476 réponses à ce sujet

[Little Princess Peach]

Blame the people criticising DA2 who were pissed there were "no gender restrictions" in the game. Being able to romance everyone regardless of what gender you were was "too unrealistic."

it's a video game its supposed to be unrealistic lol

[DaemionMoadrin]

How is the blink and you'll miss it dialogue that points to affection on Juhani's part (which FemRevan can't actually reciprocate) an actual romance?

 

Fine, forget about the romance then. She's still the first lesbian companion and also the first lesbian Star Wars character.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

How is the blink and you'll miss it dialogue that points to affection on Juhani's part (which FemRevan can't actually reciprocate) an actual romance?

I remember hearing that Juhani was ment to be a proper F/F romance originally untill Lucas Arts lost their sh*t over it & pretty much f**ked her character over by removing scenes that involved her, a shame really

[daveliam]

How is the blink and you'll miss it dialogue that points to affection on Juhani's part (which FemRevan can't actually reciprocate) an actual romance?

 

Well, I can see why people would argue that she's not a "real romance", since that plot is about the same as Harding's in DA: I.  You can flirt a few times; she'll show interest back; then you'll decide to pursue it after the events of the game.

 

That being said, I personally think she counts.  In a time where there were very few f/f options (and, literally, zero m/m options), I think Juhani stands out as being significant.  The fact that they intended to create a quasi-romance with a lesbian party member was awesome, considering that it was a decade ago.  If she were a gay male instead, I'd totally count him as a m/m option for myself.  YMMV, though. 

 

But, yeah, the point does stand that Sera isn't the first lesbian party member.  She's the third lesbian and the second lesbian party member.  I think that's why Dorian got all of the "ZOMG! A gay is in the game!" press.  Because he actually was the first gay male party member. 

 

 

I remember hearing that Juhani was ment to be a proper F/F romance originally untill Lucas Arts lost their sh*t over it & pretty much f**ked her character over by removing scenes that involved her, a shame really

 

And the "bisexual bug" that allowed males to access her romance dialogue at first didn't help matters either.  No one people forget about her. 

[AEve1]

[snip]

100% behind all of this.

 

Also, like Voragoras says on the page before this, if the aim is "realism" then race-gating makes way more story sense than any other sort of LI restriction, unless maybe you're a human noble. But the writers aren't consistent with mentioning the actual ramifications of same-sex relationships for nobility anyway, so ....

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Like... what "justification" was there for THAT? Characters do not need "justification" to be anything but straight. And frankly it's also really tiring to see people as only seeing bisexual characters as "valid" or "Really bisexual" unless presented in a certain way. "You have to do XYZ before you are a TRUE BISEXUAL. You must give a resume proving you have had relations with one or more genders, or else your preferences don't exist." Like is the fact that they are interested in the PC regardless of gender not enough "proof" on the matter??

Is a unfortunate fact that there's alot of people who think a LGBT character needs a reason to explain why their not straight, they can't just happen to be gay they must have a reason or its just pandering

[finc.loki]

I find it kind of funny when people are trying to justify it with; "it's realistic".

 

Yet at the same time you realize it is not realistic that out of 12 random characters (companions/advisors) you have more female bisexual/homosexual choices. Not saying that it is wrong. Just that how is that part realistic? 2 straight choices and 2 male gay and some 2 female lesbian and some 6-7 bisexual (female).

 

 

Still I agree and not agree with the choice made. It makes sense a character has a set sexuality, but at the same time it limits choice and for some like straight/gay males it leaves only 2 options. Us men got shafted in this game for choice.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

I find it kind of funny when people are trying to justify it with; "it's realistic".
 
Yet at the same time you realize it is not realistic that out of 12 random characters (companions/advisors) you have more female bisexual/homosexual choices. Not saying that it is wrong. Just that how is that part realistic? 2 straight choices and 2 male gay and some 2 female lesbian and some 6-7 bisexual (female).
 
 
Still I agree and not agree with the choice made. It makes sense a character has a set sexuality, but at the same time it limits choice and for some like straight/gay males it leaves only 2 options. Us men got shafted in this game for choice.

The only PC with access to 6 romances is a bisexual elf, everyone else is restricted to 4 available choices with human female having 5, i don't get the anger about bisexual people having more options since it should be obvious

[Fandango]

We all have the same options and are limited only by the ways in which we are willing to role-play.

