments.  If the game doesn't give little numbers to chase or little reward blips to congratulate - then some people can't find the worth and it's "boring".

 

Each area is ingrained into the story... but they're not essential to completing the main narrative.  This game doesn't railroad you and actually allows you to complete content only if you want to (within reason of course).   

 

DAI is filled with completion bars for everything except companions approval. You have completion bars for experience, power, influence, for how many objects you have found to complete each and every quest. And you know what? Free roaming in DAI is boring EXACTLY because of that. Because everything you do is filling completion bars.

[tmp7704]

DAI is filled with completion bars for everything except companions approval. You have completion bars for experience, power, influence, for how many objects you have found to complete each and every quest. And you know what? Free roaming in DAI is boring EXACTLY because of that. Because everything you do is filling completion bars.

I guess my enjoyment of DAI may be related to having the quest tracker and associated bars turned off and largely ignored, then.

[Shark17676]

Then it fails at everything, fails at being a story driven game like the previous games and fails at being skyrim, its basically a fail, it failed to be DA.

 

That made no sense whatsoever.

[Remmirath]

I like the semi-open world. For the most part, I think it worked really quite well. There's a fair amount to do that is interesting, and you can do as much or as little of the things that aren't directly related to the main plot as you like. There's some interesting stuff to be found there. Stumbling into things that are above your head and having to return later is great (would be better if loot weren't level-gated, but still). It also adds more replayability to the game, especially if your characters each don't do everything available, and do different things.

The only problem, I think, is that it hurts the pacing of the main plot if you do decide to do a lot of exploring. I'm sure that this could be solved in future games in a number of ways; I would certainly rather see that happen, than not see a semi-open world again.

But we learned that people like fetch quests that are covered up in imaginative ways. Perhaps it helped that the DAO UI didn't flash a "Collect Acorn 0/1 bar"? To point out they are on a fetch quest?

I'm sure that did help. I really wish there were a way to completely turn off such things in DA:I; it would make most quests more enjoyable to me. I also wish there were a way to drop quests from the journal that my character never has any intention of completing.

I'd also say that the Rhyming Tree's quest wasn't exactly a fetch quest, or at least, not the worst kind of fetch quest. There was a goal of one item, through which one had to go through a test or series of tests one way or another. There was some choice, as in, killing the old hermit or answering his questions. It wasn't a matter of going around and searching for X number of acorns hidden randomly in the world. It wasn't a particularly deep or inspiring quest, but I had no problem with it.

If each fetch quest had at least that much dialogue and decision attached to it in DA:I, I doubt people would be complaining (well, okay, some people probably would anyhow). I don't mind a few largely pointless fetch quests, as they can surely be avoided if I don't feel like doing them, but more in-depth quests are preferable.

[tmp7704]

If each fetch quest had at least that much dialogue and decision attached to it in DA:I, I doubt people would be complaining (well, okay, some people probably would anyhow). I don't mind a few largely pointless fetch quests, as they can surely be avoided if I don't feel like doing them, but more in-depth quests are preferable.

I imagine it'd help if (at least) some of the side quests had options how to deal with the target. With DAO often enough there was a dialogue where you could try to either obtain the object of the fetch quest peacefully or duke it out with the owner, etc. E.g. I wouldn't really mind seeing option in DAO to say, try and negotiate with the Freemen leaders first and maybe find common ground with them, instead of them all just being set to 'fight on sight'. Wouldn't need any flashy cutscenes or anything even.

On the other hand though, given the game has its budget that'd mean cutting some content (in this case the voicework) from elsewhere i.e. either companion interaction or the main plot. And people already complain these were pretty limited.