Female Warden identifies as a woman, and says she's a woman.
If she said "but I'm a man," and looked (so to speak, cut her hair/bound her bosom) somewhat like a man, Sten would accept her as a man. But since female warden is arguably feminine, he questions why she fights.
Not that hard to grasp Krem being accepted.
yes because the Qun is touted as the embodiment of modern sensibilities of enlightenment, with their "a farmer is always a farmer"
I know the difference, I simply don't see a need to leave it out of discussion as they're very closely related. I don't need you to explain anything to me.
You clearly don't understand as well as you think you do if you feel that Krem should be included in a conversation about "non-hetero" characters. Are you also including Mother Giselle in this conversation? After all, she might be a lesbian too. We know as much about her gender identity and sexual orientation as we do about Krem.
You clearly don't understand as well as you think you do if you feel that Krem should be included in a conversation about "non-hetero" characters. Are you also including Mother Giselle in this conversation? After all, she might be a lesbian too. We know as much about her gender identity and sexual orientation as we do about Krem.
I think you should just get over the fact that I don't agree with you and I'm going to talk about what I want. I'm clearly not the only one. Hound them.
And that's the end of it from my side as far as you and me go.
We know as much about her gender identity and sexual orientation as we do about Krem.
but we know Krem's gender identity and its never brought up with Giselle (but I think you'd be hard pressed to say she's trans)
yes because the Qun is touted as the embodiment of modern sensibilities of enlightenment, with their "a farmer is always a farmer"
Thank you.
but we know Krem's gender identity and its never brought up with Giselle (but I think you'd be hard pressed to say she's trans)
She's a Revered Mother, a female only position in the Chantry..... (agreed she's likely not trans, but that wouldn't matter because the poll isn't about trans people; it's about non-hetero people)
I think you should just get over the fact that I don't agree with you and I'm going to talk about what I want. I'm clearly not the only one. Hound them.
And that's the end of it from my side as far as you and me go.
Because you are factually incorrect and refuse to accept it. There's no debate here. There's me saying the truth and you pretending like it's not the truth. There's nothing to "agree" about except for the truth.
Wow Mother Giselle just became way more interesting to me, lmfao.
Mmm older lady priest lesbian LI, so deliciously forbidden.
special romance cutscenes include randomly bursting out into song!
She's a Revered Mother, a female only position in the Chantry.....
yeah and the Papacy is Male only, except for the one time a woman managed to be made Pope.....
Besides, its a title not a statement on her identity, but I don't think we have any reason to believe she is trans, and I don't see anything wrong if she was, so the point is moot
They're rather closely related if you ask me, that's why it's the LGBT community, and not the LGB community.
There's an alliance between non-heterosexual people and non-cisgendered people because people like you confuse the two anyway and we might as well take advantage of it when it comes to strength in numbers. That still doesn't mean sexual orientation and gender identity have anything to do with with each other. You could say that ethnic minorities and religious minorities are the same thing because they face similar struggles and some people happen to be both. You'd still be wrong, though.
special romance cutscenes include randomly bursting out into song!
"Climb every mountain, search high and low..." 
yeah and the Papacy is Male only, except for the one time a woman managed to be made Pope.....
Besides, its a title not a statement on her identity, but I don't think we have any reason to believe she is trans, and I don't see anything wrong if she was, so the point is moot
I don't think she's trans. Again, being trans has no relevance on your hetero or non-hetero status. My argument is that we know that she's a woman and we don't know her sexuality. She is as relevant to this thread as Krem is. If you think it's silly to bring her up, then you should understand why it's equally silly to bring up Krem, who is a man whose sexuality is unknown.
All of this doesn't much matter anyway, as my original point was of the lore that was broken. Sten clearly says that a woman being a man to them was as attainable as reaching the moon. If as someone suggested, it was as easy as making yourself look like the gender you identified with, then it wouldn't be "unattainable". Since according to Iron Bull, it's as simple as taking up the world's most elaborate roleplay ever.
I don't care who's represented, but when you change lore for it, that's when it comes off as preachy to me.
There's an alliance between non-heterosexual people and non-cisgendered people because people like you confuse the two anyway and we might as well take advantage of it when it comes to strength in numbers. That still doesn't mean sexual orientation and gender identity have anything to do with with each other. You could say that ethnic minorities and religious minorities are the same thing because they face similar struggles and some people happen to be both. You'd still be wrong, though.
Except that I'm not confusing them. I'm saying that one should be able to talk about things that are similarly related. Not sure whats so wrong about that. You people seem to have some outside animosity that you're attaching to me for whatever reason.
All of this doesn't much matter anyway, as my original point was of the lore that was broken. Sten clearly says that a woman being a man to them was as attainable as reaching the moon. If as someone suggested, it was as easy as making yourself look like the gender you identified with, then it wouldn't be "unattainable". Since according to Iron Bull, it's as simple as taking up the world's most elaborate roleplay ever.
