447 réponses à ce sujet

[Superluccix]

I brought up in another thread about Origins the quest with Conner. Let's say that I use Blood Magic to sacrifice Isolde before making a deal with the Desire Demon.

 

What consequences do I face for doing that? Alistair disapproves -10?

 

Due to you even having a choice to use Blood Magic or do a variety of other things proves my point. It still was a better quest 99% of Inquisition side quests.

 

Also, I never made the claim that every single side quest has an *immediate* consequence. I would imagine some do, but even if they didnt, it still wouldnt matter because those quests would still be better.

 

But we agreed on the bulk of what ya said so. Its cool

[In Exile]

Sacred Ashes is a main quest, not a side quest.

A little less talk about "honesty" is warranted here... as we have little standing to judge one another on that quality. Basic "accuracy" still needs enough work, itself.

But that the point: the actual design is the same for Bioware in DAO even in an MQ. What sets it apart is all of the dialogue and RP choices, not the fact that it isn't a fetch quest.

[Superluccix]

Sacred Ashes is a main quest, not a side quest.

 

A little less talk about "honesty" is warranted here... as we have little standing to judge one another on that quality. Basic "accuracy" still needs enough work, itself.

 

Ok. Then just replace Sacred Ashes with anything else and the point still stands.

 

Though I will concede that I said a main quest was a side quest.  My bad

[Superluccix]

I realize that hyperbole is de rigueur on the interwebs.  But it is extremely unlikely that you learned about opportunity costs in elementary school.

 

I kid you not. 5th grade I believe. Remember I had to watch some video on some shitty school tv while i was sitting in the back : /

 

Dont remember 99% of the video, just that tidbit.

[Lintton]

No one cares about how tired you are of moving your character from point a to point b and killing dudes.

[AshesEleven]

*shrug*  

 

I mean, Origins had quests that were more fleshed out, but I didn't get the sense that they connected to the main story.  Whereas most (or a significant portion of) quests in Inquisition are tied to your purpose as Inquisitor.  To gain power, expand influence, kill demons that are pouring through the rifts, etc.  

 

Do I wish the bigger side quests had more story, more meat to them?  Absolutely, but I enjoy most of them regardless.  

 

While we're on the topic of dishonesty and ridiculous arguments, I think the whole "INQUISITION IS NOTHING BUT COLLECTING RAM MEAT" argument is getting tiresome.  It's such an overused point that doesn't really hold weight because 1) It's just one quest and 2) THERE ARE PLENTY OF OTHER QUESTS THAT ARE JUST AS BORING.  Are we not smart enough to use different examples?  Using the same example over and over again doesn't help prove your point, it makes you look dumb.

 

Not directed at you, there's been some users who don't seem to know how to use more than one example to make a point.  It frustrates me.   

[Sanunes]

To me a quest in a BioWare game has three parts.  The conversation/starter, the dialogue wrapper, and the quest itself.  Now I think Dragon Age: Origins and Dragon Age: Inquisition are very similar in the starter and the quest itself and the quest itself is generally structured the same way in both games (go kill or find items).  Where Origins did a better job on sidequests and what Inquisition did better on the main quests is the dialogue wrapper on the quests.  In Origins I really did like the fact I could complete a quest by going to a different NPC for a different sentence, but sadly at the end the quest was still extremely isolated, it took until Inquisition to see a payoff for Dagna.

 

What I am always confused by is the reaction for with one game you have people upset at BioWare because the game works in a direction, so they make changes to the game because people didn't come across liking that direction and then people are upset that changed the direction in the new game.  Look at how people reacted to the "side quests" in Mass Effect 3 they were a lot of complaints that they didn't want to travel all the way back to The Citadel for a lousy side-quest, which meant the dialogue wrapper was disliked, now people are upset that the dialogue wrapper isn't part of Inquisition.

[AshesEleven]

 

 

What I am always confused by is the reaction for with one game you have people upset at BioWare because the game works in a direction, so they make changes to the game because people didn't come across liking that direction and then people are upset that they aren't like the direction in the new game.  Look at how people reacted to the "side quests" in Mass Effect 3 they were a lot of complaints that they didn't want to travel all the way back to The Citadel for a lousy side-quest, which meant the dialogue wrapper was disliked, now people are upset that the dialogue wrapper isn't part of Inquisition.

 

You have to understand that complainers aren't a hive mind that changes it's mind with each new decision.  It's usually different people complaining about different choices in the design.

[Sanunes]

You have to understand that complainers aren't a hive mind that changes it's mind with each new decision.  It's usually different people complaining about different choices in the design.

 

Fair enough, its just seems to be a vicious cycle ending with "BioWare has abandoned its core fans" comments when everyone has different tastes on what makes a game they can enjoy.

[abr]

DAI has underwhelming side quests. It's fade section is truncated and disappointing. But the Winter's Palace is phenomenal, and it's by far their best and most varied RP quest.

 

So you just made twenty posts nitpicking semantics although you agree the sidequests are awful? 

[Lianaar]

So you just made twenty posts nitpicking semantics although you agree the sidequests are awful? 

While I disagree with some things he wrote, it seemed to me his main intent was to channel complaints into a constructive and conscise, clear wording that can be conveyed properly. At least that was my reading of his comments.

[AshesEleven]

Fair enough, its just seems to be a vicious cycle ending with "BioWare has abandoned its core fans" comments when everyone has different tastes on what makes a game they can enjoy.

 

Yeah I agree.  Though on the one hand, obviously if the new game has moved in a direction you dislike, you'll feel somewhat cheated, betrayed, and be moved to complain on the forums about how Bioware is losing touch.  I just detest the attitude that a lot of people with complaints have, this air of superiority, as if they're true fans and everyone else isn't, as if only people like them can enjoy games, that they're more intelligent and that obviously everyone agrees with them.  Basically just don't be a ******.  

