1503 réponses à ce sujet

[The Baconer]

Let me guess the corpse mages weren't arcane horrors either.

 

I can buy the mage corpse being an Arcane Horror.

 

Those were not Revenants though. Fight would have been over quickly if they were.

[raging_monkey]

So what? She still goes about her business messing with demons and the eluvian, pretty much learning absolutely nothing from the experience.
 
And to the rest, it's really not responsible to drag your friend/lover into this and ask you to kill them because you can't leave well enough alone.
 
I don't understand why it's an issue to admit she's naive and like her at the same time.

her flaws are what make her attractive imo espceially if rivalmanced

[LobselVith8]

So what? She still goes about her business messing with demons and the eluvian, pretty much learning absolutely nothing from the experience.

 

Merrill understands the dangers that spirits can pose. As Merrill says to Anders, "Anders... there's no such thing as a good spirit. There never was. All spirits are dangerous. I understood that. I'm sorry that you didn't."

 

As for the Eluvian, I see little reason why Merrill should abide by rivalry Hawke's complete ignorance of her people, culture, religion, and the technology of her ancestors when she's the one who has studied the lore and gathered additional information from the shard. It came across like some really bad trope.

 

And to the rest, it's really not responsible to drag your friend/lover into this and ask you to kill them because you can't leave well enough alone.

 

It's completely responsible to take precautions when you think an ancient and powerful spirit is no longer trapped in a totem, and you want to make sure that innocent people don't get hurt if it possesses you while you investigate. The fact that Merrill anticipated the worst case scenario already shows much more awareness than Marethari demonstrated.

 

I don't understand why it's an issue to admit she's naive and like her at the same time.

 

I'm making a point of saying I disagree, as you could probably tell by now.

[Rekkampum]

I never saw any moment in the narrative that demonstrated that Merrill couldn't handle blood magic.

Like that one where

 

Spoiler

We learn she would've been killed if she'd activated the Eluvian by the Keeper who became an abomination to protect her?

[Colonelkillabee]

Merrill understands the dangers that spirits can pose. As Merrill says to Anders, "Anders... there's no such thing as a good spirit. There never was. All spirits are dangerous. I understood that. I'm sorry that you didn't."

 

As for the Eluvian, I see little reason why Merrill should abide by rivalry Hawke's complete ignorance of her people, culture, religion, and the technology of her ancestors when she's the one who has studied the lore and gathered additional information from the shard. It came across like some really bad trope.

 

 

It's completely responsible to take precautions when you think an ancient and powerful spirit is no longer trapped in a totem, and you want to make sure that innocent people don't get hurt if it possesses you while you investigate. The fact that Merrill anticipated the worst case scenario already shows much more awareness than Marethari demonstrated.

 

 

I'm making a point of saying I disagree, as you could probably tell by now.

That's just like some scientist on (insert scifi movie here) saying they understand (insert alien technology here) is dangerous, but they can handle it if they're careful. Like... reaper technology for instance.

 

And is it really Hawke's ignorance if even her own people tell her not to screw with it?

 

Obviously you disagree, yes. I just think it's... how do I put it. Too defensive? I guess. Or unnecessary. Her naivety seems very obvious to me. But yes, I respect that you disagree. It's just hard for me, and others to grasp, and we're fans of her too.

[LobselVith8]

Like that one where

 

Spoiler

We learn she would've been killed if she'd activated the Eluvian by the Keeper who became an abomination to protect her?

 

You mean the same Keeper who said she was doing this to protect her, and then proceeded to try to kill her as an abomination? Followed by members of the Sabrae Clan who were confused and upset because Marethari took no precautions to have the men, women, and children of her clan leave the area while she let a dangerous spirit take control of her body.

 

The fact that Audacity is the most likely source of this information - since her reasons for opposing Merrill's actions in Acts I and II were completely different - doesn't persuade me to think Marethari was right. Much less how TME and Inquisition does nothing to change that, particularly when you consider that Audacity is trapped in a totem in the real world, since the spirit is sundered from the Beyond during the battle between Arlathan elves and Tevinter humans over a millennia ago.

