109 réponses à ce sujet

[rda]

Since when feelings, especially love, are logical?But if you want logic, here's simple one -- what if Bianca loves not only Varric but also her parents and so doesn't want to disobey them, even if it comes at personal cost? Or, ancestors forbid, actually developed some feelings for her husband, too?People act as if troo wuv only ever happens in vacuum and if it doesn't then well you better move on because you're clearly not getting the best possible deal. And if it's not the best possible deal then it's totally not worth it at all, amirite? But life is often much more complicate than that, especially when you are not the wide eyed, self-centered eighteen year old anymore, but have lived and known a number of people for a while.If I'm not mistaken Varric has met Bianca when he already had some life experience under his belt, perhaps he actually knows what he's choosing and doing, and why.

She may love all those people. That's not what I'm arguing at all. But, the response normal people make to that is to choose. Sometimes, life sucks, and you can't have everything you want.

Except Bianca doesn't do that. No, why do that when she can have all that AND Varric on the side at her beck and call?

If she really loved Varric, she'd tell him she's made her choice and he needs to move on. The fact she doesn't and still runs to him speaks volumes about her character, and it isn't flattering.

[tmp7704]

She may love all those people. That's not what I'm arguing at all. But, the response normal people make to that is to choose. Sometimes, life sucks, and you can't have everything you want.

You know that scene in Dead Poets' Society, when one of the students goes, "I'm exercising the right not to walk"?

Choosing not to choose is a choice, too. Sometimes life sucks because you can't make such simple choice, and you can't tell one party "well eff you, I want mine". Maybe because you believe that hurts everyone involved less than the alternative. That may be something you just want to believe, or it may even be right. But that option is just as normal as the alternative.

I think attributing nothing but selfishness to Bianca and presuming that's just a way for her to "have it all" when we don't actually know anything about her personal situation beyond what Varric tells us speaks more volumes about ourselves and our own biases, than her.

[rda]

You know that scene in Dead Poets' Society, when one of the students goes, "I'm exercising the right not to walk"?Choosing not to choose is a choice, too. Sometimes life sucks because you can't make such simple choice, and you can't tell one party "well eff you, I want mine". Maybe because you believe that hurts everyone involved less than the alternative. That may be something you just want to believe, or it may even be right. But that option is just as normal as the alternative.I think attributing nothing but selfishness to Bianca and presuming that's just a way for her to "have it all" when we don't actually know anything about her personal situation beyond what Varric tells us speaks more volumes about ourselves and our own biases, than her.

Sure, we don't know about Bianca's personal situation. I've already posted that if she has kids, that would complicate things to the point where I could possibly see where she's coming from.

But beyond that, life is full of choices. Choosing "not to choose" is still, itself, a choice. And refusing to choose in such a way that you can still have your husband, social status, and comfortable life while STILL having your devoted lover on the side at your beck and call is selfish.

If you think that's A-OK, we probably don't have anything more to say to each other.

[Ryzaki]

Yeah Varric just has me smh. And the whole talking to Bianca thing is now very very sad.

 

And Bianca herself *sigh* I'm not even pro a varric romance but him dumping her would be lovely.

[tmp7704]

But beyond that, life is full of choices. Choosing "not to choose" is still, itself, a choice. And refusing to choose in such a way that you can still have your husband, social status, and comfortable life while STILL having your devoted lover on the side at your beck and call is selfish.

If you think that's A-OK, we probably don't have anything more to say to each other.

No, i think it's premature to presume having the husband (that you didn't get to choose) social status and 'devoted lover on the side' makes one's life A-OK and thus nothing but 'having it all'. But as long as you aren't willing to consider less black and white picture where the combination of these factors may come with any number of heavy emotional toll(s) there's indeed nothing more that can be added.

[Twilight_Princess]

 Yeah, I wondered that too O.P. It seemed a little odd, that it was sort of let hanging.

 

As for who  Varric should move on with asinglehawkelikehecouldhaveinDA2ifit wasnotcut maybe Dagna, or Cassandra..

 

 I'd be so down for pushing a single Hawke and him together in DAI XD Especially after all this.

[AWTEW]

I'd be so down for pushing a single Hawke and him together in DAI XD Especially after all this.

It would be

[TheodoricFriede]

Bianca's sole purpose in this game seemed to be the writers saying "Ha ha, you cant have him!" when ultimately I dont care about their reason.