[daveliam]

Is a unfortunate fact that there's alot of people who think a LGBT character needs a reason to explain why their not straight, they can't just happen to be gay they must have a reason or its just pandering

 

It's a catch-22 situation:

 

Gay/Bisexual character discusses their sexuality in relation to their quest - "ZOMG!!! It's pandering!  Teh gay agenda is being shoved down my throat.  Why does sexuality have to be talked about?"

 

Gay/Bisexual character doesn't discuss their sexuality at all - "ZOMG!!!! It's pandering!  Teh gay agenda is being shoved down my throat.  This character doesn't even have a reason to be gay!  It's only there to please SJWs!"

[syllogi]

We all have the same options and are limited only by the ways in which we are willing to role-play.

 

If someone is specifically asking for diversity in same sex romance options, why is it their fault for not settling for what's already there, if they know they won't enjoy roleplaying a heterosexual romance?  You're placing blame on the player, when, while it's not an obligation for the devs to give them what they want, it's also not the player's obligation to force themselves to experience something that may be, at best boring, and at worse, really uncomfortable/possibly depressing for them.

[AEve1]

We all have the same options and are limited only by the ways in which we are willing to role-play.

True, but sometimes I get tired of role-playing in the same way that I have to role-play in almost every other franchise. There are straight narratives everywhere, so I prefer to play the non-straight ones in Bioware games.

[syllogi]

I'm not accusing anyone of anything syllogi. What's your problem this time?

 

You don't seem to be reading what I'm writing, so I'll stop responding to you.

[Fandango]

You don't seem to be reading what I'm writing, so I'll stop responding to you.

Yes please.

[syllogi]

LOL.  It's so telling when people who have NO investment in this issue get angry about it for no apparent reason.  If you're in this thread just to tell people to stop asking for stuff: what's the point?  If you got what you wanted out of the romances in DA:I, great!  If you want to say they worked for you, fine!  

 

But if you're not reading the feedback other people are providing, and you just want to tell them that they're wrong for having a different opinion and point of view from you, what are you getting out of trying to police how other people feel?

[Uirebhiril]

It's a catch-22 situation:

 

Gay/Bisexual character discusses their sexuality in relation to their quest - "ZOMG!!! It's pandering!  Teh gay agenda is being shoved down my throat.  Why does sexuality have to be talked about?"

 

Gay/Bisexual character doesn't discuss their sexuality at all - "ZOMG!!!! It's pandering!  Teh gay agenda is being shoved down my throat.  This character doesn't even have a reason to be gay!  It's only there to please SJWs!"

 

To be honest, I'm getting a little tired of seeing people comment that a character had no reason to be straight. There's no reason they couldn't be bi! It must have just been a budget thing because of course they should be whatever sexuality an individual wants them to be for a romance. They aren't people with their own preferences, ever. It's like we forget that this is how things actually work and everything must be for our whims and desires and to hell with an individual's own beliefs.

 

The respect really should go all ways, and on top of that, had there been all bisexual romances we probably would have had four total choices. Would some have preferred that? Probably. But who the heck complains about extra content? We only ever limit ourselves in playing these games. We have enough fantastical stuff with dragons and magic. Can't we have characters just be people and respect them as such?

 

..I hope this doesn't come across that I'm picking at what you posted, by the way. Just what you said reminded me of something that's been in the back of my mind for the last few weeks. I do agree with you either way.

[daveliam]

To be honest, I'm getting a little tired of seeing people comment that a character had no reason to be straight. There's no reason they couldn't be bi! It must have just been a budget thing because of course they should be whatever sexuality an individual wants them to be for a romance. They aren't people with their own preferences, ever. It's like we forget that this is how things actually work and everything must be for our whims and desires and to hell with an individual's own beliefs.

 

The respect really should go all ways, and on top of that, had there been all bisexual romances we probably would have had four total choices. Would some have preferred that? Probably. But who the heck complains about extra content? We only ever limit ourselves in playing these games. We have enough fantastical stuff with dragons and magic. Can't we have characters just be people and respect them as such?

 

..I hope this doesn't come across that I'm picking at what you posted, by the way. Just what you said reminded me of something that's been in the back of my mind for the last few weeks. I do agree with you either way.

