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[Draining Dragon]

I used to be pro-freedom, until I played DA2 as a Mage siding with the Templars. That made me realize how unreasonable the mages were being.

[raging_monkey]

The wiki makes a claim a lot, but I've yet to find a source other than a player guide.

i say just keep looking sides does it honestly matter magi will be the villains still lol

[TK514]

Out of curiosity, has anyone found a source in DAI that shows that the rebel mages were brainwashed by Corypheus if you pick the Templar route?

 

I remember in the first few weeks, no one could find any source or means on mass brainwashing about the Fiona faction. I know you have the replacement to Sampson, who Corypheus planned to brainwash, but nothing equivalent to force-feeding red lyrium into the Templars.

 

The best I've gotten from anyone so far is either 'I heard someone said they found something' or 'it is implied...somehow'.  Nothing even remotely like a citation or proof.

[raging_monkey]

The best I've gotten from anyone so far is either 'I heard someone said they found something' or 'it is implied...somehow'.  Nothing even remotely like a citation or proof.

well the guide is technically a source so its what it is. Who knows

[raging_monkey]

It is implied. Talk to the mages at Redcliffe. All of them are begging for the Inquisition's intervention with the exception of that idiot girl in the tavern.

he ment "why" they joined the vents if you side with temps

[Master Warder Z_]

Honestly i was pissed that Fiona never got punished for that.

 

I 'll just have to settle for beheading her in my future Templar runs.

[raging_monkey]

Honestly i was pissed that Fiona never got punished for that.
 
I 'll just have to settle for beheading her in my future Templar runs.

maybe its a CIA like deal? She's valuable asset i guess

[TheJediSaint]

Anders made a pretty persuasive case against mage freedom in DA2.

[TK514]

It is implied. Talk to the mages at Redcliffe. All of them are begging for the Inquisition's intervention with the exception of that idiot girl in the tavern.

 

How does that imply mind control?

[Master Warder Z_]

maybe its a CIA like deal? She's valuable asset i guess

 

Uh no?

 

I conscripted their asses.

 

They revolt; their beheaded, thrown in stocks or made tranquil depending upon my mood that day.

 

I ain't their moma and i ain't gonna coddle em.

 

Their murderers, terrorists and idiots.

 

I needed them for soldiers, nothing more.

[Master Warder Z_]

How does that imply mind control?

 

Seems kind of the opposite to me.

 

I mean you figure the Tevinter magi if they were doing that crap...would do it to make it to where you know...the magi in redcliffe don't ****.

[raging_monkey]

Uh no?
 
I conscripted their asses.
 
They revolt; their beheaded, thrown in stocks or made tranquil depending upon my mood that day.
 
I ain't their moma and i ain't gonna coddle em.
 
Their murderers, terrorists and idiots.
 
I needed them for soldiers, nothing more.

if you wanted soldiers why not just get the temps seems easier to control.

[Dean_the_Young]

well the guide is technically a source so its what it is. Who knows

 

The guide isn't a canonical lore source.

 

Players guides in general often put in assumptions and such about games that never make it into games proper. Sometimes it's fluff, but other times it's just plain wrong.

 

It is implied. Talk to the mages at Redcliffe. All of them are begging for the Inquisition's intervention with the exception of that idiot girl in the tavern.

 

They want help, sure, but none of them ever present any argument or evidence that they're being forced to stay.

 

In fact, I can't think of a single one in Redcliffe who suggests that they were being threatened directly if they tried to leave or disagreed. They are all 'please, Inquisition, help us'... but none of them provide a reason why they couldn't help themselves.

 

They just... kind of go along with it, because someone said so and everyone else was going along with it. That's not particularly unrealistic, mind you- people who live by group consensus often struggle to break off even if they personally disagree- but it's not particularly dramatic or inspiring or even sympathetic.

 

I mean, Red Templars? That got it right, especially with the Templar quest where you could intervene and stop the brainwashing conspiracy. But the mages just... kind of willingly walk into slavery and an apocalyptic cult.

[Addai]

I mean, Red Templars? That got it right, especially with the Templar quest where you could intervene and stop the brainwashing conspiracy. But the mages just... kind of willingly walk into slavery and an apocalyptic cult.

It's the difference between people who have official sanction in society (even if the institution behind it has largely broken down, culturally its authority is still pretty strong) and those who have absolutely no legal or social standing as individuals. They would be marginalized, hated and hunted.

I honestly don't see how people view the decision to go to Tevinter as so controversial.

[The Baconer]

They want help, sure, but none of them ever present any argument or evidence that they're being forced to stay.

 

In fact, I can't think of a single one in Redcliffe who suggests that they were being threatened directly if they tried to leave or disagreed. They are all 'please, Inquisition, help us'... but none of them provide a reason why they couldn't help themselves.

 

They just... kind of go along with it, because someone said so and everyone else was going along with it. That's not particularly unrealistic, mind you- people who live by group consensus often struggle to break off even if they personally disagree- but it's not particularly dramatic or inspiring or even sympathetic.

 

If you pursue the Templars, Dorian confirms that those who chose not to serve the Venatori and did not successfully escape were killed.

 

They were bound to Alexius by Tevinter law, and beyond that he was tasked to bring them in service to Corypheus. There's no reason to assume the rebel mages are free to leave Redcliffe.

[Colonelkillabee]

I honestly don't see how people view the decision to go to Tevinter as so controversial.

Not controversial, incredibly stupid. So stupid that people thought it HAD to be braincontrol. And I'm honestly not completely against that.

 

It's about the equivalent of American teens running off to ISIS. It's that stupid.

[thesuperdarkone2]

How does that imply mind control?

It's not implied. There is a note in the Hissing Wastes while doing the tomb quest if you sided with the templars that says that since the templars weren't corrupted, Corypheus demanded that the Venatori brainwash the mages which they have finished doing. Otherwise, if you sided with the mages, the same note says that the Venatori have to be careful about losing people since their numbers are small due to losing the mages at Redcliffe while the red templars mock them. Also, Calpernia's nemesis quest reveals that Corypheus does brainwash people. 

[Colonelkillabee]

Uh no?

 

I conscripted their asses.

 

They revolt; their beheaded, thrown in stocks or made tranquil depending upon my mood that day.

 

I ain't their moma and i ain't gonna coddle em.

 

Their murderers, terrorists and idiots.

 

I needed them for soldiers, nothing more.

Here here, they lost my good graces. **** 'em.

[l7986]

Fiona definitely made me more pro templar. I could sympathize with the guy that killed Hawke's mom and I was firmly pro mage in DA2, but god dam Fiona is a walking clusterfuck waiting to happen. I'm honestly surprised she didn't betray the location of Skyhold to Coryphifish when I made Lord Berand tranquil.

[raging_monkey]

Not controversial, incredibly stupid. So stupid that people thought it HAD to be braincontrol. And I'm honestly not completely against that.
 
It's about the equivalent of American teens running off to ISIS. It's that stupid.

they are called "disillusioned teens" lol

But really are the vints really so bad they arent what they were a thousand years ago

[SgtSteel91]

I was always sympathetic for the Mage but the game made me sympathetic towards the Templars.

 

Too bad you can't save both from The Elder One.

 

Adding to this since reading through the thread:

 

Both sides fucked up and the game gives enough room to justify allying or conscript them.