351 réponses à ce sujet

[Willowhugger]

Oh please, every clan you meet more or less immediately threathens you with bodily harm.

 

Every single time.

"Tresspassers will be shot" doesn't equal evil in my mind.

As for murdering those two humans.

That is your elf's decision but it's not one for your clan.

 

My .02.

[Chari]

I know what you mean

I just had to joke about that. Petrice is complicated in some ways.

I know. She can be actually sympathetic at times
Still a zealot of zealots and pain in the ass

[ArvinDulku]

It's funny how everyone who hates the dalish holds a massive grudge - just like the dalish.

 

I dont have a massive grudge, not at all.

 

I dont need to, DA lore has already shown me I was correct to think them an arogant, racist people who are content to mire themselves in a past which they dont even understand cause thye are content to blame everyone else for their lot in life without taking on an iota of responsibility.

 

Its all groovy.

[ArvinDulku]

"Tresspassers will be shot" doesn't equal evil in my mind.

As for murdering those two humans.

That is your elf's decision but it's not one for your clan.

 

My .02.

 

Elf squatting on human lands do not suddenly have the right to co-opt an area within it an deem people tresspassers.

 

No, please dont go there, cause my human will trample where he damn please.

[MoonDrummer]

I dont have a massive grudge, not at all.

I dont need to, DA lore has already shown me I was correct to think them an arogant, racist people who are content to mire themselves in a past which they dont even understand cause thye are content to blame everyone else for their lot in life without taking on an iota of responsibility.

Its all groovy.

You just said that you have hated the dalish ever since you had the choice to kill humans. Pretty grudgey if you ask me

[Willowhugger]

I think in Ferelden at least, they won the rights to hunt those lands. According to one of elders at least. Not that they can prevent tresspassers per se.. just that they aren't squatting.

 

Also, it's a giant ****ing forest.

 

Claiming it's "their" land is kind of iffy.

[ArvinDulku]

Also, it's a giant ****ing forest.

 

Claiming it's "their" land is kind of iffy.

 

Its is within the sovereign nation of Ferelden/Kirkwall/Whatever country they are passing through.

 

While I am not sure whom within the Bannorn might be privy to it in regards to land rights, it is without question human owned lands, under the crown or otherwise.

 

 

I think in Ferelden at least, they won the rights to hunt those lands. According to one of elders at least. Not that they can prevent tresspassers per se.. just that they aren't squatting.

 

I'll admit It's been awhile, so you may be right, but claiming "tresspassers" or think they have the right to kill unamred humans definately are not covered within said "rights".

[Gaesesagai]

I never got the impression the Dalish were all cute and cuddly like so many do apparently. From the lore I read (and I do tend to skip a lot of reading in game so eh, my opinion might be objectively wrong lol) I got the impression the Dalish are pretty much a "the goal justifies the means" type of... "organisation", ready and willing to be as ruthless and brutal as needed to further their goal of restoring the elves to their original glory. I mean aside from the Dalish clans we've seen, more or less willing to talk, I imagine most of them as the "kill human on spot" type of people... so yea... Still I don't really hold it against them, the overall impression I get is that of tragedy, seeing as how I don't think they'll succeed or realise that they won't succeed, basically dying out slowly and wasted on a futile quest.

[Addai]

The Andrastian world is falling to pieces but people are focusing a lot on the Dalish and their shortcomings. Which... personally, I think is a good thing, because it means that elven lore has moved more clearly into focus rather than just being lightly sketched and not very important to the overall scheme of events. People who focus more on being right or wrong versus "cool, this makes a better story," that's just sad. It's a video game world. Re-evaluate your life priorities.

DAI renewed my interest in the series, mainly because of the elven stuff. Since I identified with Mahariel before, I can take most of the new revelations in stride, even if I like some of them more than others. Your family is your family, even when the skeletons come out of the closet. I knew they were in there- or at least hoped there were some. Boring is worse than controversial.

[Chari]

The Andrastian world is falling to pieces but people are focusing a lot on the Dalish and their shortcomings. Which... personally, I think is a good thing, because it means that elven lore has moved more clearly into focus rather than just being lightly sketched and not very important to the overall scheme of events. People who focus more on being right or wrong versus "cool, this makes a better story," that's just sad. It's a video game world. Re-evaluate your life priorities.