 

She is one of the major contributors of red lyrium expansion, her and Varric are almost constantly separated, and she is literally cheating on her husband. Im sorry, Varric deserves better than that. Otherwise he comes of as kind of pathetic.

 

Besides, its not as though its unprecedented for Bioware romancable characters to have diverging paths for whom they fall in love with. Garrus/Tali, Isabella/Fenris, Dorian/Iron Bull, and so forth.

 I'd be so down for pushing a single Hawke and him together in DAI XD Especially after all this.

I could get behind that. I feel as though a "One last Hurrah" with Hawke dlc is coming anyway. Varrics banter with Cassandra about "We're all going to Weishaupt!" seemed to point towards it, and the text in the fade merely says that Hakwe will Likely die.

[Twilight_Princess]

I actually left Hawke in the fade the first time I played.  Hearing the pain and sadness in Varric's voice when he asks where she is and then when he talks about her after...just . I was shocked I was even able to hug him, I started getting Hawke/Varric feels all over again when I saw that. A best friend who he trusts and loves and has known for over a decade? If Varric WERE to be with someone else, I couldn't imagine a better person to make him happy.

[qc_]

Perhaps I'm hallucinating this, but I'm pretty sure there was an dialogue option "(ad lib: shut up and) get a room you two". I was really bored with their talking and seeing Varric reduced to her little puppy...everything was so nauseating. I wasn't liking Bianca at all and then she threats me? I was like "Wtf?! I didn't even recruit Varric in the first place. I can't even send him home wherever it is. And he just said your family always send assassins to kill him..." 

Btw, worse than her threat is going to Winter Palace as a Qunari: "Oh, that's the Inquisitor!" "Don't be foolish! It's just somebody's pet."

Anyways...I wish I could judge and force her to become an agent, like it or not. Or at least some war room quest related to her family so I could have them in my hands(manipulate them somehow), force them to divorce her and get married to Varric, so he could stop sighing all the time.    If she has kids bring them with her, whatever. Problem solved.

It sucks that it seems that she likes to keep Varric only because of the thrill of going against her family, as if being rebellious would make her feel young, reliving days of the past.

Bioware better add more Bianca storyline in a dlc, not exactly one about her, but having her as sub plot.

You guys say he's not friends with the Inquisitor, agreed, not yet, but he's trying, it's just that he feels the Inquisitor is kinda unreachable.

I don't care about making Varric available to romance, but I hope they sort things out eventually. Either getting him finally with Bianca or saying enough's enough. Shipping him w/Cassandra would be funny though.

[Korva]

Bianca's sole purpose in this game seemed to be the writers saying "Ha ha, you cant have him!"

 

Seriously? I severely doubt the writers -- unlike some of the more myopically obsessive players -- see their characters only in terms of who gets to f*ck whom.

[TheodoricFriede]

Seriously? I severely doubt the writers -- unlike some of the more myopically obsessive players -- see their characters only in terms of who gets to f*ck whom.

I see you decided to intentionally misunderstand me. Bravo.

[Kuvira]

I dunno, Varric seems to kind of enjoy the long-distance, forbidden love, thing. It's much more fun to name your crossbow after your lover than to admit you couldn't sustain a 'normal' relationship because you don't want to be tied down. He's too introspective to not know exactly what he's doing, so I'd just let him be. 

[Korva]

I see you decided to intentionally misunderstand me. Bravo.

 

Then what do you mean? That obsession with who is a "love interest" or "deserves" to be a "love interest" (and "deserves" to have more and more exclusive dating sim content as a "love interest") at the exclusion of everything else about the character is a pretty real thing with some people. You accuse the writers of writing Bianca specifically to show the middle finger to people who want to f*ck Varric -- why? What would the point be in them being so spiteful and immature?

 

Mind, I don't think the Bioware writers are perfect, far from it.

[TheodoricFriede]

Then what do you mean? That obsession with who is a "love interest" or "deserves" to be a "love interest" (and "deserves" to have more and more exclusive dating sim content as a "love interest") at the exclusion of everything else about the character is a pretty real thing with some people. You accuse the writers of writing Bianca specifically to show the middle finger to people who want to f*ck Varric -- why? What would the point be in them being so spiteful and immature?

 

Mind, I don't think the Bioware writers are perfect, far from it.

Because it is obvious that people wanted him as a love interest in two, count 'em, two games now. And previously it wasn't even apparent if Bianca was alive. You never even get the chance to flirt with Varric and have him say "Sorry, im involved.", and Bianca's role in the story is little more than "Meet Varric's girlfriend. Here's why you cant have him. This lady."

