BioWare doesn't need to get rid of the party, just look at Dragon's Dogma.
What they need to do is fully commit to what kind of game they are making. Perhaps they should drop the last trappings of a "tactical RPG" and just go full action. We're close enough already at this point. You can already play it like one with having parry, roll, and dodge in this game, it is just buried in the skill tree.
They would have to invest in improving the AI though.
I honestly don't know where they go from here. Their fanbase wants one thing and the audience EA desperately wants to attract wants something else entirely.
Don't touch my party members >C
Seriously, party members and interacting with them is one, if not the thing that makes a Dragon Age game a Dragon Age game. Removing that will accomplish what exactly? The problem isn't the party members, it's the bad AI and the less than useful tactical cam (which I don't use). Removing our beloved companions isn't gonna fix the issue because they aren't the issue.
BioWare doesn't need to get rid of the party, just look at Dragon's Dogma.
What they need to do is fully commit to what kind of game they are making. Perhaps they should drop the last trappings of a "tactical RPG" and just go full action. We're close enough already at this point. You can already play it like one with having parry, roll, and dodge in this game, it is just buried in the skill tree.
They would have to invest in improving the AI though.
Absolutely not. Bioware games are all about the player/npc relationships. It isn't Dark Souls. It's not Skyrim. It shouldn't be. You are a part of a ensemble cast which makes it a fundamentally different type of game. Adding more combat depth is one thing (though if you find it too easy I'd seriously recommend trying FF/nightmare); removing party members is in my mind actually the opposite.
I'm also not that sure what people hate so much about the combat. Are you using a controller? The PC settings suck, but with a wired controller it's been fine for me. In terms of party control, yeah the AI is worse than in origins, but I've had no problems with direct control. I view difficult combat as a semi-turn-based strategy game which I actually like quite a bit. It's more engaging than trying to program a finite state automata and pressing go.
Absolutely not. Bioware games are all about the player/npc relationships. It isn't Dark Souls. It's not Skyrim. It shouldn't be. You are a part of a ensemble cast which makes it a fundamentally different type of game. Adding more combat depth is one thing (though if you find it too easy I'd seriously recommend trying FF/nightmare); removing party members is in my mind actually the opposite.
I'm also not that sure what people hate so much about the combat. Are you using a controller? The PC settings suck, but with a wired controller it's been fine for me. In terms of party control, yeah the AI is worse than in origins, but I've had no problems with direct control. I view difficult combat as a semi-turn-based strategy game which I actually like quite a bit. It's more engaging than trying to program a finite state automata and pressing go.
Flawed presumptions.
Bonkers idea.
Just no.
I swear, if one more person on this board tells me what the fanbase wants.....
Nooo pls Bioware dont take out the party T.T
and
Non-Controlled party member sucks look at skyrim their companion system fails specially their AI
now if you cant control your party members in DA:I those guys will only suck and end every combat a blood fest (in your side)
The author probably wants to play a fully CRPG
Dragon Age a fully CRPG and no more tactical stuffs? No! --- NO! --- NO!
It's not that hard a concept to come to terms with, honestly, but you might be 'too close' to see it. It doesn't matter - Bioware has understood it and struggled with it for a few years now, and no doubt will continue to struggle with it.
What I mean is this: the fanbase is too diverse. And none has the right to claim something is the wish of the 'fanbase' just because they think so. Because there are others within the community also being fans who disagree. It is not from within that the fanbase general opinion can be stated. However I utterly dislike being told, my opinion is not valid, because fanbase thinks differently. Why am I or my opinion excluded from fanbase? That is what was spoken up against.
(This also is valid the other way. Just because someone doesn't agree with me, they still can be part of the fanbase.)
I had a lot of fun reading through the comments and it seems clear that the vast majority of you guys/gals see party based combat as something integral to the Bioware/DA experience, and that's fine. The lack of my own opinion in the OP was intentional because I didn't want to completely derail the thread from the start.
Personally I'm a huge fan of party based RPG's such as the older Infinity Engine games and DA:O was a fine addition to that list. Action RPG's like Skyrim (I agree, it's combat is the worst part of it even though I've been a fan of the series FPS like controls since Daggerfall) and Dark Souls also rank highly on my 'best of' lists. Dragon Age Inquisition however doesn't have a combat system that I can thoroughly enjoy, it doesn't give me the feeling that I'm actually in control of my party members. The tactical camera usually doesn't zoom out enough to give a full overview of the battle which forces me to use the 'action view', which I wouldn't really mind if the combat was more visceral and had more weight to it.
Be mindful everyone, I'm -only- talking about the combat here (as in the opening post). I know combat in Bioware games isn't something everyone thinks is important, that's fine. However, a lot of people, myself included, really like the tactical part of RPG's and probably feel that Bioware might not be making those type of games in the future. Which is fine to me as long as they manage to make the more action oriented combat (this meaning manually placing your attacks by doing button presses in contrast to auto attacking and queuing commands) feel more responsive and accurate like in Dark Souls. I felt like the reason that hadn't been done in DA:I is because Bioware sticked to having a party - I wasn't aware on how Dragon's Dogma was doing this the right way. Hence my opening post.
