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[Colonelkillabee]

chances are things will repeat and pro-temps will feel justified

You know it will. And I tire of the same sob story mages give, which is "We fucked up, but I SWEAR we had no choice! Well, we did, but we.... uh... "

[Addai]

Better to have your eggs all in one basket, so when someone starts hatching, you can stop that ****.
 
Having mages in one space doesn't make them more likely to become abominations. A demon alone can bring more, then possess more people, mage or not. The circle didn't go to hell because there were lots of mages around. The only flaw here is the harrowing, and not really because it attracts demons, since they can kill said mage if possessed before he's a threat. It's stupid because it forces them to encounter them at all, when they might never have in the first place.

The circles are demon beacons because they're full of fear, greed, oppression, ambition, and desperation. They're places where people who get off on cruelty can act with impunity and even sanction. Cole's story is a banner illustration, and then of course there's Ferelden. Why do you suppose Lily sounded so terrified of Aeonar? Edit: Oh, and then there's the fact that the templars are literally inviting demons to try their hand at eating young mages. Lest we forget.
 

Fiona was at the head, and Anders wasn't really pushed at all. I mean, yea kirkwall was in a bad situation, but the dude flipped. It was not THAT bad, hence why before Inquisition you and I pretty much said the same thing about him. Nothing's changed, he was still an idiot, even though I get wanting to get it over with rather than dying slowly, which is how he saw it. That wasn't your only out, that was your death warrant. Nothing about that decision was necessary or smart of Fiona or anyone else that supported her, which wasn't many.

I'm sorry, you're just wrong- Kirkwall is an example of extreme templar oppression. Justice played a role naturally but again, his nature was changed by what happened around him.

What would you have done in Fiona's place?

[raging_monkey]

You know it will. And I tire of the same sob story mages give, which is "We fucked up, but I SWEAR we had no choice! Well, we did, but we.... uh... "

and the temps "ohhh well we are in charge first and danger is uh... look a guy hold a shovel MAGE" lol both sides are jackasses

[Colonelkillabee]

The circles are demon beacons because they're full of fear, greed, oppression, ambition, and desperation. They're places where people who get off on cruelty can act with impunity and even sanction. Cole's story is a banner illustration, and then of course there's Ferelden. Why do you suppose Lily sounded so terrified of Aeonar?
 
I'm sorry, you're just wrong- Kirkwall is an example of extreme templar oppression. Justice played a role naturally but again, his nature was changed by what happened around him.

What would you have done in Fiona's place?

 

Welcome to Thedas in general. Circles are not special.

 

I'm really not. Anyone that looks at kirkwall's issue and say "Yep, I have no choice but to kill innocent people and **** everything up to force conflict" is an idiot. He was not backed to a wall. No one wanted that but him.

 

I wouldn't push for separation after kirkwall just went to hell from mages blowing up the chantry and being massacred. That's the absolute worst time to try and push a vote to separate from the chantry. What was she smoking exactly.

 

At least when Ulfric did what he did, he had a battle plan and a political one. He was prepared. Fiona had nothing.

[Colonelkillabee]

and the temps "ohhh well we are in charge first and danger is uh... look a guy hold a shovel MAGE" lol both sides are jackasses

Na, templars would just kill them and tell you to **** yourself if you didn't like it, lol.

 

All that man juice from devotion got backed up into their brain. Guaranteed to be assholes that way.

[raging_monkey]

Welcome to Thedas in general. Circles are not special.
 
I'm really not. Anyone that looks at kirkwall's issue and say "Yep, I have no choice but to kill innocent people and **** everything up to force conflict" is an idiot. He was not backed to a wall. No one wanted that but him.
 
I wouldn't push for separation after kirkwall just went to hell from mages blowing up the chantry and being massacred. That's the absolute worst time to try and push a vote to separate from the chantry. What was she smoking exactly.
 
At least when Ulfric did what he did, he had a battle plan and a political one. He was prepared. Fiona had nothing.

yeah you got a point. Damn anders we were so close to compromise..