 

She is completely irrelevant to the story. You cant even recruit or judge her for her actions. Literally the only reason she is in the game is to make it apparent that Varric will never be available to you.

[Wolfen09]

i would have at least had her brought in for questioning by leliana... maybe make use of that qunari alliance to... idk bring in some of those re-educators to fix her personality.... and possibly make things better for varric...  and really, why the hell couldnt we tell the merchants guild to back off?  My guess is, varric doesnt want to cause unnecessary trouble and would rather deal with all the crap then change the way things are now... sad...

[wright1978]

I didn't feel offended by Bianca's threat. I felt a little bit touched by the depth of feeling that she still has for Varric. Also somewhat amused, because all the female dwarves in this game look like they're 14 years old.

 

Yeah i was touched by her depth of feeling for Varric. Took me a while to cotton on to what people were referring to when they were talking about the threat.

[Avejajed]

Yeah i was touched by her depth of feeling for Varric. Took me a while to cotton on to what people were referring to when they were talking about the threat.

 

I took it as she didn't want me ****** up her cushy situation.

[Shark17676]

Bianca's crimes were relevant to the Inquisition's immediate interests and we should have been able to arrest and judge her.

[CredulousAlloy]

I have to say, I preferred Bianca when she was just a crossbow. My first Inquisitor was friendly and sympathetic towards her, despite her huge f*ckup, but then she made that "I'll feed you your own eyeballs" threat out of nowhere and I immediately reloaded and picked all the pissy/aggressive dialogue options. Petty? Yes, but since my quizzy didn't even get the option to call Bianca out on her little threat or slap her silly, at least it made me feel a little better.

As for her and Varric? I do feel for him, but ultimately they're both adults and if he's content to play "the other man" for more than a decade, that's his business.

[tmp7704]

I agree with you 100%, OP, because honestly, there's no reason for Varric to be in this game if he doesn't change in some way.  In DA2, he felt like a cool anchor to me.  He was a character that you appreciated for his no baggage steadiness, and it was great to have that as Hawke's best friend.  In DAI, he just felt cheap like: "He's so great, isn't he?  Here he is!  More screen time!  Only we can't give him a character arc because *gasp* that would change him, and he also can't be your best friend because he's still Hawke's best friend!  But why should that matter?  Just sit and look at him!  He's great!"  This left me wondering, why is he even here?  To deliver snappy one-liners?  To give us chest hair to salivate over?  Is that really all this character was ever designed to do?

It's funny how the outlook can change on something that remains the same.

The character was, like you originally noticed, designed to provide a degree of steadiness. That didn't change, and I suspect i's in part because of hostile reaction quite a few people had to Oghren 'changing' between DAO and the Awakening appearance. (and similarly, Anders between the Awakening and DA2) Varric was always there to deliver snappy one-liners and flash you his chest hair, and if it was fine in DA2 then why not anymore?

Every character in the game only being there to "change in some way" is a bit too much like a self-help booklet, to borrow a page from certain RPG villain.

[Mims]

I'm not sure what to think about Bianca. On one hand, I think Varric does love the drama. He's a narrative sort of guy, forbidden love seems like it would be right up his alley. It isn't a healthy relationship, but in life, not everyone chooses healthy relationships. Even the player character. 

 

That said, after playing DA:I I couldn't help but think Varric and Cassandra could have made a cute couple if you didn't romance her. Maybe that's just me. The heart wants what it wants. 

[Korva]

Because it is obvious that people wanted him as a love interest in two, count 'em, two games now.

 

So? That was never part of the character. Bianca always was. Why should either of that change? If she exits his life -- and as I said, I don't like the way she's written so I'm not exactly clamoring for them to stay together -- then it should not be just so players can have him after complaining long and hard enough. Though asking him if he's seeing someone could have been a reasonable option even if he just gets totally evasive about it.

 

Most NPCs aren't really relevant to the story, so she's not exactly unique in that regard. Kind of unfortunate how the companion missions in particular take place in a vaccum, more or less. Varric is one of the weakest in my book, and I do wish they'd have given him something better, with or without Bianca making an appearance. It feels like a show-don't-tell attempt that fell totally flat because the mission tries to paint her as special and smart but only makes her look like a self-absorbed arse who fucked up big time and thinks she can fix it by slamming a door shut.