447 réponses à ce sujet

[Realmzmaster]

But funnily enough these things you know about the dwarves only come from what they tell you in a cutscene or two, and the ending slideshow which is... just text.

 

A great deal of what the warden learns about the dwarves and dwarven society is in the codices which are text. Actually the whole point of the dwarven conflict can be resolved like a coin toss. The warden really should not care who is king as long has the warden gets an army. The other interesting point of the conflict is that a lot of what is learned about Bhelen or Harrowmount is conveyed by text and not cutscenes.

It also does not matter who the warden sides with because both sides basically give the warden the same quests with only the initial one being different, but that quest stills boils down to can the warden be trusted by that side.

I basically came away from the quest thinking it really does not matter. My warden gets an army from either side. 

[dlux]

Dragon Age: Inqusition doesn't have any side quests, it only has fetch quests aka. filler content. Closing rifts is also filler content. 80% of the game is made up copy-pasted of filler content.

 

How somebody can even think about defending terrible quest design like that is beyond me.

[In Exile]

Dragon Age: Inqusition doesn't have any side quests, it only has fetch quests aka. filler content. Closing rifts is also filler content. 80% of the game is made up copy-pasted of filler content.

How somebody can even think about defending terrible quest design like that is beyond me.

No one defended the quest design. So you can rest easy. Well, except for the fans who defend it in DAO because they think dialogue can remedy its inclusion.

[AshesEleven]

Dragon Age: Inqusition doesn't have any side quests, it only has fetch quests aka. filler content. Closing rifts is also filler content. 80% of the game is made up copy-pasted of filler content.

 

How somebody can even think about defending terrible quest design like that is beyond me.

 

lol wut?  Why do people insist on being silly?  You can still think the quests are terribly designed without making the ridiculous claim that they're not side quests...

 

If it's not part of the main storyline but is a quest on the side, it's a side quest.  It's in the name.  A fetch quest can be (and usually is) a side quest.  

[Realmzmaster]

That the nice point about opinions everyone has one. What I gather from the OP's post is that if I want your opinion I will give it to you. My opinion must be wrong if it disagrees with the OP's opinion.

 

I like the quest in DAI. I have told Bioware what I like about the quests and what I do not like. I will write and defend what I like. 

 

Everyone uses the example of the 10 ram meats which I thought was a reasonable side quest. The hunter is unable to hunt. The refugees are starving. The Inquisitor needs to gain influence with the people. What better way than helping people in need. The payoff comes when the Inquisitor returns the meat to the hunter and he says I will be able to feed the people tonight. The hunter then basically says he was suspect about the Inquisition, but not anymore because he has witness firsthand the Inquisition and its leader's help.

 

That to me fits with the overall theme of the game. The same with finding caches of clothing and blankets. The lost scout sidequest was a good sidequest showing the leader is willing to find and protect one of his own. The cult in the castle sidequest where the Inquisitor gets to tell them what to do. The elven sidequests to gain favor makes sense because you are trying to gain trust.

 

I do not understand where this MMO fetch quests idea comes from. Maybe it is because I have been playing long enough to know that these type of quests existed in the first crpg created. 

[Realmzmaster]

Dragon Age: Inqusition doesn't have any side quests, it only has fetch quests aka. filler content. Closing rifts is also filler content. 80% of the game is made up copy-pasted of filler content.

 

How somebody can even think about defending terrible quest design like that is beyond me.

 

I can only assume then that many things may be beyond you.

[Lewie]

Maybe it depends on peoples perspective. Heck you could argue shooters are the same, kill enemy, repeat day in day out yay look numbers. 

 

Look at World of Warcraft pick all the flowers and ore you find, collect 50 of these, 20 of those, that game makes Inquisition look like nothing and it isn't regarded as a failure yet people are hooked in the story world. It can take months just to get armour. I used to play it years ago and only for a year or 2 but Inquisition is nothing in comparison. Yes I know this is a compressed game in comparison etc, but for me the story is there in every map I don't need a hundred cutscenes to show it to me. I can spend an hour in skyhold just talking to people it is actually a relief to get back out sometimes and get things done, you're not restricted to one thing you can do what you like.

 

In all honesty though a few maps needed more 'meat'. I can't deny that. Most of them were fine but if they had a deadline then I get it. I did not like the hissing wastes, too sparse. Building the bridge in the exalted plains and fighting all the way up to one room I said out loud 'What! Is this it?' One room. So yeah, more meat in places I have to agree somewhat, I don't mind flower picking and mining I guess.