[Addai]

Welcome to Thedas in general. Circles are not special.

 

I'm really not. Anyone that looks at kirkwall's issue and say "Yep, I have no choice but to kill innocent people and **** everything up to force conflict" is an idiot. He was not backed to a wall. No one wanted that but him.

 

I wouldn't push for separation after kirkwall just went to hell from mages blowing up the chantry and being massacred. That's the absolute worst time to try and push a vote to separate from the chantry. What was she smoking exactly.

 

At least when Ulfric did what he did, he had a battle plan and a political one. He was prepared. Fiona had nothing.

Meredith was going crazy. She was just looking for an excuse to call the Rite of Annulment. And yes, Anders gave her one, but it was going to happen regardless.

 

Once again. What happened with the rebellion is old news. What would you do differently in Redcliffe?

[raging_monkey]

Na, templars would just kill them and tell you to **** yourself if you didn't like it, lol.
 
All that man juice from devotion got backed up into their brain. Guaranteed to be assholes that way.

see this is how we discuss satirical shots at both sides * high-5*

[thesuperdarkone2]

Meredith was going crazy. She was just looking for an excuse to call the Rite of Annulment. And yes, Anders gave her one, but it was going to happen regardless.

 

Once again. What happened with the rebellion is old news. What would you do differently in Redcliffe?

If Karras was still alive in Act 3, you find out that Meredith already called for the Rite at the beginning of the Act. In other words, she was already planning to kill every mage in the Kirkwall Circle before the Chantry blew up. 

[raging_monkey]

If Karras was still alive in Act 3, you find out that Meredith already called for the Rite at the beginning of the Act. In other words, she was already planning to kill every mage in the Kirkwall Circle before the Chantry blew up.

wait what? Bull merideths crazy but not that crazy

[herkles]

What would you have done in Fiona's place?

A number of things. 

• state clearly what the end goal of the rebellion is. Not FREEDOM!!!!!!! but "an independent body of mages that exist to study magic and help the world better it self. 
• spread propaganda. For instance templars butchering innocent men and women, hire/bribe town criers
• I would help Fereldan rebuild from the blight, sure 10 years have passed but there are still areas that could be rebuilt and magic could help.
• not join tevinter/seek to become a slave-owner; the whole rebellion is based on the idea that mages when free will not be tevinter. We must show them that is true. 
• support one side in the civil war, or try to play both sides. 
• See if the Mortalitasi might be willing to help, likely not but those nevarran death mages might.
• If the templars plan on attacking a town make sure we fight to defend the people of the town. 
• From an order like the Aurors from harry potter to watch for blood magic and Abominations. 
• use espionage and diplomacy to achieve the ends; including working with the divine, assasinating templar agents and other actions to get the goals. 

Thos are just a few of the things I might have done.

[thesuperdarkone2]

wait what? Bull merideths crazy but not that crazy

Yes. Either give the Starkhaven mages to the Templars or convince the templars to leave and then talk to Karras in the Gallows in Act 3 and he straight up tells you that Meredith has already sent for the Rite of Annulment.

 

http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Karras

[Colonelkillabee]

Meredith was going crazy. She was just looking for an excuse to call the Rite of Annulment. And yes, Anders gave her one, but it was going to happen regardless.

 

Once again. What happened with the rebellion is old news. What would you do differently in Redcliffe?

With that kind of thinking, I'd be nuking everyone all over the place. One can't just assume the worst to justify something so comically ridiculous and inappropriate. I literally laughed out loud and still do because the pacing was horrible. If your solution is that, perhaps you should just go die somewhere and do everyone a favor. Seriously, anders is retarded. Or his mind is addled from that spirit.

 

I wouldn't be in redcliffe in the first place, but if it were me, I'd friggin leave the evil Sith lords even if it meant more bloodshed. Why jump out the frying pan and into the fire. That solves nothing, but does a good job at making the mages look bad, hence why so many people have switched sides. I've never sided against the mages until this game.

