234 réponses à ce sujet

[Ashagar]

They did say back in origins that the dragon age was when the magic comes back and mages weren't rare in origins just separated from the rest of the population and there was both a store in the capital run by tranquil mages and the mage collective running around as well. It was also was clear in the lore that there were circles across thadas and even outright mage prisons.

 

As for the Demons in Inquisition I found the new demons more interesting and dangerous than most of the demons in origins other then the forbidden one you kill and the sloth demon.

[Nightdragon8]

Song of Fire and Ice? Seriously I heard of people claiming origins of being being a lord of rings knock off not never Song of fire and ice. Its a dark fantasy series not a low fantasy last I checked.

thats not what was said, geez way to twist it....

 

BW, said they took insperations from Song of Fire and Ice... not being accused of copying them.

 

To be honest, you can also compare this to Warhammer as well and it would fit. Just no orcs. And not all elves are magical

[Wompoo]

The little bit influence The previous games had from a Song of Ice and Fire is definitly completely gone. Dragon Age is 99% High Fantasy now. And I think that defnitly fits better with Bioware's social agenda. Making this game like Game of Thrones just wouldn't work for todays Bioware.

Today's BioWare is a product of company trying to expand its market at the expense of existing and past fans. It fails, all they do is lose X and gain X, DA:O out sold DA2 and looks like DA:i will only marginally beat it. I can't even get my console playing nephews to play  DA:I for a little bit of multi (on the console), because they actually prefer DA:O game play and world (not the shuffling, gods that was all they needed to fix and up the grunt in the graphical engine). Action games are not bad, its just the market is so over saturated with them that they are becoming so mundane. Guild Wars 2 for example is a failure, overly simplified action game meets MMO... it will not get any where near the sales Guild Wars 1 and lost so many fans. BW is repeating the same process of ArenaNet. I just leave the game now for the rest of the family to play (I just come back here now in a vain hope of seeing a glimpse of the old BW I started following 15 years ago)... and the amusing thing is most start a character and play for 3 to 6 levels, and then delete and start again. They're looking for that magical hook to get them interested (the combat is failing them and so is the story, they do love the game world, but that is not enough).

[Gonzo]

OH MY GOD YOU PEOPLE!
First of all,y ou know who likes their "mature" entertainment gritty, with someone being raped at every corner and ****** and blood as far as the eye can see? If you answered kids you just won the million dollar prize.
Second, if you're asking for more game of thrones in this game you clearly dont get it. You see ASOIAF is almost an historical novel(does that term exist in english?) and they add some fantastic elements in there to add flavor. Dragon Age on the other hand, is exactly the opposite. It is your basic D&D cape & sword universe but with some realistic undertones wich make it unique.
ASOIAF is a great series and i love it, you dont have to be dark and "realistic" and have a lot of beardy smelly guys to be good.
Last but not least, drop the whole Social Justice Agenda accusation... It just make you sound silly and juvenile at best, or a complete jerk at worse. Like, what a beautiful world to live in where people think of social justice as a bad thing right?

[Maverick827]

First of all,y ou know who likes their "mature" entertainment gritty, with someone being raped at every corner and ****** and blood as far as the eye can see? If you answered kids you just won the million dollar prize.

 

OH MY GOD YOU PEOPLE!

[Vilegrim]

so instead of the dark atmosphere of game thrones you want mustache twirling pscho sadism?

I want To play Tywin Lannister, I want to employ Ramsay Snow, and Gregor Clegane, I want to be feared not loved, I want to destroy my enemies utterly, their families dead so no descendants can plot revenge, This is the Inquisition, torture and genocide in the name of our own power is the only reason we exist (they used the name, so, like calling our organisation the khmer rouge, it has a legacy, live up to it). And then give me the goody two shoes we have now for contrast on a second playtru.

[KaiserShep]

Heh, they're never gonna give us companions nearly as insidious as Gregor Clegane or Ramsay Snow. Of course, only reason I'd care to have characters like that in a game is so I can give them the grisly deaths they deserve. All in good fun of course.

[Vilegrim]

Heh, they're never gonna give us companions nearly as insidious as Gregor Clegane or Ramsay Snow. Of course, only reason I'd care to have characters like that in a game is so I can give them the grisly deaths they deserve. All in good fun of course.

Fair enough, you should be able to.

[TheChris92]

A Song of Ice & Fire isn't dark fantasy and neither is Dragon Age, really, it does carry certain elements of it but it's always felt, played like your standard Tolkien-esque fantasy. The Grey Wardens are still in the game, so no.. the influence isn't gone. There's plenty of allusions to literary culture or similarities to other fantasy workings.

Noticed that they did reference Monty Python, possibly Fight Club (one specific line Cole utters seems like a summary of the book's big reveal), Citizen Kane & Lord of the Rings etc.