DAI renewed my interest in the series, mainly because of the elven stuff. Since I identified with Mahariel before, I can take most of the new revelations in stride, even if I like some of them more than others. Your family is your family, even when the skeletons come out of the closet. I knew they were in there- or at least hoped there were some. Boring is worse than controversial.

You are right, it's good tgat elves are more important to the game than ever before
I just fear Bioware might decide to humiliate and massmurder them for lolz or whatever due to how they have been treating the dalish lately

[Colonelkillabee]

You are right, it's good tgat elves are more important to the game than ever before
I just fear Bioware might decide to humiliate and massmurder them for lolz or whatever due to how they have been treating the dalish lately

Hahaha, you know it's coming, lol. It's tradition at this point. Let the bodies hit the floor.

[Chari]

Hahaha, you know it's coming, lol. It's tradition at this point. Let the bodies hit the floor.

Lol, true

Don't you know, kids? Homicide, genocide and holocaust are fun! Good tradition indeed

[Han Shot First]

I like that the devs have been taking a wrecking ball to the 'noble victim' trope. I think that makes the Dalish seem more realistic. Find any civilization in our own past who ended up conquered or oppressed by outsiders, and you'll also likely find that at some point in their past they were equally douchey to other cultures or civilizations.

[Colonelkillabee]

Lol, true

Don't you know, kids? Homicide, genocide and holocaust are fun! Good tradition indeed

I get a freckle every time a dalish clan is wiped out, lol.

[herkles]

I like that the devs have been taking a wrecking ball to the 'noble victim' trope. I think that makes the Dalish seem more realistic. Find any civilization in our own past who ended up conquered or oppressed by outsiders, and you'll also likely find that at some point in their past they were equally douchey to other cultures or civilizations.

That is kind of my view as well. They can be jerks or they can not be. They are not 100% evil nor are they the opposite. They are people, and people are flawed. Some are dounright assholes, others try to do good despite their failings. For the tribes that hate humans, you also have tribes that trade with them. For those that send mages out to die if they are over 3, you have those that negotiate with other clans or just keep them. 

 

If you just hammer down on the fact that x group of people are evil, that is just as bad IMO as doing the opposite. Dalish are flawed, but so are the people of Orlais, Nevarra, Rivain, The Qun, Tevinter, Fereldan, and everywhere else. You can't say "all the dalish are evil" or "all the dalish are just victims" when neither is the case. 

 

As for their religion, being that I dabled in Celtic Reconstructionism for a bit before I settled comfortablly into Hellenismos; I have sympathy for them. Celtic Reconstruction is the faith and practice of reviving the traditions of the ancient celts, often sub-divided into gaelic, gallic, or welsh. Considering how much the Dalish have preserved is almost envious when viewed in comparision, and in a narrative sense it does make them tragic. 

[Camenae]

I feel very sorry for the Dalish. It is just sad how hard they claw and cling to their dead culture. But it WAS beautiful and majestic once. I do not fault them at all for trying to preserve it.

Their efforts, and the resulting isolationism, all smack of desperation. I don't blame them for it. I think the isolationism is a natural reaction. Any group in a similar situation would react the same. Because their culture is dying as it is. To still be perfectly accepting and assimilating of other cultures will speed up the demise of their culture altogether. Regardless of whether one thinks their culture deserves to just die out or not, the fact remains that if they just happily accept other cultures and let everybody in, it WILL die because of their relative position in the power structure and their dwindling numbers. The recessive genes don't help. It will be like a few drops of (elf) ink sprinkled into the (human) ocean--they will be quickly swallowed into nothing.

The Dalish can't be all melting-pot-USA because their cultural identity is far shakier and their numbers far fewer. They've lost so much of their (once-) beautiful and complex heritage but they haven't given up. I respect that.

I feel for them the same way I would feel for a beautiful woman who was then horribly disfigured, and after that, rather than look in the mirror and face herself as she looks now, prefers to seek solace in photo albums of herself from the past. Maybe she was stupid and reckless and the accident that disfigured her was no one's fault but her own, still doesn't keep me from feeling bad for her.