[raging_monkey]

Yes. Either give the Starkhaven mages to the Templars or convince the templars to leave and then talk to Karras in the Gallows in Act 3 and he straight up tells you that Meredith has already sent for the Rite of Annulment.
 
http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Karras

that has to be illegal and abuse of power. It wasnt that. Well i feel less guilty killing merideth and karras

[Colonelkillabee]

Yes. Either give the Starkhaven mages to the Templars or convince the templars to leave and then talk to Karras in the Gallows in Act 3 and he straight up tells you that Meredith has already sent for the Rite of Annulment.

 

http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Karras

That still doesn't justify an attack on the chantry if true. If he wanted to attack someone, he should have blown her ass up, not a peaceful church.

 

And if she struck first, the mages would have gotten a lot more support. Instead, everyone in Thedas distrusts them now.

[thesuperdarkone2]

that has to be illegal and abuse of power. It wasnt that. Well i feel less guilty killing merideth and karras

Meredith pretty much usurping the Viscount's position should have been a pretty clear indication that she didn't care and only wanted to kill mages.

[Colonelkillabee]

No Kirkwall was bad. Kirkwall had Templars raping mages and making mages tranquil so that they could continue raping mages. On the flipside every other mage was a blood mage. So it balances out. I chalk it up to the Veil being thin there. That said, No. Kirkwall was bad. And Anders was crazy starting with the Awakening epilogue. When he took in Justice everything that he buried and bottled up about Templars ended up front and center and he gradually went crazy after that. Still, saying Kirkwall wasn't that bad is just LOL.

I said kirkwall wasn't THAT bad. Even had it in all caps. Nothing here justifies blowing up a chantry. Open warfare in the streets is that bad, which he caused.

[Colonelkillabee]

And yea, I forgot all about the crazy ass mages they did have, but then, most of that was because of the templars. Most but not all. Still, I always sided with the mages in Kirkwall.

[thesuperdarkone2]

That still doesn't justify an attack on the chantry if true. If he wanted to attack someone, he should have blown her ass up, not a peaceful church.

 

And if she struck first, the mages would have gotten a lot more support. Instead, everyone in Thedas distrusts them now.

Meredith usurped the Viscount's seat, sent DEATH SQUADS to KILL MAGE SUPPORTERS, made people tranquil for minor things like passing notes, and the Seekers knew this but let it happen anyway since they felt she was justified. Meredith was never going to get her comeuppance if the system had its way.

[Colonelkillabee]

Meredith usurped the Viscount's seat, sent DEATH SQUADS to KILL MAGE SUPPORTERS, made people tranquil for minor things like passing notes, and the Seekers knew this but let it happen anyway since they felt she was justified. Meredith was never going to get her comeuppance if the system had its way.

Well then I ask again. Why didn't anders blow HER ass up? You can't justify blowing up a chantry, period.

[raging_monkey]

Meredith pretty much usurping the Viscount's position should have been a pretty clear indication that she didn't care and only wanted to kill mages.

that place never ceases to amaze me by the scum their

[raging_monkey]

Well then I ask again. Why didn't anders blow HER ass up? You can't justify blowing up a chantry, period.

they enabled her by not reigning her in... i guess not my view would gone with diplomacy til she started froathing

[Colonelkillabee]

When you have Templars raping mages, apostates going on killing sprees, and a Red Lyrium fueled zealot as the acting Viscountess I'd say that counts as THAT bad. Just saying. There wouldn't be open warfare on the streets if it wasn't for those conditions. Anders just happened to be the last domino to fall. Any other week it might have been something else.

 

Doesn't justify what Anders did, but pinning everything on him kind of defeats the purpose of DA2.

There wouldn't be open warfare on the streets if it weren't for anders. That wasn't a domino, that was a brick.

 

And at the end of the day, the mages did not want this. They were all horrified that it came to that and that they were blamed for his actions. I don't care if it wasn't all Anders, what he did was still stupid as **** and totally pointless.