 

I agree that anyone who uses that same argument about a straight character is equally wrong.  I'll be honest, though.  I haven't seen that very much.  I've seen it a bit about Cassandra, but that's usually framed more as "She gave off bisexual vibes, but then wasn't."  I guess I've seen it a bit with Cullen.  Maybe?  Not sure about that one.  Outside of that, I haven't seen any one say that Blackwall or Solas had no reason to be straight.  If they do, then they are equally as silly as the "this character has no reason to be gay" people. 

[DaemionMoadrin]

I agree that anyone who uses that same argument about a straight character is equally wrong.  I'll be honest, though.  I haven't seen that very much.  I've seen it a bit about Cassandra, but that's usually framed more as "She gave off bisexual vibes, but then wasn't."  I guess I've seen it a bit with Cullen.  Maybe?  Not sure about that one.  Outside of that, I haven't seen any one say that Blackwall or Solas had no reason to be straight.  If they do, then they are equally as silly as the "this character has no reason to be gay" people. 

 

The only gripe people have about Solas is that he opened up to a female dalish about ... classified stuff... and didn't tell the male dalish inquisitor. Which I personally feel is weird since he is always so concerned with his people.

[syllogi]

I agree that anyone who uses that same argument about a straight character is equally wrong.  I'll be honest, though.  I haven't seen that very much.  I've seen it a bit about Cassandra, but that's usually framed more as "She gave off bisexual vibes, but then wasn't."  I guess I've seen it a bit with Cullen.  Maybe?  Not sure about that one.  Outside of that, I haven't seen any one say that Blackwall or Solas had no reason to be straight.  If they do, then they are equally as silly as the "this character has no reason to be gay" people. 

 

My feeling is that because Solas is so important to the story, and frankly, I didn't get any sexual orientation vibes off him one way or another, even on my female elf character, it wouldn't be a big deal for him to have been bisexual or even gay.  I have no idea if there was a large number of people disappointed in the announcement that he was gated to female elves only, and I understand why he's only interested in elves, but considering how the romance went down, I don't see what the big deal would have been if he was attracted to male elves too.

 

Without delving too much into spoilers, I think it could totally work that a character like Solas isn't worried too much about gender when it comes to love or attraction.

[Mr.House]

I'm happy that everyone has a set sexuality and some characters like Cass, Cullen ect will turn you down, or in the case of Dorian, you can continue the playful flirting that goes nowhere or stop and just be friends.

[Uirebhiril]

The only gripe people have about Solas is that he opened up to a female dalish about ... classified stuff... and didn't tell the male dalish inquisitor. Which I personally feel is weird since he is always so concerned with his people.

 

Ha, no, there's plenty of people saying okay fine, the elf only stuff makes some sense but WHY NOT A MALE ELF TOO. Which goes right back to respecting the character as their own person and not the fulfillment of your own whims. If a character has a preference, who the hell are we to say otherwise? It gets me as chafed as people saying Dorian should have been bi. Like hell he should have. He should be Dorian. Whatever Dorian is should be secondary to that.

 

And Solas only opens up to a romanced female Dalish. That bit of connection has to go beyond respect and friendship for him, it seems. That he feels this only for females is his own damn agency as a well-written character.

[DaemionMoadrin]

Ha, no, there's plenty of people saying okay fine, the elf only stuff makes some sense but WHY NOT A MALE ELF TOO. Which goes right back to respecting the character as their own person and not the fulfillment of your own whims. If a character has a preference, who the hell are we to say otherwise? It gets me as chafed as people saying Dorian should have been bi. Like hell he should have. He should be Dorian. Whatever Dorian is should be secondary to that.

 

And Solas only opens up to a romanced female Dalish. That bit of connection has to go beyond respect and friendship for him, it seems. That he feels this only for females is his own damn agency as a well-written character.

 

Ok, you've got a point there. I probably need to play a female dalish elf next... if I can stomach another playthrough.

[Maverick827]

I personally believe the player should essentially be the dungeon master and have as much control over the game as realistically possible. Thus, entirely outside of gender debates, I believe it should be up to the player to be able to determine who is and who is not romanceable.

I would have thought that this would have been the "SJW-friendly" stance as well, to be honest. Does this current design not say that "gay people and straight people are just too different?"