235 réponses à ce sujet

[KaiserShep]

On the whole I like this mission.  Mostly since it is a decent change of pace from the rest of the game.  Personally I wouldn't have thought to compare this with the Fade portion of DAO.  The Fade there was mainly just slogging through zones killing whatever demons in a couple different forms with little dialogue or narrative.  Just go to each zone and clear them out, then kill the last badguy.  And to make matters worse, you had to visit most zones twice if you wanted all of the bonuses.

 

I also am not entirely sure why so many are complaining about the timer or approval in general.  If you have the achievement, there isn't a huge necessity to get 100 approval.  So if you don't want to rush, or don't want to take all the "right" dialogue, you don't have to do so.

 

With the Fade, backtracking was absolutely necessary to get through, since you had a lot of massive doors, spirit doors and fiery impasses that made it impossible to progress until you got all the dreamers and obtained their power to shift into all 4 forms. I was a bit frustrated on my first go, because I found myself returning to certain areas multiple times because I was trying to find out what path I didn't take yet through process of elimination. 

 

As for the timer, it's a lot more forgiving than guides and such let on, particularly in the royal wing segment. Gaining approval back through dialogue basically makes up for any points you lost and then some. 

[taglag]

Yes I hate this one, it is a pain, and with out a walk through you are bound to miss something.

 

I know enter the "I never use a walk through, and I never miss anything" people

 

I just hate resorting to the net or a walk through for any thing in the game, but poor design ( Or intentional design ) makes this a have to for me quite often.

 

  It just means I did not beat the game if I ever use the net, or a walk through to complete any part of it. All I did was endure to the end.

[taglag]

The timer takes everything potentially unpleasant about WEWH and amplifies it.  The timere really isn't a big deal, but it adds way too much stress to an area that is already challenging due to lighting and rendering decisions.

 

 

Yeppers! This is my problem, the total downer of not being able to mingle, and enjoy the level.

 

  My character this time has done almost everything She can to avoid this party, and all because of the stupid timer.

I am about to have to do it again ( ran out of other missions, until I do ), and I have dreaded it from the start like some great big Ambatrose. I truly feel disgust at having to do it again.

 

  Walk-through...Step by pause and step.

[Magdalena11]

Yeppers! This is my problem, the total downer of not being able to mingle, and enjoy the level.

 

  My character this time has done almost everything She can to avoid this party, and all because of the stupid timer.

I am about to have to do it again ( ran out of other missions, until I do ), and I have dreaded it from the start like some great big Ambatrose. I truly feel disgust at having to do it again.

 

  Walk-through...Step by pause and step.

I know.  They really need a support group meeting between dances.  The biggest problem is that it's a little too well done.  There's all this stuff going on to build tension and pressure, and there's no way out.  There's a clock ticking, as you're being oh-so-helpfully reminded by the upper right corner of the screen, and you know that your companions opinion of you hinges on being able to find the information you need.  But you're in the dark, with a map that doesn't work, and there's no way out.  

 

Next Inq is one who's going to just not care who she annoys or even if she gets shown the door.  She's going to plow through, get what she needs to do to go home, then go through the rest of the game trying to patch it up if she cares to.  The difference with her is that she's one I'm planning to be like that.  I don't want them all to have to be like that or be failures in terms of the idea I had when I thought them up.  It's supposed to be roleplaying.

 

I think increasing the ambient light level for interiors would allow you to use visual clues for navigation, which would make people feel less lost.  Allowing access to maps that depict the actual location of doors and passages would allow searches that were more complete, since with unreliable maps, who knows if it's been covered or not?  It is possible to decrease some of the helplessness that leads to panic without changing the flavor of the quest, but it's probably not going to happen for a while, and these ideas might not work.  Hopefully, someone will think of something that does, because it's such a good game, it's a shame.  There's this beautiful, well-written questline that is so multilayered, it's actually painful for some people.

 

Nerfing isn't the answer for everything, but the suggestions I made could be considered more along the lines of making an adaptation or 2 for handicap access.  People don't complain about having to use a ramp as the only access to a building, even if they have to walk a little farther, because it lets everyone use the building.  I'm not saying the quest should be skipped or people with bad eyes and anxiety or PTSD should be given a pass, but tools to lessen their impact would help make it one they weren't putting off until they'd exhausted every other option.

[Absafraginlootly]

While I enjoyed many aspects of this quest I found the timer added an unnecessary level of stress and I absolutely detest the halla statues.

 

They make no sense. Having certain plot options only available by extra exploration and getting into certain locked rooms? Sure, but getting into those rooms should make sense.

 

Convince someone to give you a key, steal it, use your knowledge arcane perk to figure out how to get past a mystical ward on the door, use the history perk to notice one part of a fresco thats incorrect and therefore the trigger to a secret door, use Deft hand, fine tools to just break in, any number of things they could have done that would have some degree of sense.

 

But statues scattered randomly all over the palace that you have to search every inch for and will apply to multiple doors as long as you have enough? What sort of security system is that? There's one on the kitchen rafters for heavens sake. 

[taglag]

I managed to get through it again, about 3 restart's, and a very non leaner walkthrough latter.

 

I did not even try to do anything extra other than open that secret area in the one place, I hate to be specific.

 

( I also got the 100% approval )

 

I hate leaving stuff undone, that I can never come back to, but I just despise the mission, and the timer. I like to explore, and look, and enjoy thing's to much, and this one just removes the ability, at least for me.