[NM_Che56]

the side quests in DA:I are better.

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

I brought up in another thread about Origins the quest with Conner. Let's say that I use Blood Magic to sacrifice Isolde before making a deal with the Desire Demon.

 

What consequences do I face for doing that? Alistair disapproves -10?

 

In one playthrough I was excessively rude to him. I got something like -137. I was rather surprised.

[In Exile]

So you just made twenty posts nitpicking semantics although you agree the sidequests are awful?

It's not nitpicking. Like others have said the reason a quest is bad is very important. I don't want more quests with no dialogue even if they have more clever designs. I want more dialogue. If the forum criticism is just "less fetch quests" that's meaningless since even main quests in DAO are like that. It doesn't tell Bioware anything useful.

[Captain_Obvious]

I think the side quests are fine.  Different strokes, and all that.  Main story is a little short compared to the wide-open game, but I like the side quests well enough to keep doing them.  

[abr]

(...)COMPLETELY IGNORING all of the Origins side quests which involved multiple dialogue options and multiple ways to end a quest. In Inquisition however, 99% of all of these side quests involve "Accept or dont accept" and "Turn in or dont turn in" dialogue options. And there arent really multiple ways to end these quests. (...)

 

 

It's not nitpicking. Like others have said the reason a quest is bad is very important. I don't want more quests with no dialogue even if they have more clever designs. I want more dialogue. If the forum criticism is just "less fetch quests" that's meaningless since even main quests in DAO are like that. It doesn't tell Bioware anything useful.

 

...and for the record, i too want more dialogue and hell yeah i'll say it... more cutscenes!!!

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

Ok. Then just replace Sacred Ashes with anything else and the point still stands.

 

Though I will concede that I said a main quest was a side quest.  My bad

 

Don't ask people do do your homework for you. I'm likely to agree with you for the most part, but even I don't see that you've made your case. In fact Nefla made your case much better a couple of pages ago, giving solid examples from DAO of good side quests.

 

How about you list out 10 or so side quests (and avoid main quests) in Origins you liked, and are good examples of what you'd like to see?

 

I'll start you off with one.

 

You talk to a chantry scholar in Denerim who tells you she is a curator, looking for artifacts related to Andraste.

You go to haven, and while there find some writings.

You return to the curator and she talks to you about the find and how amazing it is, and rewards you for it.

 

No branching but it gives some solid background lore for the story.

 

The same quest DA2 style: Find something. Toss it to the NPC and say 'hey you dropped this'

 

Same quest DAI style:

Short intro to the quest

Find item

Short thank you, or codex entry a reward

 

OK, your turn.

[Degs29]

2. Both DA:O and DA:I have MMO fetch quests, therefore you cannot complain about DA:I side quests without also complaining about DA:O side quests

 

To some extent this is true, but I think it's more useful to say the opposite:  that both DA:O and DA:I have some meaningful side quests (I actually believe DA:I has more).  However, DA:I has far more fetch quests than DA:O, which can be attributed to the scope of the game.

 

As for the storytelling, I honestly don't understand where some people are coming from when they say DA:O's storytelling is superb and DA:I's is crap.  I thought the storytelling was consistent throughout the series, with maybe a little dip in DA2.  I also think the characters have been better written in DA2 and DA:I than they were in DA:O.  But regardless of where each game falls on the scale for either storytelling or characters, the differences between games are rather small.  Certainly there's not enough gap there to say one is fantastic and the others are crap.

[pinkjellybeans]

Differences between the side quests in DAI and DAO:

 

DAO: You can actually talk to the NPC giving you the quest.

DAI: "We need blankets!", "goodbye." "we need food!", "good luck"

 

DAO: The quests are fleshed out so you have multiple choices, which helps you shape your warden's personality.

DAI: Find ring, "here's your ring", done. Find dead person's body, "your lover is dead", done.

 

DAO: Cutscenes! Emotions! Unique reactions!

DAI: Tell NPC someone they care about is dead and they just stand there with the same expression on their face like we're talking about the weather.

[Draining Dragon]

I'm just going to assume from the title that your post reflects my thoughts exactly.

[Chaos17]

OP : it's not the fetch quests themselves that are a problem is the quantity of them.

There're much more fetch quests in DA:I than quets story related compared to previous titles.

 

You said we should skip them if we don't like them, then you admit that about 80% of the content is useless to the plot and whe should be happy to have spent 60$ on it while we could've paid instead like 40$ for the story only. /ok

[Zanallen]

Sidequests I personally enjoyed were ones that were focused on a human element and that had different ways to resolve. Things like:

 

 

Thank you. Having examples of what you found enjoyable is quite helpful in discussions like this. And I agree that sidequests with more dialogue and multiple possible outcomes are better than simple quests like "Collect 10 Ram Meat" from DA:I or "Turn in 5 traps" in DA:O. What did you think of the quest in the Hinterlands with the scout asking you to find his partner? I liked that one. Sure, it was kind of simple, but it had a couple different outcomes and the dialogue was nice. I felt that it, and many other of the Hinterlands quests, really helped set the tone of the area.

[Nefla]

Thank you. Having examples of what you found enjoyable is quite helpful in discussions like this. And I agree that sidequests with more dialogue and multiple possible outcomes are better than simple quests like "Collect 10 Ram Meat" from DA:I or "Turn in 5 traps" in DA:O. What did you think of the quest in the Hinterlands with the scout asking you to find his partner? I liked that one. Sure, it was kind of simple, but it had a couple different outcomes and the dialogue was nice. I felt that it, and many other of the Hinterlands quests, really helped set the tone of the area.

It was definitely one of the better ones as was the measuring the veil one