I don't care who's represented, but when you change lore for it, that's when it comes off as preachy to me.
Right, your point about lore around gender identity, which isn't the same as sexual orientation. That's the whole point of this conversation. You brought up Krem and gender identity as if it had any bearing on a poll about sexual orientation.
Except that I'm not confusing them. I'm saying that one should be able to talk about things that are similarly related. Not sure whats so wrong about that. You people seem to have some outside animosity that you're attaching to me for whatever reason.
Because people are explaining to you that they are different and first you said that they are different, but not really that different. And now you claim to understand that they are different, but then continue to bring it up as if they aren't. That's the point. If Krem is into guys, then he's totally relevant. But, is he? We have no idea.
I will say that the mods would probably think it redundant to open up a separate thread for gender identity when we are already discussing it here.
Whether it merits comparison or not
Right, your point about lore around gender identity, which isn't the same as sexual orientation. That's the whole point of this conversation. You brought up Krem and gender identity as if it had any bearing on a poll about sexual orientation.
Because people are explaining to you that they are different and first you said that they are different, but not really that different. And now you claim to understand that they are different, but then continue to bring it up as if they aren't. That's the point. If Krem is into guys, then he's totally relevant. But, is he? We have no idea.
And it is, because gender identity is related to sexuality, and that's why the LGBT consider themselves of the same community. Again, they do it themselves all the time. When I do it to state an opinion that is controversial however, it's suddenly an issue.
I never said they weren't different. Not "really that different" is still different. I'm merely saying they're related. I've always known they weren't the same. You made the assumption that I did not to try and brand me ignorant.
Eh, I don't really get the point of this poll.
Queer people exist and ought to be represented, end of story. Whether it makes some people uncomfortable is utterly irrelevant.
And it is, because gender identity is related to sexuality, and that's why the LGBT consider themselves of the same community. Again, they do it themselves all the time. When I do it to state an opinion that is controversial however, it's suddenly an issue.
I never said they weren't different. Not "really that different" is still different. I'm merely saying they're related. I've always known they weren't the same. You made the assumption that I did not to try and brand me ignorant.
I wouldn't use the "community" argument because many people within the "community" (both trans and not trans) argue that it's not really one community at all. Maybe that's part of the communication issue here. As a member of said "community", I regularly see arguments from both sides saying that the idea of being one big happy family is becoming more and more fictional.
My point stands, though. Krem is not related to the poll unless we know that he's into guys. Otherwise, he's no more related to it than any other character whose gender we know but sexuality is unknown.
Thing is, I don't see Krem as a man, so if she were into girls, she'd be gay to me. I wouldn't yell at her and say "HEYYYY, YOU'RE GAAYY!" However, as just like people who gay marry, I don't care about people's personal business. Krem being trans, gay or straight doesn't stop her from fighting, so I don't care.
A genuine piece of advice. (And I'm trying not to sound condescending). The devs have stated on the boards that Krem is a male and there aren't to be pronoun debates about him. Purposefully misgendering him will probably not go over well. If you feel that you need to discuss it further, just be aware that it might not be well received on the boards. I'm sure that there is a whole different conversation that this comment could spur, but I'm going to step out of it at this point.
(Heavy breathing.)Mmm older lady priest lesbian LI, so deliciously forbidden.
(Heavy breathing.)
The dance my Lafy Inquisitor had with Florianne was hands down the hottest thing in the game. Innocent young Inquisitor and the dangerous, cunning, worldly, older Duchess. Oh my god yes...
yeah who doesn't like traitors who work for elder abominations bent on ascending to godhood?
gets me going everytime
I don't understand the male/female part of the poll. Why is it divided in half by sex? Am I supposed to use my own sex or my character's sex? Why does the poll maker want to know my sex anyway? What if the poll doesn't properly represent my sex?
So I don't know what to pick from the choices that are offered. If I could, I'd select gender neutral "I don't like it when characters I'm interested in are gender-gated."
A genuine piece of advice. (And I'm trying not to sound condescending). The devs have stated on the boards that Krem is a male and there aren't to be pronoun debates about him. Purposefully misgendering him will probably not go over well. If you feel that you need to discuss it further, just be aware that it might not be well received on the boards. I'm sure that there is a whole different conversation that this comment could spur, but I'm going to step out of it at this point.
I'm fully aware of that, and I didn't wish to go into it as I said before. I only brought it up now because it was stated to make a point against my previous argument. That and I feel compelled to stay true to my opinion.
Anyway, like I said, sexuality, gender identity, they're factually different when we're talking science, but as a social issue, they're not so much. Social constructs of humans tend to be inaccurate, like our "races" when we're all really one race, the human race. But social constructs are what they are. And in our society, anything related to sexuality remotely is considered of the same topic.
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