[Rekkampum]

You mean the same Keeper who said she was doing this to protect her, and then proceeded to try to kill her as an abomination? Followed by members of the Sabrae Clan who were confused and upset because Marethari took no precautions to have the men, women, and children of her clan leave the area while she let a dangerous spirit take control of her body.

 

The fact that Audacity is the most likely source of this information - since her reasons for opposing Merrill's actions in Acts I and II were completely different - doesn't persuade me to think Marethari was right. Much less how TME and Inquisition does nothing to change that, particularly when you consider that Audacity is trapped in a totem in the real world, since the spirit is sundered from the Beyond.

 

It's not a matter of her being right. No quest in DA 2 is ever that simple. And yes, that same Keeper. I think it speaks volumes about how much she respected Merrill that she would've done so to prevent her from dying in ignorance. You mention the possibility of Audacity, the same daemon Merrill's been communing with, being the source of mistrust. It's an oxymoron that shows, either way, that the spirit wasn't as trustworthy as Merrill initially thought. She definitely learned from the experience, but before it one can't possibly say Merrill knew what she was getting herself into in the first place.

[LobselVith8]

That's just like some scientist on (insert scifi movie here) saying they understand (insert alien technology here) is dangerous, but they can handle it if they're careful. Like... reaper technology for instance.

 

TME gave me a distinctly different impression about Merrill's efforts with the Eluvian she was building.

 

And is it really Hawke's ignorance if even her own people tell her not to screw with it?

 

Considering Merrill studied the lore while Marethari apparently didn't, since she thinks the Eluvians should simply stay buried in the past? Yes, it really is.

 

Obviously you disagree, yes. I just think it's... how do I put it. Too defensive? I guess. Or unnecessary. Her naivety seems very obvious to me. But yes, I respect that you disagree. It's just hard for me, and others to grasp, and we're fans of her too.

 

I don't see it as unnecessary, as I simply disagree. Merrill certainly deals with culture shock about human society, but she also demonstrates her intelligence and conviction, and I see little reason to take Hawke's ignorance about the Eluvians over Merrill's informed stance on the Eluvians from her meticulous research.

[Master Warder Z_]

Merrill did research?

Oh yeah she sold her will to a demon for a party favor that ultimately blew up in her face.

[LobselVith8]

It's not a matter of her being right. No quest in DA 2 is ever that simple. And yes, that same Keeper. I think it speaks volumes about how much she respected Merrill that she would've done so to prevent her from dying in ignorance.

 

Trying to kill someone as an abomination is never the right move.

 

You mention the possibility of Audacity, the same daemon Merrill's been communing with, being the source of mistrust.

 

Actually, Merrill was building the Eluvian from the lore she gathered and the information she extrapolated from the shard; she sought Audacity out to learn blood magic because she lacked the sufficient amount of lyrium necessary to cleanse the shard with ordinary magic.

 

It's an oxymoron that shows, either way, that the spirit wasn't as trustworthy as Merrill initially thought. She definitely learned from the experience, but before it one can't possibly say Merrill knew what she was getting herself into in the first place.

 

You do realize that Merrill didn't trust Audacity, right? She explicitly says as much. She knows Audacity is dangerous, but she only seeks the spirit out in Act III because she's exhausted her other options, and figures it's worth a try; you also need to consider that when she learned blood magic, Audacity is trapped in a totem and incapable of physically harming anyone. She also expresses concern that the spirit may no longer be trapped (in Act III, years after she initially learned blood magic), and it's why she asks the Champion to accompany her; she would have no reason to do so if she trusted Audacity.

[Master Warder Z_]

She. Made. A. Deal. With. A. Demon.

It had a doorway into her will.

[Colonelkillabee]

I don't see it as unnecessary, as I simply disagree.

We'll have to agree to disagree then. You'll have your hands full with everyone else chiming in anyway.

[Rekkampum]

Trying to kill someone as an abomination is never the right move.

 

 

Actually, Merrill was building the Eluvian from the lore she gathered and the information she extrapolated from the shard; she sought Audacity out to learn blood magic because she lacked the sufficient amount of lyrium necessary to cleanse the shard with ordinary magic.