[Farangbaa]

I think it's a little sad people need cutscenes so desperatly to think somethings a good guest.

[Aurok]

Decent narrative/roleplaying elements can and do elevate otherwise mechanically weak content. That's been Bioware's stock in trade for years. They just neglected to take advantage of it on this occasion for whatever reason.

Now, neglecting those elements and relying on the strength of your gameplay alone is a legitimate route to take too ofc - just maybe not for a studio which has never shown an aptitude for creating good gameplay. That just isn't Bioware's strong suit.

[In Exile]

Decent narrative/roleplaying elements can and do elevate otherwise mechanically weak content. That's been Bioware's stock in trade for years. They just neglected to take advantage of it on this occasion for whatever reason.

Now, neglecting those elements and relying on the strength of your gameplay alone is a legitimate route to take too ofc - just maybe not for a studio which has never shown an aptitude for creating good gameplay. That just isn't Bioware's strong suit.

I think the quest design is a bigger problem than the gameplay. I find that Bestheda games have poor gameplay, but the occasionally interesting quest design makes it tolerable. FO:NV is a lot of fun for me despite the ass gameplay because of Obsidian's phenomenal quest design.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

DAO side quest all win by miles. They actually had choices in them! DAI is just:

 

1) Explore place

2) Kill everything in it.

3) ???

4) Profit!

 

It's funny how a game that came out in the last decade is still the best Dragon Age game to date.

[In Exile]

DAO side quest all win by miles. They actually had choices in them! DAI is just:

1) Explore place
2) Kill everything in it.
3) ???
4) Profit!

It's funny how a game that came out in the last decade is still the best Dragon Age game to date.

But that was every side quest in DAO. It had dialogue too, sure, but the actual gameplay was just pure murder.

[Lewie]

DAO side quest all win by miles. They actually had choices in them! DAI is just:

 

1) Explore place

2) Kill everything in it.

3) ???

4) Profit!

 

It's funny how a game that came out in the last decade is still the best Dragon Age game to date.

That will always be debatable and a matter of opinion. Both games have good and bad. If Inquisition had the time DAO did yes, it would have been even better, that shouldn't detract from its good points though. I played DAO and 2 before Inquisition came out and I felt like I was going through the motions, they were great games and had their place but things have to move on.

[Aurok]

I think the quest design is a bigger problem than the gameplay. I find that Bestheda games have poor gameplay, but the occasionally interesting quest design makes it tolerable. FO:NV is a lot of fun for me despite the ass gameplay because of Obsidian's phenomenal quest design.

I think Bethesda's ability to create an atmosphere and a sense of place carries them a long way too. I think this is one area where losing the ever-present filler content / resource collecting / obnoxious HUD from Inquisition would significantly improve it.

Obsidian are just massively underrated in general imo, and should be constantly in demand across the industry. There is no doubt in my mind that DA: Tevinter would turn out significantly better if Obsidian played a role in its creation. The setting would be perfect for them.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

But that was every side quest in DAO. It had dialogue too, sure, but the actual gameplay was just pure murder.

 

I could actually persuade my way out of some fights (Careless accusation) or intimidate the thugs to give me everything they have (blackstone irregulars: A change in leadership) or use stealth and poison to get my objective (Crime Wave). With the exception of one mission in Emprise Du Lion, every story-based side mission is just a kill this and kill that.

 

Also I find the gameplay in Inquisition to be pure murder but that's because the companion AI is dumb as hell.

[Maverick827]

But that was every side quest in DAO. It had dialogue too, sure, but the actual gameplay was just pure murder.

 

This is factually incorrect.

[In Exile]

This is factually incorrect.

No. It's a literally true description of the vast majority of side quests in DAO.

[In Exile]

I could actually persuade my way out of some fights (Careless accusation) or intimidate the thugs to give me everything they have (blackstone irregulars: A change in leadership) or use stealth and poison to get my objective (Crime Wave). With the exception of one mission in Emprise Du Lion, every story-based side mission is just a kill this and kill that.

Also I find the gameplay in Inquisition to be pure murder but that's because the companion AI is dumb as hell.

There are few rare missions were you can sidestep the boss fight part of your murder spree. But that's rare. And that's just skipping a fight - the gameplay part of the quest never changes, you just skip it.