[HeatherWind]

I hate leaving stuff undone, that I can never come back to, but I just despise the mission, and the timer. I like to explore, and look, and enjoy thing's to much, and this one just removes the ability, at least for me.

 It's not just you. I HATE timed quests generally, but the timer in this one was doubly infuriating. There was plenty of drama already without having that stress ticking at you too. Let us gain / lose approval through quest items and roleplay, not a timer mechanic just to cause panic.

 

I'm still hoping a talented modder will find a way to workaround the timer. I've stopped playing my current game because I just don't want the stress in there right now, and I hate feeling that way about what is otherwise a very fun game.

[Realmzmaster]

I normally do not like timers, but in this case it makes sense. You are the Inquisitor at a grand ball with all the eyes of the nobility upon you. The Inquisitor's absence would be noticed. Also there are several ways to boost the timer back up from gathering secrets and caprice coins to picking the right dialogue options during the dancing. So I do not feel this timer to be that stressful, but YMMV.

[tesla21]

Also, I find it absolutely absurd that you're the only one who can close the rifts and they throw you out of their party if you don't get their approval. I didn't even know that could happen until I read it here. It's really funny because it seems to me that politically you can out maneuver them in about two seconds by telling them that you always have the option to not close rifts in Olesian territory and you can let demons spew from them invading their towns and cities, their precious homes and attack everything they hold dear. That this is not an option to bypass approval and instantly force their hand (which is done as a power move in politics all the time) is absurd to me. You do have the power to close the rifts. You are the only person who has that power. Seems to me a good threat would go very far very fast and depending on how you are playing your character it could bring a lot of fun to the game. I honestly couldn't believe that this was not a tactic within this part of the game since it seems like it would be the most obvious thing in the world. The assumption is that you are going to close all the rifts and be this great person is ridiculous and also removes something that is pretty awesome from the game - roleplaying!!!

 

And regarding climbing the trellis - I think the fact that we have a rogue spymaster with us at the party should have been an alternate way of getting into different rooms and areas undetected. Perhaps with a certain perk that grants more than just that (added into a few different perks in Leliana's list) then you don't have to seem like an utter idiot who would climb a trellis at a palace into private quarters in front of a dozen witnesses. Don't want to do that? Grab your spymaster and tell her that the trellis is not an option. She needs to find a door to get us into the private quarters and breakout some of her dusty rogue skills.

 

Really old thread but after replaying the game... god I hate this mission, seriously you shouldn't have to play their shitty "game" with every character, it only make sense with certain main characters, say you wanted to be a "kill first, ask questions later" qunari mercenary who's completely indiferent to etiquette and manipulations? NOPE, you are now master of the intrigue Qunari ex-mercenary that perfectly performs the orlesian dance. So frustrating when the game actually disencourages roleplaying, most of my character design ideas simply do not work in the game because the are some inminent inmersion breaking moments.

 

Why not let us just side with the military power and seize the party from start? We have world to save! Your petty dances and intrigue be dammed. Leave that to my human noble/manipulative rogue. My badass warrior is outright given a f- you, game over for roleplaying appropriately.

 

Even if I don't like the timer either it was by far the least of my gripes with the quest. There shouldn't be such blatant wrong and right ways to roleplay. A smart way of the game biting you in the rear for making the "wrong" choice should be better than "game over", gaining less power, having more casualties, making Orlais unstable because you didn't properly "play their game", slider negative consequences, etc, etc. 

 

Hell, I don't need violently taking over the party, just let me be straight forward... "Hey idiots, the Inquisition is our (and your) only chance at not getting obliterated by the rifts, I lead the Inquisition, I am the only who can close rifts, you can side with me or you can enjoy getting erased from the map by endless hordes of rift spawns, your civil war is nice and all but if you don't ally with me you will all die anyway", that way of taking over the quest might end up with the Inquisitor being seen as an enemy of Orlais? Great, that's roleplaying. I am here to solve the rift issue not to make everyone love me.

 

As it is, the quest single handedly kills any possible merc Qunari playthroughs for me.

[Realmzmaster]

So you are saying the only way to play a merc Qunari is if the Qunari acts like he/she has no subtlety or culture. Also the Inquisitor needs allies. Vivienne said it best. "You lead an army of the faithful outfitted by the coin of the nobility". If the Inquisitor wants the coin of the nobility and the backing of their armies the Inquisitor learns to play the Game.

 

Sometimes roleplaying requires one to step into a role not dictate the role. 

[Ghost Gal]

So you are saying the only way to play a merc Qunari is if the Qunari acts like he/she has no subtlety or culture. Also the Inquisitor needs allies. Vivienne said it best. "You lead an army of the faithful outfitted by the coin of the nobility". If the Inquisitor wants the coin of the nobility and the backing of their armies the Inquisitor learns to play the Game.

 

Sometimes roleplaying requires one to step into a role not dictate the role. 

 

 

I agree.

 

I like how the game gives you freedom to express in private how you feel about it. Do you like the Game? Do you hate it? Were you scared/nervous through it, or were you confident all along? Your character doesn't have to like it, but s/he has to put in just enough effort not to get kicked out; not to alienate the same people's whose gold and good opinion funds your Inquisition.

 

Like you said, roleplaying means you step into the role, not dictate the role given. You can decide how your character feels about the role given to him/her, but you don't get to say, "Nah, I don't feel like being the Herald/Inquisitor/Belle of the Ball, I'm just gonna skip it," because there are consequences.