 

 

You do realize that Merrill didn't trust Audacity, right? She explicitly says as much. She knows Audacity is dangerous, but she only seeks the spirit out in Act III because she's exhausted her other options, and figures it's worth a try; you also need to consider that when she learned blood magic, Audacity is trapped in a totem and incapable of physically harming anyone. She also expresses concern that the spirit may no longer be trapped, and it's why she asks the Champion to accompany her; she would have no reason to do so if she trusted Audacity.

 

Knowing how to build and/or use something doesn't make a person experienced in it. I can read the recipes posted in the other thread and do what the instructions say. I still won't have any experience baking those things until I've actually done so for a while, and successfully.

[LobselVith8]

Knowing how to build and/or use something doesn't make a person experienced in it. I can read the recipes posted in the other thread and do what the instructions say. I still won't have any experience baking those things until I've actually done so for a while, and successfully.

 

Merrill's research puts her in a position of being informed about this technology, while rivalry Hawke opposes her based on mere hearsay. Merrill was skilled enough at building an Eluvian that it's counterpart comes into existence in the Crossroads, and she explains to the Champion that she believes the Eluvians can be beneficial to the People (which is a point that's proven correct in TME and Inquisition).

[sandalisthemaker]

Based on everything that has happened since DA2, I no longer believe that the Eluvian that Merrill built was a gateway for Audacity to enter through. It would have led her to the Crossroads, meanwhile the demon was bound to that statue.  

[Colonelkillabee]

Audacity

Lol I always thought that sounded like a stripper name.

[Rekkampum]

Merrill's research puts her in a position of being informed about this technology, while rivalry Hawke opposes her based on mere hearsay. Merrill was skilled enough at building an Eluvian that it's counterpart comes into existence in the Crossroads, and she explains to the Champion that she believes the Eluvians can be beneficial to the People (which is a point that's proven correct in TME and Inquisition).

 

Being informed about something, and having experience using it are entirely different things. And she was so skilled she sought out the help of a daemon she didn't completely trust. Had she not done so and found an alternate means, none of what happened would have.

[LobselVith8]

Being informed about something, and having experience using it are entirely different things. And she was so skilled she sought out the help of a daemon she didn't completely trust. Had she not done so and found an alternate means, none of what happened would have.

 

I'm not going to blame Merrill for the actions of other people. Marethari is responsible for setting Audacity loose and becoming an abomination, and grown men and women from Clan Sabrae are responsible for the attempted murder of Merrill and the Champion if he doesn't coddle them about what happened to Marethari.

[raging_monkey]

Lol I always thought that sounded like a stripper name.

50silvers for a standard wh*re at the blooming rose

[Rekkampum]

I'm not going to blame Merrill for the actions of other people. Marethari is responsible for setting Audacity loose and becoming an abomination, and grown men and women from Clan Sabrae are responsible for the attempted murder of Merrill and the Champion if he doesn't coddle them about what happened to Marethari.

Merrill''s actions precipitated what Marethari did. There's no escaping that.

[LobselVith8]

Merrill''s actions precipitated what Marethari did. There's no escaping that.

 

I'm perfectly fine not blaming Merrill for the actions of other grown men and women. If Marethari fell prey to Audacity's machinations, then I'm going to blame Marethari for ultimately setting Audacity loose in the most asinine manner imaginable. Marethari is responsible for her own actions.

[Colonelkillabee]

50silvers for a standard wh*re at the blooming rose

No, Isabella, you still owe me 50 from the last time.

 

LOL

[raging_monkey]

No, Isabella, you still owe me 50 from the last time.
 
LOL

i like big boats i can not lie lol

(Cheesiest line ever.. and i like cheese XD)

[Master Warder Z_]

Based on everything that has happened since DA2, I no longer believe that the Eluvian that Merrill built was a gateway for Audacity to enter through. It would have led her to the Crossroads, meanwhile the demon was bound to that statue.

Assuming the gate world it led to wasn't in the ****ing totem.

It's still very plausible.

[Colonelkillabee]

Cheesiest line ever

DA 2 in three words.