I find Solas' attitude INFURIATING. Yes the Dalish are wrong about so much, so instead of feeling superior, write a book or something about what YOU DO KNOW and set them straight! Yes they'll be resistant and cop an attitude, but who wouldn't when told that everything you thought you knew about your culture was wrong wrong wrong? If I insisted that the woman I mentioned above in my hypothetical to look in a mirror before she is ready, can I blame her if she smashed the mirror and spit on me for being cruel? The cognitive dissonance is enormous so let them rant and lash out a bit. It'd be like a six-year-old who hates going to school. Are you going to be like oh well it's his fault he has a bad attitude towards learning I guess I'll just let him stay illiterate?

[Dabrikishaw]

Worse than ever, but I consider that a good thing. I enjoyed all the revelations about the Dalish.

[Colonelkillabee]

I find Solas' attitude INFURIATING. Yes the Dalish are wrong about so much, so instead of feeling superior, write a book or something about what YOU DO KNOW and set them straight! Yes they'll be resistant and cop an attitude, but who wouldn't when told that everything you thought you knew about your culture was wrong wrong wrong? If I insisted that the woman I mentioned above in my hypothetical to look in a mirror before she is ready, can I blame her if she smashed the mirror and spit on me for being cruel? The cognitive dissonance is enormous so let them rant and lash out a bit. It'd be like a six-year-old who hates going to school. Are you going to be like oh well it's his fault he has a bad attitude towards learning I guess I'll just let him stay illiterate?

 

 

No but I would give his little bad ass the belt until he understands he has no choice but to go to school. It's not your responsibility to make sure they drink, only that they're brought to the fountain. And I don't care who you are, you spit in my face, I beat you senseless. The Dalish can be mad all they want, but lash out, and I lash back. That part's not really about Solas though, more about how I view the Dalish and their attitude about their past in general.

 

But the thing about Solas is the Dalish to him are not his responsibility. So that I understand.

 

As for the rest, I don't personally blame the Dalish at all for their isolation and their attitude of preservation. That whole melting pot thing is overrated. But it does come with its consequences, and at the end of the day, those consequences are their own fault. When they start blaming others for their choices is when I start getting pissed.

[MadameQuizzy]

I think what bugs me about the representation of Dalish more than their attitudes (from some clans at least) is that Dalish seem to be very... backwards. In lack of a proper word (feel free to help me out here) - what I mean, they're never really shown as innovative, neither in magical areas nor in worldy affairs (except for the Lavellan clan sending the inquisitor to watch the Conclave), they don't seem to have any technical, architectural or other sort of expertise like e.g. the dwarves nor do they seem to have proper training or education as the Qunari have (talking about the system in place here, not the whole following the Qun business). All I feel that I know about the Dalish is that they have hunters and keepers and maximum three mages. 

 

I wish they had some sort of trait like being excellent traders or herbalists or scholars or... I don't know. 

[Colonelkillabee]

I think what bugs me about the representation of Dalish more than their attitudes (from some clans at least) is that Dalish seem to be very... backwards. In lack of a proper word (feel free to help me out here) - what I mean, they're never really shown as innovative, neither in magical areas nor in worldy affairs (except for the Lavellan clan sending the inquisitor to watch the Conclave), they don't seem to have any technical, architectural or other sort of expertise like e.g. the dwarves nor do they seem to have proper training or education as the Qunari have (talking about the system in place here, not the whole following the Qun business). All I feel that I know about the Dalish is that they have hunters and keepers and maximum three mages. 

 

I wish they had some sort of trait like being excellent traders or herbalists or scholars or... I don't know. 

They're excellent archers, and being mages outside of the circle means their mages tend to be more formidable. They're ruthless and the best hunters and trackers out there. They have a lot of admirable traits, one of which is also respect for things they shouldn't meddle in, as well as the natural order of things. They're a wise people. Sometimes.

[Jaison1986]

I never liked the Dalish. I didn't kill any of the clans I met, that being said, I won't shed any tears if they meet their demise at someone else hands. The only elves I feel any sympathy for are the city elves. They at least try to live their lives the best they can and move foward, rather then the dalish who do nothing but keep staring backwards.