91 réponses à ce sujet

[Sergwynn]

People don't want KE to be nerfed since it's not a fun class to play to begin with.  If you play it how you're supposed to, you have 2 or 3 offensive spells you lean on and the rest are there just for flavor.  They don't deal massive damage like the other OP classes.  Their thing is being really tanky.

 

With that said, the people who are complaining the loudest are the ones building their KE off of everyones "omg this build owns" guide which is streamlined to faceroll stuff because the build was min/maxed.  The KE is probably the best built class in the game, all you have to do is look at how well KE synergizes with the other trees and their passives.  This is without even mentioning what you can do with master craft stuff.

 

So players set their KE up with this build then wonder why they can't die and cry about it being too OP.

 

Meanwhile other classes can be just as tanky and kill three times as faster.  No one says anything about this because with the KE there's no ramp up speed to hit optimal build.  The other classes take a bit to get their feet under them, but when they do they outclass the KE in terms of damage and tankyness (depending on the class)

 

The KE by default is in light armor, and gains barrier via damage.  People are saying to reduce the amount of barrier they get through damage, but fail to realize that's how they stay alive in light armor. The minute you reduce the damage they do, or reduce the amount of barrier they can get via damage, they become a useless class no one will ever play.  You can't nerf a class because it's unkillable after you throw a mage in heavy masterclass armor with a weapon that has +5 guard on hit. No duh it's unkillable.

 

The only way people are going to drift away from KE is to buff Necro and Rift Mages, right now they're very very lack luster.

 

 

I'll never understand why people complain about being OP when they use a build designed around using the best synergies and masterclass gear.

 

If people are looking for a challenge, then pick the crappiest class combo in the game and beat it on nightmare that way.

[Colonelkillabee]

How is KE boring? If you're holding down the Spirit Blade button you're playing it wrong. 

 

Knight Enchanter is all about versatility.

 

Fade Cloak then Fade Step into a mini boss. If there are more enemies around after downing mini boss use the Spirit Blade and Stasis Field. Once your cooled down from Fade Step leave the thick of action and nuke your enemies from range. If a mook comes at you either Fade Step/Fade Cloak away or use your Spirit Blade/Stasis Field.

 

I suspect people that have this ridiculous notion that Knight Enchanter is boring are stuck in the comfort zone of spamming the Spirit Blade for every single fight when in reality the specialization is probably one of the most fun and flexible in the game.

 

 

OMG How is KE not fun? It's 'boring' because you're using - one ability - over and over and over and over. There are eight ability slots last time I checked.

 

 

First, "Muh Opinions". You can't just assume she doesn't know how to use the class without asking. She's not into close combat in general, so even though that isn't the only way to play it, I'm not surprised she doesn't like it. And either way, one can find it boring simply because it makes the game too easy. You don't know. Maybe you should ask.

 

Second, hypothetically if that was what she did, it's really not up to the player to make the class more interesting by mixing up the gameplay, if all you need to do is spam one ability. Same for people saying "Just skip passives!" That defeats the whole purpose. You shouldn't HAVE to skip anything. You shouldn't have to stop using a certain ability because its op. That's a sign of game imbalance and poor design.

[Sergwynn]

OMG How is KE not fun? It's 'boring' because you're using - one ability - over and over and over and over. There are eight ability slots last time I checked.

 

Because Spirit Blade is the faster attacking spell which keeps the barrier up a little bit (it doesn't hit hard and they removed the detonation ability on it to stop combos from giving a full shield). You NEED this spell and you need to be spamming it if you're min/maxing the KE and using Clean Burn to reduce all other cooldowns.

 

Fire Mine is good for a hard knock down and big damage

 

Fade Cloak (upgraded) is nice for cancelling any CC on your character and dealing damage

 

These are the only attacks you really need to keep barrier flowing throughout a fight and you need Solas using Pull of the Abyss to set up massive AoE combos with Fire Mine and Fade Cloak.

 

Everything else is just flavor by the player, but it isn't needed at all.  It's a very low skill cap class if you wanna call it that.  Easy to use and easy to master because of how well Bioware crafted the synergy between tree passives for it. Intended or not. 

[Addai]

OMG How is KE not fun? It's 'boring' because you're using - one ability - over and over and over and over. There are eight ability slots last time I checked.

Wait- click- wait- click- wait- click.

