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Reasons the Dalish have it so wrong


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#826
Br3admax

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Spoiler

 

 

I don't understand all these big words you're using, like "vegemite" and such n' such, but I'm 99 percent sure it's unamerican, and that makes me mad.

 

You just keep walkin wit all that communist mumbo jumbo, friend.

 

lol

 

You know the waste products left behind from brewing beer? These weirdos eat that. Kids love it, apparently. 


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#827
Colonelkillabee

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You know the waste products left behind from brewing beer? These weirdos eat that. Kids love it, apparently.

Sounds like New Jersey, except with paint chips.

#828
Augustei

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You know the waste products left behind from brewing beer? These weirdos eat that. Kids love it, apparently. 

 

Indeed, just finished my sandwiches. Was delicious. Decided to make a peanut butter one as well though, what a waste that was. Peanut butter sucks unless on toast and as long as you get the crunchy kind



#829
Colonelkillabee

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Alright, well, I think I'm disgusted enough to get back to pointless dick measuring contests between the human and dalish supporters in the war.



#830
Augustei

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Sounds like New Jersey, except with paint chips.

......Did you just compare Australia to New Jersey?!.......To far
 

 

Gross! This is way better:

 

Spoiler

 

;)

Such Blasphemy, just wow..


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#831
Colonelkillabee

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......Did you just compare Australia to New Jersey?!.......To far

Alright alright, I'll give you that. That comparison's reserved for Russia.


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#832
Steelcan

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y'all need Cajun food


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#833
Colonelkillabee

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y'all need Cajun food

Mufalettas, ******. Delish.



#834
Boomshakalakalakaboom

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Such Blasphemy, just wow..

 

**** your Vegemite........  :lol:  :P


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#835
Master Warder Z_

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......Did you just compare Australia to New Jersey?!.......To far


It's accurate and funny!

#836
Carmen_Willow

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No if anything it was mages. Orlais either had scrub mages before the circle joining them or had none. If Emerald knights beat Chevaliers, Templars are a walk on the park. Templar abilities are as useless as breasts on men on none-mages.

But Cullen informs us that, magical abilities aside, Templars are among the finest soldiers anywhere, and even Bull comments on how well the Templar training is helping move along the Inquisition Army.  Cullen may be a little biased, I'll admit, but usually he bends over backward to be honest. I'm thinking that Templars--real Templars--not drugged red popcorn Templars, probably give any fighting force a run for its money--unless I am commanding the opposing force because I am a video game god, at least when I am the Inquisitor! Bwa-ha-ha! <exit tongue-in-cheek mode>



#837
Colonelkillabee

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It seems to me like templars would be the perfect answer to emerald knights. The tevinter got surprised themselves by the templar's anti magic abilities, so the idea that mages can do anything templars can is obviously false lorewise. This was a wartable mission.

 

It took me a minute to get on board this idea due to the conversation about wardens vs templars at adamant, but it's obvious the templars are very skilled.



#838
Colonelkillabee

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And if templars really were making little incursions into elven territory and killing them, well that says a lot too, don't you think?



#839
Carmen_Willow

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The Templars' skill as soldiers, particularly against magic always made me wonder why the mages didn't secretly learn some martial arts. Magic can only do so much particularly when you are out of mana, knowing how to wield a sword, or use your staff (as Dorian was in the Chantry), or even your feet would give you an edge. Obviously, the Templars would never allow it openly; they want the advantage. But if I were a mage in Thedas, I'd be practicing with a pair of daggers in addition to my staff and spells on the sly. (And aside from being invulnerable, that's why I love KE as a specialization).



#840
Colonelkillabee

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Can't say for the circle mages but I'm sure Tevinter and the like would consider such a thing beneath them.



#841
Steelcan

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They probably aren't allowed martial training



#842
Colonelkillabee

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If the end of DA 2 is any indicator. Holy ****.



#843
dragonflight288

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But Cullen informs us that, magical abilities aside, Templars are among the finest soldiers anywhere, and even Bull comments on how well the Templar training is helping move along the Inquisition Army.  Cullen may be a little biased, I'll admit, but usually he bends over backward to be honest. I'm thinking that Templars--real Templars--not drugged red popcorn Templars, probably give any fighting force a run for its money--unless I am commanding the opposing force because I am a video game god, at least when I am the Inquisitor! Bwa-ha-ha! <exit tongue-in-cheek mode>

 

I don't see how the templars are ineffectual to be honest. As Cullen and Alistair both point out, there's a great deal of discipline, receiving an education and combat training involved with the process of becoming one. The only real negative is how lyrium affects the mind. My dwarven Inquisitor was just told by Cullen since he chose the templar spec he's going to lose his memories slowly but surely unless he gives up lyrium, and even then he would suffer as a result, probably for the rest of his life. 

 

And besides, Meredith was able to overthrow the Viscount who was before Dumar with a garrison of templars after he tried kicking them out when the Chantry gave an order to Meredith's predecessor to get involved with Kirkwall's politics because he was making things harder for Orlais, despite the Knight-Commander refusing by saying that the templars concern was magic and not politics. 

 

And Meredith was able to hold power in Kirkwall after Dumar's death because the templars were the largest, and strongest armed force in the city. 