[lazysuperstar]

If closing rifts is filler content, check this out in DAO

1) Getting those flowers for Mabari
2) All random encounters
3) Recruiting Sten (There is no sensible reason why he should be freed, trusted and recruited knowing what he has done)

4) Delivering health poultice to that healer in lothering

5) Crafting venom and traps in Lothering (same as getting 10 Ram meat)

6) Locating remains of a dead woman

 

<-- All these just when you start the game and not even considering quests of Chanter's board, blackstone irregulars and mages collective. Maybe I am not that easily pleased for cutscenes to make up for minutes of doing unimportant menial jobs

[dlux]

If closing rifts is filler content, check this out in DAO

Closing dozens of rifts is copy-pasted filler content.

Anyway, every RPG, even Origins, has fetch quests. Which is fine. It is only a problem when you make a game like Dragon Age: Inquisition where 80% of the game is made up of simple fetch quests and boring copy-pasted filler content.

[In Exile]

Closing a dozens of rifts is copy-pasted filler content.

Anyway, every RPG, even Origins, has fetch quests. Which is fine. It is only a problem when you make a game like Dragon Age: Inquisition where 80% of the game is made up of simple fetch quests and boring copy-pasted filler content.

I find it far more egregious when every main quest is a fetch quest, which was the Bioware gold standard from KoTOR through to DAO.

When 3/5 main quests are fetch quests, and nested in then are *more* fetch quests, something is wrong with your design.

It's fine if you think dialogue makes the quest less boring/meaningful. But stop pretending it used another design.

[L. Han]

DA:I quests are just so boring for me. No characters to meet is probably the biggest issue. The only side quest character I remember is probably the hunter who asks you to get some ram meat. And thats because I was so annoyed by it.

 

Hell, even SWTOR had more interesting sidequests. How is that possible?

[pinkjellybeans]

If closing rifts is filler content, check this out in DAO

1) Getting those flowers for Mabari
2) All random encounters
3) Recruiting Sten (There is no sensible reason why he should be freed, trusted and recruited knowing what he has done)

4) Delivering health poultice to that healer in lothering

5) Crafting venom and traps in Lothering (same as getting 10 Ram meat)

6) Locating remains of a dead woman

 

<-- All these just when you start the game and not even considering quests of Chanter's board, blackstone irregulars and mages collective. Maybe I am not that easily pleased for cutscenes to make up for minutes of doing unimportant menial jobs

 

The flowers for the Mabari has a significant impact because if you save him, later on he finds you and turns out to be one of your companions. It's a simple fetch quest but had a pretty good and important outcome. 

 

How is recruiting Sten even considered filler content? lol If you want to go down that road, it's no different from recruiting Vivienne, Iron Bull or Sera. They basically show up, "hey, I wanna be on your Inquisition thing" and that's it. You don't know any of them, yet you trust them and welcome them to the Inquisition after meeting them for like 2 minutes.

 

Sure the other ones are fetch quests and no different from the ones we have in Inquisition BUT we have other side quests in DAO that have an interesting and engaging story (even if small). The point is, Inquisition is a never ending Chanter's board where you barely have any dialogue, don't make any choices and if you want a bit of story you have to read the codex.

[L. Han]

If closing rifts is filler content, check this out in DAO

1) Getting those flowers for Mabari
2) All random encounters
3) Recruiting Sten (There is no sensible reason why he should be freed, trusted and recruited knowing what he has done)

4) Delivering health poultice to that healer in lothering

5) Crafting venom and traps in Lothering (same as getting 10 Ram meat)

6) Locating remains of a dead woman

 

<-- All these just when you start the game and not even considering quests of Chanter's board, blackstone irregulars and mages collective. Maybe I am not that easily pleased for cutscenes to make up for minutes of doing unimportant menial jobs

 

Random encounters is what gives the game some life and color to the game. It even gives you the opportunity to craft unique weapons or even sell/buy some gear on the way.

 

Comparing crafting venom and traps to gathering 10 ram meat is just silly. Granted that both quests are monotonous, there is some significant difference between the two quests. One quest serves as a small tutorial and a heads-up for rogues that they got an unique advantage over other classes. What does killing and gathering 10 rams teach you? How to do fetch quests?

[dlux]

I find it far more egregious when every main quest is a fetch quest, which was the Bioware gold standard from KoTOR through to DAO.

When 3/5 main quests are fetch quests, and nested in then are *more* fetch quests, something is wrong with your design.

It's fine if you think dialogue makes the quest less boring/meaningful. But stop pretending it used another design.

Except that isn't true. You just repeatedly fail to grasp the concept of what filler content or fetch quests are.