 

Boring. Plus I can do more damage with staff and elemental spells in the time it takes for the Spirit Blade cooldown to finish, and I don't have to switch back and forth. Also didn't like Disruption Field and Fade Cloak is not as fun as the fadewalk ability you get in the ice line.

 

Spirit Blade also takes up a slot when 8 slots for a mage is not nearly enough. It's just not useful enough to justify it. I don't go dragon hunting, which appears to be the only situation where it's especially useful, and I don't even think it's very useful then.

[Colonelkillabee]

facepalm

[Sergwynn]

Oooh so it is boring... On PC

 

Buying a gamepad would be my suggestion. And the cooldown on SB is so short it's trivial.

 

I had no idea using a controller over a KB&M changed how a character played.

 

mind blown.

[Addai]

Oooh so it is boring... On PC

 

Buying a gamepad would be my suggestion. And the cooldown on SB is so short it's trivial.

Ugh, whatever.

 

In the time it takes for two hits of Spirit Blade and a cooldown, I can paralyze a dude then melt his face off. That works much better for me.

[Colonelkillabee]

I had no idea using a controller over a KB&M changed how a character played.

 

mind blown.

To be fair, close quarters combat does seem to me more fun with a controller.

 

That said, plenty of people like KE with M and K, and there's plenty of valid reasons to find that class boring as hell.

 

Part of being a mage is that you light **** up and make things explode everywhere. If I'm just going to sit close and spam spirit blade, why don't I just go make a warrior instead? Bull rush more or less has the same properties as the fade phase thing anyway, and even builds guard like KE builds barrier when hitting something.

 

Rather similar.

[Addai]

I don't know what to tell y'all then. If you're convinced KE is 'boring' so be it. It isn't; it's the only class that allows the player to attack from any range. Min-Maxing and being too vaginal to take a hit makes it boring. 

Er, what? I can attack as an elemental mage from short range. There are a number of spells that let you do CC and deal damage at close range, and all the long range ones work just as well in someone's face.

[Colonelkillabee]

I don't know what to tell y'all then. If you're convinced KE is 'boring' so be it. It isn't; it's the only class that allows the player to attack from any range. Min-Maxing and being too vaginal to take a hit makes it boring. 

Again, facepalm. You can't tell someone who is bored with something it isn't boring...

 

People find warriors boring and I personally find them to be the most fun class out there. I like to be up close and personal when making my foes bleed. I think that people would find this class more fun if they tried things my way, but I get that people don't because they have their own routine same as me. Doesn't make them "vaginal". What the **** does that even mean in this setting, it's a damn videogame, not a real fight. You've got some issues to work out, jabroni.

[Fullmetall21]

So was the Arcane Warrior more of a challenge in Origins? I don't think so he was pretty much indestructible as well and as others have said every class after a certain point becomes overpowered. 

[Addai]

LOL... taking people on the internet literally is bad for you bro. I thought you knew that by now. 

 

The little comment about 'vaginal' was about the passive that boosts barrier/hit. KE encourages people to get into comfort zone of spamming Spirit Blade while generating barrier. If you're doing that it is boring. But IMO Knight Enchanter is not meant to be played like that. Those passives are there for when enemies are in close range. But you don't have to be in close range the entire time. But said comfort zone of ten million barrier hp and nigh invulnerability encourages spamming. That's the only problem with the class. Folks don't recognize it, stay in that comfort zone, then complain that it's boring. 

That is not how I play at all, so you're just making assumptions. For a while I kept Spirit Blade in a slot and would just use it when enemies closed or when a dragon sucked her in. Even then it just wasn't all that useful. A spell has to earn its spot in a very limited 8-slot array. Dispel is the only other spell I keep that I only use occasionally, but it's too valuable for closing rifts so it earns its spot there. The KE abilities really don't.

 

Disruption Field is useless to me because I always have Solas in my party and he's got upgraded Rift Mage abilities that weaken enemies.

[Sergwynn]

First, "Muh Opinions". You can't just assume she doesn't know how to use the class without asking. She's not into close combat in general, so even though that isn't the only way to play it, I'm not surprised she doesn't like it. And either way, one can find it boring simply because it makes the game too easy. You don't know. Maybe you should ask.

 

Second, hypothetically if that was what she did, it's really not up to the player to make the class more interesting by mixing up the gameplay, if all you need to do is spam one ability. Same for people saying "Just skip passives!" That defeats the whole purpose. You shouldn't HAVE to skip anything. You shouldn't have to stop using a certain ability because its op. That's a sign of game imbalance and poor design.