[Vilegrim]

A Song of Ice & Fire isn't dark fantasy and neither is Dragon Age, really, it does carry certain elements of it but it's always felt, played like your standard Tolkien-esque fantasy. The Grey Wardens are still in the game, so no.. the influence isn't gone. There's plenty of allusions to literary culture or similarities to other fantasy workings.
Noticed that they did reference Monty Python, possibly Fight Club (one specific line Cole utters seems like a summary of the book's big reveal), Citizen Kane & Lord of the Rings etc.

How is asoiaf not dark?

[KaiserShep]

A Song of Ice & Fire isn't dark fantasy and neither is Dragon Age, really, it does carry certain elements of it but it's always felt, played like your standard Tolkien-esque fantasy.

 

Dragon Age has plenty of Tolkien-esque fantasy roaming about, but ASOIAF? There, everything is pretty much terrible all the time.

[Vilegrim]

Dragon Age has plenty of Tolkien-esque fantasy roaming about, but ASOIAF? There, everything is pretty much terrible all the time.

Oh and if you enjoy asoiaf try out the Prince of Thorns trilogy.

[Corto81]

Since I first read A Game of Thrones, I got spoiled by "realistic" fantasy.

 

I think the term is much more fitting than "dark fantasy" or "gritty fantasy" or whatever.

It's basically "realisitc, ADULT fantasy".

 

Meaning political struggle, intrigue, no black and white, and most importantly, realistic consequences for your actions and circumstances surrounding you.

 

It continued with the wonderful writing of Joe Abercrombie, Scotty Lynch, Scott RR Bakker, etc.

The "realistic" writing in fantasy has really taken off and made it basically an "adult" genre.

 

...

 

Similarly, DA:O had a political story, with grey characters and the Archdemon was just a plot device to tie it all together - he never felt personal nor did I particularly care about him, nor did I need to care about him.

It felt like they came up with a deep story and convincing characters and then designed the quests around it.

 

That's why it was disappointing when DA:I went away from that, made everything black and white, brought in an uninspired story with a cartoon villain.

It felt like they made the world and the areas for you to quest in, and then later created a rather pedestrian story around it.

[mikeymoonshine]

Last but not least, drop the whole Social Justice Agenda accusation... It just make you sound silly and juvenile at best, or a complete jerk at worse. Like, what a beautiful world to live in where people think of social justice as a bad thing right?

 

While I think the "social justice agenda" accusations are over the top and that they are generally inaccurate I don't think you really understand what it is these people have a problem with. Social justice does not simply mean social justice, it refers to a number of political beliefs and ideologies and when you have those you are always going to have people who disagree. That doesn't say anything about what kind of world we live in other than it's a world where people disagree on stuff. 

[AWTEW]

I think they are probably playing it very careful. With Game of Thrones being such a cash cow, HBO lawyers will be on them like flies if Bioware takes too mich insperation from them.

[Ieldra]

OP:
I think that DAI feels somewhat tame in comparison with DAO. No torture chambers, no attempted rape scenarios, and the darker stuff that's there we usually witness at second-hand or even farther removed. While there is a darker path in some decisions, basically all of the everyday cruelty that was a part of DAO's world is gone. While its absence does not necessarily present a problem, the world feels tame as if they could not exist, and that makes it feel artificial at times. Also, I find it extremely noticeable how everything that can't be made gender-neutral has been carefully excised from the world except for the romances - and the Chantry clergy where a retcon would have been too blatant. Even the Qun has been reinterpreted. 

 

I wouldn't have a problem with that had it been like that from the start, but I think that those removed things had contributed to DA's identity as a setting. Now all the rough edges are gone, and as much as I like the game, I resent that a great deal. I also in general resent the influence of the social justice agenda (which I support in the real-world, so don't take this the wrong way) on worldbuilding (as opposed to character choices).

[Aurok]

That ASoIaF was a huge influence on Origins isn't even debatable.

A little bit of that influence remains ('Blackwall' is perhaps the most Night's Watch name you could come up with) but it's kinda funny that as Game of Thrones has become this hugely popular cultural phenomenon, Dragon Age has moved away from it towards more standard high fantasy.

[Zwingtanz]

The utility ravens and the very western middle ages-based Fereldan zones come to mind. Blackwall has a certain asoiaf vibe too.

[mikeymoonshine]

OP:
I think that DAI feels somewhat tame in comparison with DAO. No torture chambers, no attempted rape scenarios, and the darker stuff that's there we usually witness at second-hand or even farther removed. While there is a darker path in some decisions, basically all of the everyday cruelty that was a part of DAO's world is gone. While its absence does not necessarily present a problem, the world feels tame as if they could not exist, and that makes it feel artificial at times. Also, I find it extremely noticeable how everything that can't be made gender-neutral has been carefully excised from the world except for the romances - and the Chantry clergy where a retcon would have been too blatant. Even the Qun has been reinterpreted. 

 

I wouldn't have a problem with that had it been like that from the start, but I think that those removed things had contributed to DA's identity as a setting. Now all the rough edges are gone, and as much as I like the game, I resent that a great deal. I also in general resent the influence of the social justice agenda (which I support in the real-world, so don't take this the wrong way) on worldbuilding (as opposed to character choices).