As you see I'm not really in favor of either action or tactical combat. I just hope they manage to create a more interesting combat system in the next installment of the DA franchise.
Your opinion is valid, it just doesn't carry enough weight to prevent the creation of a consensus among the fanbase. Bioware aren't concerned with what every single individual fan thinks (you, me or anybody else); they're concerned with what the consensus is. They already know what that consensus is, but they have to weigh it against what the rest of the market (potential customers) think too.What I mean is this: the fanbase is too diverse. And none has the right to claim something is the wish of the 'fanbase' just because they think so. Because there are others within the community also being fans who disagree. It is not from within that the fanbase general opinion can be stated. However I utterly dislike being told, my opinion is not valid, because fanbase thinks differently. Why am I or my opinion excluded from fanbase? That is what was spoken up against.
(This also is valid the other way. Just because someone doesn't agree with me, they still can be part of the fanbase.)
Absolutely not. Bioware games are all about the player/npc relationships. It isn't Dark Souls. It's not Skyrim. It shouldn't be. You are a part of a ensemble cast which makes it a fundamentally different type of game. Adding more combat depth is one thing (though if you find it too easy I'd seriously recommend trying FF/nightmare); removing party members is in my mind actually the opposite.
I'm also not that sure what people hate so much about the combat. Are you using a controller? The PC settings suck, but with a wired controller it's been fine for me. In terms of party control, yeah the AI is worse than in origins, but I've had no problems with direct control. I view difficult combat as a semi-turn-based strategy game which I actually like quite a bit. It's more engaging than trying to program a finite state automata and pressing go.
I definitely agree
I have no problem with micro-managing my party (im an authoritarian)
Yea PC UI is kinda difficult but i can Deal with it
eliminating the party or make them NPC is unacceptable for me...the author probably got lost Dragon Age is not a "Fully CombatRPG"
it is originally Tactical and through the years they adapted a partial combat style gameplay. Dragon Age is not Dragon Age with out the party and tactical stuffs (and the party banters)
I dont hate the author dont get me wrong, its nice having some nerd talks sometimes :3
Or they could listen to the feedback they got from this go round, and make tactical combat on PC that is both usable and challenging/enjoyable?
Sure. I just get ticked when "fanbase" gets defined in a way that doesn't include me, apparently because I don't like Bio games for the reasons that people of my generation are supposed to like them. Or rather, the generation that's a bit younger than mine; when this argument played out on the ME boards the self-described real RPG fans always turned out to have been between 15 and 25 when they played BG2.It's not that hard a concept to come to terms with, honestly, but you might be 'too close' to see it. It doesn't matter - Bioware has understood it and struggled with it for a few years now, and no doubt will continue to struggle with it.
The party system, bonding and relationships with your accompanying companions is one of the primary compositions of a BioWare RPG. If BioWare cans that in favor of going mainstream to be more like Ubisoft and Activision, they'd be 100% dead to me. There's already been enough compromises.
Remove party members? I don't think so! Bioware is literally the only company I can turn to that gives a decent RPG with a party system. Companions are one of the number one things that attracts me to their games. I'll accept mediocore combat if I can have story driven characters to play along with. There are plenty of other RPG styled games that provide more interesting combat if that is what you are looking for. Let Bioware continue to do what they do best.
Hey guys,
Whether you like DA:I combat or not, it is quite apparent that Bioware does not consider tactical party RPG's to be financially feasible for this generation of hardware. Right now, most people will have to agree that the combat system in DA:I is 'acceptable' at best. It doesn't have quite the weight of Dark Souls combat or the accuracy/timing of Skyrim combat. A large reason the combat is like this is because it allows for some degree of tactical control utilizing all your party members.
To me, the next logical step which could actually improve the combat greatly, is removing party members (who can be controlled manually) from the equation. I know, Bioware games usually lean heavily on party banters and such - that's why I think it might still be feasible to have perhaps one non controllable NPC with you in the next DA games. It would be a heckuva lot easier to make responsive, skill based combat when Bioware only has to consider one or two party members in all.
The Mass Effect series has the benefit of FPS mechanics which invoke skill. The Dragon Age series used to have it's (old school) tactical mechanics - which have since then been stripped away. I'm trying to form a concept in my head on how this will evolve over their next games. Again, I'm not trying to say it's inherently bad they they aimed for more action oriented combat, I just think they should go the full mile.
What do you guys think?
Honestly, I think it's about the worst idea I've ever heard (in terms of game design... I've heard of LOTS of worse ideas IRL!). It's taking a game series with some fantastic RPG elements and removing them, making it even more into a action game (or Skyrim clone). I think they need to simply do a reversal and add back the elements they removed and they will have one hell of a game, maybe the best RPG of all time. Imagine DAI with the controls and tactics of DAO... Imagine DAI with the spectacular cut-scenes, deep characters, and memorable story of DAO... Then add an "I like action games please let me mash buttons a lot" mode for people who want Dragon Age to be just another of the many action-oriented games already available, but make that the after-thought, not the primary mode of play.
If the DA team just ripped out the tactical camera of DA1, and the ai/tactics menu of DA2, and shoved it into DA:I this thread wouldn't even exist...unless the drastic change in party AI was due to the new engine...then i'd be sorely wrong.
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