 

Having the KE synergize with passives from every other tree isn't poor design, that's great design

 

The whole lore behind the Knight Enchanter was it's based off the old elven Arcane Warrior which were Melee Mages in shining steel armor.  The "proper" way of playing it is in melee if you're a lore nut, it just so happens that you can snag a lot of the passives from every tree that help you stay in melee range.  Also, Clean Burn really helps the class with very short CDs since Spirit Blade is a spell.

 

Is the class strong? yes

Is the class OP? No more then the other classes

Does KE need to be nerfed? Not really, it doesn't so massive amounts of damage. it's just tanky.

Is KE boring as a class? I'd say yes but it's subjective of course, it's a class built around a few skills and a lot of passives.  It's essentially a warrior with a magic sword.

 

I still say the KE is getting so much flak is because Necro and Rift Mage are crap in comparison.

[Colonelkillabee]

snip

It isn't a great design if the passives all allow one ability to solo enemies by yourself. Like champion, KEs can solo even the strongest of dragons on the greatest difficulty.

 

I'm not saying they should nerf it, but the game is imbalanced. Laughably so. If one specialization is so much better than the others, that's the very definition of imbalance, which means poor design.

 

Poor design for a videogame's balance, mind you, not poor design for efficiency.

[Colonelkillabee]

LOL... taking people on the internet literally is bad for you bro. I thought you knew that by now. 

 

The little comment about 'vaginal' was about the passive that boosts barrier/hit. KE encourages people to get into the comfort zone of spamming Spirit Blade while generating barrier. If you're doing that it is boring. But IMO Knight Enchanter is not meant to be played like that. Those passives are there for when enemies are in close range. But you don't have to be in close range the entire time. But said comfort zone of ten million barrier hp and nigh invulnerability encourages spamming. That's the only problem with the class. Folks don't recognize it, stay in that comfort zone, then complain that it's boring. 

Sorry, but no. If you're going to say stupid **** I'm going to call you out on it, no matter the explanation.

 

As for the comfort zone, if that was how someone played, it's not their fault the game makes things so dreadfully easy. This is of course assuming they even played that way in the first place, which you don't know. You know what they say about assuming, except you're the only one here being an ass.

[Colonelkillabee]

*** * **** Colonel. LOL

Lol don't know what that says but it made me lol.

 

You did say I was the most stubborn person alive I hold to that honorable title.

[Sergwynn]

It isn't a great design if the passives all allow one ability to solo enemies by yourself. Like champion, KEs can solo even the strongest of dragons on the greatest difficulty.

 

I'm not saying they should nerf it, but the game is imbalanced. Laughably so. If one specialization is so much better than the others, that's the very definition of imbalance, which means poor design.

 

Poor design for a videogame's balance, mind you, not poor design for efficiency.

 

I hate to be that guy, but people complaining about class balance in a single player game just makes me shake my head.  The classes are all good, but none are equal. This isn't an MMO with PvP brackets and rated arenas.  Every class has a build that can solo things with.

DA:O had Arcane Warrior

DA2 had evasion tank rogues and Blood/Force Mages

DA:I has Champions, S&S Reavers and KEs (i've no idea what the rogue build is)

ME3 had Sentinels and pure biotics

(I was going to mention some KotoR builds, but it's been so long ive forgotten which ones were the builds to use for each class)

 

Every game has a class that's got great synergy with skills and passives.

 

I still laugh when I see people complain about the Arcane Warrior from DAO.  "I decided to max out my armor and then realized I couldn't be hurt."   It's like you stop eating then realized you got hungry. What did you expect was going to happen?

[Colonelkillabee]

snip

Actually, I'm more or less in agreement with you there, when it comes to most games. Balance isn't as important in a single player game, this is true.

 

But, balance of some kind is still needed. Min maxers indeed should be aware of the fact that min maxing's whole point is to make the game easy as hell.

 

Problem is, you don't have to try very hard at all to make the game a walk in the park. Stats are out of your control, and the only thing you have to do is click a square to unlock really sweet abilities that practically play the game for you.

 

Skyrim is another game that comes to mind that I love... but has terrible terrible balance and needs improvement. But even Skyrim isn't as easy to make the game grossly simple to play through. You can do it here on accident, and very early in the game too.