 

I know I wouldn't want to fight templars unless I had some highly trained soldiers backing me up, or mages who could keep their distance while I kept the templars attention. 

 

Ser Barris and Cullen both made it hit home, probably for the very first time despite me knowing about it, the kind of sacrifice templars actually make when they join (and what my dwarven Inquisitor was told by Ser when he joined.) 

 

I still think the job attracts more undesirables, especially considering the templar codex in DAO and DA2 made it clear that the religiously fervent were looked at before those with strong character as a way to keep them from questioning their orders, and that's one thing that really needs to be reformed. 



#844
dragonflight288

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They probably aren't allowed martial training

 

They aren't, depending on the Circle. In Broken Circle in DAO, we can find a list of codexes after the Fade segment. They go through mages losing the right to practice with weapons, where once an entire floor was available for mages to use for such a purpose. 

 

It doesn't really go into the reasons why the mages lost this right, however. 



#845
Augustei

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y'all need Cajun food

Damn, I could go for some Cajan Chicken right about now

 

**** your Vegemite........  :lol:  :P

Such levels of Blasphemy, Ima require an Inquisition soon. Marmite's inferiority to vegemite, words cannot even express

 

It's accurate and funny!

Pfft says the man freezing his balls off in the north jelly of my surf and warm sun. You know nothing Lord Warder.

 

But Cullen informs us that, magical abilities aside, Templars are among the finest soldiers anywhere, and even Bull comments on how well the Templar training is helping move along the Inquisition Army.  Cullen may be a little biased, I'll admit, but usually he bends over backward to be honest. I'm thinking that Templars--real Templars--not drugged red popcorn Templars, probably give any fighting force a run for its money--unless I am commanding the opposing force because I am a video game god, at least when I am the Inquisitor! Bwa-ha-ha! <exit tongue-in-cheek mode>

Well I got the impression all pale in comparison to the Chevaliers, who learn techniques from Both the Templars and Wardens. But yeah they must have a high degree of training and skill compared to most.
We know Wardens train their recruits with weighted bundles of canes and they sparr with one another with pells, and they train in unit tactics to fight darkspawn but little beyond that.
To me I always got the Impression the level of training these groups recieve it would go:

Chevaliers
Wardens
Templars
on an individual scale (small units or 1v1)

I mainly say this due to the reputation of the Wardens, excellent strategists and peerless warriors that even the Qunari in Par Vollen have heard of them to this degree. The Ferelden nobility even,  where they were exiled until farely recently have a high opinion of their martial skill. But also mainly due to the fact the Wardens are always honing their skills and putting them to practice in actual fights against the darkspawn, Templars mostly guard

The thing with Templars though is that they often dont engage in martial conflicts beyond Annulments so they dont have much of a chance to prove this reputation. We know they rely on Seekers to take on more skilled apostates, but one thing we don't know for sure and I wish we did is if they take place in the Exalted Marches.
They must for them to have such a degree of millitary tactics and stategy that they can make the transition to an Inquisition army with Cullen leading them like that.
So on the scale of armies I'd say they could easily match the Wardens, and maybe the Chevaliers since Cullen seems to think the Inquisition troops can, but his opinion may be a little bias. But we know A Knight-Captain managed to unhorse one fresh out of Chevalier school so...

But yeah The Chevaliers, Wardens and Templars are probably the 3 best trained fighting forces in thedas.


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#846
Aimi

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The thing with Templars though is that they often dont engage in martial conflicts beyond Annulments so they dont have much of a chance to prove this reputation.


In the real world, incidentally, lack of combat experience usually makes an army bad at warfare, even if its soldiers are regularly trained and drilled. There are very very very very few exceptions to this rule (and even those exceptions come with qualifications) before the early twentieth century, when Western industrial powers first started to employ systematic institutional training methods. The Great War was probably the first war that was fought well on both sides from a standing start.

So the fact that templars rarely participate in organized, large-scale combat ought to have made them a relatively negligible quantity on the battlefield. But it did not, obviously, because of the twentieth-century paradigm through which BioWare's writers appear to view warfare.

#847
Master Warder Z_

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Individually the Templars are the sum of each other.

Their veterans have years to decades of combat experience against mages, demons and more.

Their novices merely have what they were taught.

But the main point is the Templar order until the mage rebellion wasn't a standing army.

It was individual garrisons assigned to specific areas.

So those groups when they came to together formed a capable army, having the sum total experience of thirteen garrisons and it's numbers.

However this isn't evident if you approach the organization as a singular enity.

#848
Lulupab

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Out of 15 circles, all 14 successfully rebelled and left the circles. That means Templar were not as strong as you think when mages were united.



#849
Lulupab

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Also Templars needed red Lyrium to be on the same level as mage enemies. 



#850
Colonelkillabee

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Out of 15 circles, all 14 successfully rebelled and left the circles. That means Templar were not as strong as you think when mages were united.

Rebelling is one thing during a time of chaos. Winning's another. Look where the mages ended up and who was on the run, what they had to resort to, etc etc.

 

If Tevinter magisters got their asses kicked when fighting them like the wartable suggested, then that shows just how effective they can potentially be. Doesn't mean they'll always win though. I'm certainly in the camp that says they really shouldn't be that good considering they mostly fight bathrobes and the occasional odd demon once in every blue moon.