1503 réponses à ce sujet

[Br3admax]

The elves definitely caused this, as I've said before. Not because they killed someone, but they killed the wrong someones. They should have just killed the traitor, and not the sovereign human village he went to live in. Learn to espionage, plebs. 

[Steelcan]

Nonsense. NO ONE had them in mind, nor ever tried to do them. 

 

 

Considering the chantry blamed Dales for every magical incident and even accused of sacrificing humans for elven gods, I doubt it (DA:O codex). The elves made the first move because the Dales army was much close to the border, or at least its on of the reason. After red crossing Orlais was one the move as well. It didn't wait helplessly for elves to march on Montsimmard. You do realize it took almost a decade.

That doesn't mean they didn't exist.  Just because the Dalish are were too pig-headed and proud to try and de-escalate does not eliminate the possibility.

 

Objection your Honor, relevance?

 

The elves stormed into Orlais and bravely attacked a nation caught by surprise, until they were falling over each other to get the hell out of a nation that fought back

[EmissaryofLies]

Hmm, I could have  sworn that 'both sides caused it' was exactly what the codex note said...

 

It's certainly implied, but it changes nothing; people need to bat for their teams. We might as well be talking Spurs and Bulls.

[LobselVith8]

The elves definitely caused this, as I've said before. Not because they killed someone, but they killed the wrong someones. They should have just killed the traitor, and not the sovereign human village he went to live in. Learn to espionage, plebs. 

 

Not even the Chantry claims the elves slaughtered the entire town.

[raging_monkey]

It's certainly implied, but it changes nothing; people need to bat for their teams. We might as well be talking Spurs and Bulls.

pretty much. People like to rage

[Br3admax]

Not even the Chantry claims the elves slaughtered the entire town.

You're definitely responding to the point I tried to make. But I'm sure if every single person came out, the Emerald Knights wouldn't hesitate to kill them. 

[Lulupab]

I'll repeat.

It doesn't need to.

 

Yeah, imprisoning people in a place full of diseases doesn't need justification.

Killing elves for target practice doesn't need justification.

Tolerated only a little better than vermin doesn't need justification.

I can go on.

 

I'll repeat, your Petrice side is showing.

[Steelcan]

Hmm, I could have  sworn that 'both sides caused it' was exactly what the codex note said...

 

Personally, I think you're all (and I use that in a general way having not read the entire thread, but seeing a thread repeat of red crossing) entrenched in indefensible positions and a littlle cray-cray, lol.

its no more both sides fault than the Norman invasion of England was both sides fault.  That the elves continued past their heroic slaughter of civilians to attack a nation by surprise speaks to their cowardice.

 

The played with fire got burned, and went around telling everyone it was the flame's fault

[raging_monkey]

Yeah, imprisoning people in a place full of diseases doesn't need justification.
Killing elves for target practice doesn't need justification.
Tolerated only a little better than vermin doesn't need justification.
I can go on.
 
I'll repeat, your Petrice side is showing.

then stop arguing lol its what is ....

[Steelcan]

Not even the Chantry claims the elves slaughtered the entire town.

right I'm sure they handed out cookies and blankets on their way to burn more human cities

[Steelcan]

And in how many it happened, only a few. Barbarian nations were soothed to become client states of Rome.t.

And the barbarian nations that willingly joined Rome?

[Lulupab]

It's certainly implied, but it changes nothing; people need to bat for their teams. We might as well be talking Spurs and Bulls.

 

And we see and recognize that implication. Of course zealots with spawn their own opinions without hesitation.

 

That doesn't mean they didn't exist.  Just because the Dalish are were too pig-headed and proud to try and de-escalate does not eliminate the possibility.

 

Objection your Honor, relevance?

 

The elves stormed into Orlais and bravely attacked a nation caught by surprise, until they were falling over each other to get the hell out of a nation that fought back

 

Humans didn't do anything for the so called de-escalation either so this isn't even a debate. There was no de-escalation in this matter, not ever. The relevance is obvious, Elves were more prepared and closer to the border so they made the first move.

[PorcelynDoll]

The Dalish come off as huge turds. Makes me want to go back and choose the werewolves every time.