 

There were torture chambers in the dark future as well as the torture scenario with Leliana, she was also infected with the blight as an experiment. I am still not convinced by this claim that the Qun has been changed (not that I want to start that debate again), go and read any of the Q&A stuff about the Qun from back when Origins came out. There is a ton of info that wasn't put in the game because the Qun is meant to be unknown and alien to Thedas. I don't see how the fact that it accepts transsexualism as a thing makes it any more or less gender neutral than it already was. 

 

This game was less dark than Origins sure but it was not completely lacking in dark influences and there is nothing stopping future games from being as dark as Origins, or possibly even darker. 

[TheChris92]

How is asoiaf not dark?

A Song of Ice and Fire is considered "epic fantasy" by Martin himself, which is more or less a different term for High Fantasy.

Sure there are 'horrorific' and grimdark elements in it by combining the cruel reality of the Dark Ages in history, like the War of the Roses with elements of fantasy.

This is something you'll find in a lot of fantasy, like Joe Ambercrombie's First Law trilogy and in even some Pat Rothfuss books. 

A Song of Ice and Fire leans toward High & Low Fantasy -- It's got the morally ambigious characters, then you have the looming threat of the 'Others'

that makes it retain the scope of High/Epic Fantasy.. it shuffles between both and it's definitely closer to either than Dark Fantasy.

 

Dark fantasy utilizes elements of horror & dread with the fantastical like Stephen King's Dark Tower or anything by Clive Barker.

 

It's not any more 'dark fantasy' than Dragon Age is.

 

EDIT: In the immortal words of Yahtzee Croshaw.

[Taura-Tierno]

Personally I always felt that DA:O felt more inspired by Wheel of Time than ASoIaF. 

[lyleoffmyspace]

Since I first read A Game of Thrones, I got spoiled by "realistic" fantasy.

 

I think the term is much more fitting than "dark fantasy" or "gritty fantasy" or whatever.

It's basically "realisitc, ADULT fantasy".

 

Meaning political struggle, intrigue, no black and white, and most importantly, realistic consequences for your actions and circumstances surrounding you.

 

It continued with the wonderful writing of Joe Abercrombie, Scotty Lynch, Scott RR Bakker, etc.

The "realistic" writing in fantasy has really taken off and made it basically an "adult" genre.

 

...

 

Similarly, DA:O had a political story, with grey characters and the Archdemon was just a plot device to tie it all together - he never felt personal nor did I particularly care about him, nor did I need to care about him.

It felt like they came up with a deep story and convincing characters and then designed the quests around it.

 

That's why it was disappointing when DA:I went away from that, made everything black and white, brought in an uninspired story with a cartoon villain.

It felt like they made the world and the areas for you to quest in, and then later created a rather pedestrian story around it.

 

At time when you play Origins it feels like several connected, by interconnected short stories, brought together into relevance by the Blight and the Archdemon. That sets off the main political conflict of the game, and gives context to why you are visiting the various areas of Ferelden.

 

I think another point to make is that our Inquisitor is squeaky clean as a whistle. There's not much of an edge to them. They're quite boring really and whilst you can make some moral choices, you can't be a bit of a bastard in the narrative like the Warden can. My Warden could be openly contemptuous and take some very "evil" actions due to his Dalish background and resentment of humans. It's a shame the Inquisitor can't do that.

[Hair Serious Business]

Does..."I'm just exploring the area for first time as lv 5,when suddenly dragon comes out of no where and kills me" count as shocking reveal?

[Aravasia]

This game definitely felt like less of a dark fantasy, even when compared to Origins, which wasn't that dark to begin with. I think it's because there is very little struggle for the protagonist throughout the game. After the attack on Haven, you are basically winning full-time. And Corypheus comes across as a comic book villain who's constantly having his evil plots spoiled by the Inquisitor, rather than actually being a genuine threat to the world. I think the game started off as grim and desperate, but got progressively less so as the game developed, kind of the opposite that you'd want to happen. 

 

I believe the plot would have been better if closing the Breach came at the end, along with being able to solve the Mage/Templar War, since that was so built up in the second game. And as the game progressed, the breach would get larger and worse, perhaps while also killing the Inquisitor as the mark spreads, adding a sense of desperation. Include with this developing Corypheus as a more grey character, with legitimate reasons to breach the black city, say like, because he thinks it will undo his darkspawn-ification, or that it may undo the blight, making his cause sympathetic. But, ultimately going into the black city would have dire consequences, so the player must still stop him. 

 

Though, I suppose it's too late for all of this, but just some of my thoughts. 

[ninnisinni97]

I think (according to the definition of "high-" and "low fantasy") that Dragon Age as a franchise never ever was low fantasy. It's always been high fantasy, even if maybe the story in the first game was more influenced by ASOIAF. So, no real change there, even though the story in Inquisition isn't just a rehash of A Game of Thrones.