Oh interesting - I gave her the real heart. So if you give her the fake heart he just dies and doesn't speak?
Yes, and she's pretty upset afterwards. She tells the Inquisitor that she knows they screwed up the potion, and says you've condemned a man for no good reason. I don't think that sounds like she got what she wanted from his death.
I gave her the real heart but she still seemed really resentful to me. I think it was because I forced the issue of knowing what it was she wanted it for. She did not seem too happy about my being there to witness it. I found myself wondering why she was so hostile to the Inquisitor knowing what she wanted the heart for? I mean you're asking us to risk our members on some hunt and you can't say why? I thought Viv was really nervy to pull that. Not sure even seeing what she wanted it for made me more mellow to her. I was still pretty angry that she was so cagey about the whole deal and willing to ask people to risk their lives for her secret.
Just because he dies right after she makes the potion and gives it to him is no reason to think she poisoned him, but it is the common media cliche to make her the most likely suspect if he actually was poisoned. However, if you are also familiar with the usual media clichés in mysteries, then you also know that the first and most likely/obvious suspect is also usually the one least likely to have actually done it.
Just because he dies right after she makes the potion and gives it to him is no reason to think she poisoned him, but it is the common media cliche to make her the most likely suspect if he actually was poisoned. However, if you are also familiar with the usual media clichés in mysteries, then you also know that the first and most likely/obvious suspect is also usually the one least likely to have actually done it.
Going all Sherlock Holmes on us 'ey.
Nah, just pointing out that I can't remember the last time the most obvious suspect was the one what actually done it. 
But, hey, maybe Viv is counting on it!
Nah, just pointing out that I can't remember the last time the most obvious suspect was the one what actually done it.
But, hey, maybe Viv is counting on it!
Luthor - Season 1, Episode 1.
Nah, just pointing out that I can't remember the last time the most obvious suspect was the one what actually done it.
But, hey, maybe Viv is counting on it!
But in this case it isn't a whodunit with a list of possible suspects. It's simply a matter of what her intentions were. I'm comfortable with the idea that she truly tried to save him after reading some of these posts.
I never actually thought she had poisoned him. It always just looked like he was an old man and was dying. Her super-potion didn't work and he died of natural causes.
I interpreted it as her actually just being an incompetent alchemist. The potion fails regardless of whether she gets the real heart of not, so I just choose to believe she's all talk and no walk, so to speak.
I always assumed she poisoned him, but if he dies anyway when you give her the fake heart, I suppose that settles it.
I genuinely think she wanted to save him...... but i seriously doubt she actually loved him, cared for in her own way and upset at his death. But nothing resembling love, she made it plain that their relationship was political, She's no different than any other orlesian noble. He died, she put on her mask of the morning mistress and quickly moved on to plan B.
I'm thinking now, with learning that the fake heart still results in his death, that perhaps her intent was to make him lucid for a final moment so she could say goodbye?
I'm thinking now, with learning that the fake heart still results in his death, that perhaps her intent was to make him lucid for a final moment so she could say goodbye?
I like it.
I like it.
I'd like to believe it, because despite her attitude being usually the kind I can't stand, I did grow to enjoy Vivienne for some reason. lol.
I'd like to believe it, because despite her attitude being usually the kind I can't stand, I did grow to enjoy Vivienne for some reason. lol.
Maybe because she is honest and steadfast with her views?
Maybe because she is honest and steadfast with her views?
Yeah, I like how she's honest about who she is. She doesn't try to hide what she wants, people can take it or leave it. That's the kinda person I can disagree with, but still respect.
Mine as well. I did think it was odd that the she doesn't just flat out say what her intention was afterwards.Am I the only one who *didn't* interpret this as poison?
...
Am I the only one who *didn't* interpret this as poison? The potion was called an "age regression" potion. I thought she was trying to save him and it just didn't work? If she just wants to give him a poison to make him fall asleep and die, she doesn't need especially exotic ingredients for that.
I didn't interpret it as poison on my first playthrough. I took Vivienne at her word, as despite my personal dislike for the character, my Inquisitor had a sense of respect for her.
On my second playthrough, playing a dalish mage this time, not so much. Did the quest, but when Bastien's family came to Skyhold I decided to take the hardline path of accusing her of using me. She gleefully admitted to it and seemed down right jolly that Bastien's death gave her access to the grand clerics and council of heralds.
So I think poison is a perfectly valid interpretation of the scene and Vivienne's character.
I see Vivienne as an extremely pragmatic person. So, even if Bastien's death made her really sad on the inside, if she can use this situation to gain more favors, then she'll totally do it. You can mope and not gain anything, or you can be stoic and gain the advantage.
I read it as being too late to save him, like I didn't get the heart to her in time. Vivienne seemed truly heartbroken to me.
I thought she knew he was dying & that the cure likely wouldn't work, with the biggest reason she asked the Inquisitor to get the heart was to win favour with his powerful family, giving herself & the inquisition more power out of his death
I thought she knew he was dying & that the cure likely wouldn't work, with the biggest reason she asked the Inquisitor to get the heart was to win favour with his powerful family, giving herself & the inquisition more power out of his death
Yeah I can see that as well. She could have known the death was inevitable but wanted the family to notice the lengths she & the Inquisitor went through to save them to get their gratitude.
I will say that I don't think poison - or even then, poison with malicious intent is the only way the scene can be interpreted. I think that her legit trying to cure him, her mercy killing him, and her poisoning him for selfish gain are all perfectly valid ways to interpret the scene.
If you give her a fake heart, her tarot card changes into something really scary... just saying 
I think she tried to save him or actually did care for him. I mean I don't know what he was suffering from, but from brief descriptions from the game, it could have been akin to terminal cancer.
Seemed pretty obvious to me that she loved him. It wasn't a ruse, or some attempt to get him out of the way.
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