[Lulupab]

And the barbarian nations that willingly joined Rome?

 

Certainly, and they were treated quite well. They almost had all rights of a roman citizen including joining the army. City elves are galaxies away from this comparison.

[errantknight]

Heh, I'm going to just continue to identify with Fereldans and leave it to you guys to emulate the Orlesian and elven points of view.

[Steelcan]

 

Humans didn't do anything for the so called de-escalation either so this isn't even a debate. There was no de-escalation in this matter, not ever. The relevance is obvious, Elves were more prepared and closer to the border so they made the first move.

Why should the humans de-escalate when they did not start it?

 

They did not invade, they did not start the war.  if youa re going to argue that the elves were justified in their attack because they could attack, well that's not really a defense

[LobselVith8]

You're definitely responding to the point I tried to make. But I'm sure if every single person came out, the Emerald Knights wouldn't hesitate to kill them. 

 

The scroll doesn't read that every single human came out, either. It reads that a group of humans killed an elf (who was romantically involved with the human who was killed by the Emerald Knight), and then the group of humans attacked the Emerald Knights. It's hardly as black and white as some people are making it out to be.

 

Frankly, since the Dalish admit they were wrong because the scroll reads that humans and elves were both the catalyst to the war, it doesn't seem like the developers were intending for the elves to be the only ones who were responsible for the genesis of the war between humans and elves. The scroll would have told a very different story if that had been the case.

[Colonelkillabee]

 

Personally, I think you're all (and I use that in a general way having not read the entire thread, but seeing a thread repeat of red crossing) entrenched in indefensible positions and a littlle cray-cray, lol.

Maybe. Though if you ask me, saying "Ah **** it, war was gonna happen anyway!" To try and excuse the murder of an entire town and a war is the very definition of someone with loose screws. Or, George Bush.
 

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Yeah, imprisoning people in a place full of diseases doesn't need justification.
Killing elves for target practice doesn't need justification.
Tolerated only a little better than vermin doesn't need justification.
I can go on.
 
I'll repeat, your Petrice side is showing.

Maybe if the elves hadn't been so stupid they wouldn't have put themselves in that position, the Dales were the perfect chance for human-elf friendship, instead they closed the borders & treated all outsiders as enemies which eventually led to their destruction

[Lulupab]

Why should the humans de-escalate when they did not start it?

 

They did not invade, they did not start the war.  if youa re going to argue that the elves were justified in their attack because they could attack, well that's not really a defense

 

Start what? the war? Not the topic here. Humans added loads of tension, just like the elves. Humans played just as much as role (if not more) in creatinf tensionss that led to war. And they did nothing to de-escalate the tensions.

[Steelcan]

The scroll doesn't read that every single human came out, either. It reads that a group of humans killed an elf (who was romantically involved with the human who was killed by the Emerald Knight), and then the group of humans attacked the Emerald Knights. It's hardly as black and white as some people are making it out to be.

Civilians attacked armed knights, such a fair fight

[errantknight]

Maybe. Though if you ask me, saying "Ah **** it, war was gonna happen anyway!" To try and excuse the murder of an entire town and a war is the very definition of someone with loose screws. Or, George Bush.
 

Lol! Valid.

 

Although this thread is an illustration of how wars start, lol. Any minute now, someone is going to accuse someone else of having WMD in their pockets.

[Steelcan]

Start what? the war? Not the topic here. Humans added loads of tension, just like the elves. Humans played just as much as role (if not more) in creatinf tensionss that led to war. And they did nothing to de-escalate the tensions.

Yes, but the elves went from that tension to right out war

[Br3admax]

The scroll doesn't read that every single human came out, either.

Pro-tip: If you aren't going respond to my actual points, don't quote me. 

[LobselVith8]

Maybe if the elves hadn't been so stupid they wouldn't have put themselves in that position, the Dales were the perfect chance for human-elf friendship, instead they closed the borders & treated all outsiders as enemies which eventually led to their destruction

 

You seem to be forgetting that Orlais was created through the conquest of Drakon's neighbors, and that he imposed his particular Cult of the Maker on his new subjects. That's hardly conducive for good relations with a kingdom where the elves were following their own religion, and wanted to govern themselves.