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Sera & Solas Similarities (Who is Sera really?)


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#101
MasqureMan

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Nah I don't think so. I think that the Sera-Solas relationship is supposed to show us his current perspective on the state of his people, and the possibility of there being hope for them that he doesn't expect in Sera's methods and personality. 



#102
Beomer

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Whoa....

#103
Gunslinger01101

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(sorry for the wall of text...no short way to say all of this)

 

As I don’t post a lot in this section I went through some of the Sera and Solas threads but didn’t really find anything addressing this topic so if it has been covered please ignore.

 

One thing that has really struck me about Sera and Solas is how similar they are and considering how significant Solas is to the plot of DAI and think we all may have missed something about Sera. I don’t think she is who she claims to be. But first let’s look how similar the two are.

 

* First, generally, they look really different than most Elves that we know of in Thedas.

 

* The both are VERY cagey when it comes to talking about their past and where they originally came from.

 

* They both have a disdain for the Dalish and modern Elves in general.

 

* They both claim no one taught them their fighting skills (Sera – Bow / Solas – Magic) Matter a fact they both are also invasive talking about this topic as well.

 

* They both seem to be somewhat of an enigma.

 

Now in the game I think there are big clues that Solas knows more about Sera than he lets on.

 

First at one point Solas asks Sera if she knows any magic. Why would he do this? (Especially knowing now who he really is.) Is Sera really a secret Mage? Is that why she is so defensive about magic? Keep in mind in the game when you talk to one of Iron Bull’s crew you discover there is an Elf Mage who used a bow as both a bow and a staff? I think this is more hinting at who Sera really is.

 

Also, when Solas attempts to speak to her in Elvan he refers to her as one of his people. This is HIGHLY significant as if you play as an Elf as the Inquisitor, Solas points out that even though you are an Elf you are NOT one of his people. Do you see the issue? Why would he refer to Sera as one and not the apparent saviour of the world?  

 

In the game the more I talked to Sera I kept thinking of the Shakespearean quote from Hamlet "The lady doth protest too much, methinks".  In my opinion Sera is hiding something. Something big. 

 

Sera often talks about “people” and most have assumed she means everyday people. But remember what Flemth(Mythal) refers to the Dalish as in DA2? “The People”.  I do not think this is a coincidence.  

 

Now give all of the above is it possible that Sera is in fact Andruil in disguise?

 

This below quote is describing Andruil

 

Andruil is the elven Goddess of the Hunt, creator of the Vir Tanadahl or Way of Three Trees. First, the Vir Assan, or Way of the Arrow: fly straight and do not waver. Second, the Vir Bor'assan, or Way of the Bow: bend but never break. Third, the Vir Adahlen, or Way of the Forest: together we are stronger than the one.

 

Andruil is the master of the bow and arrow. Sera is a master of bow and arrow and claims to have no training.

 

Andruil was one of the original Elven gods and therefore someone Solas would consider “his people”.

 

Andruil, being one of the old gods would have had magic, something that Sera claims to not have but seemingly hinted at by Solas and her almost “irrational” dislike of it. Is she protesting too much? Is she using a bow as her staff as we now know it can be done?

 

We also know (according to Solas in DAI) that Anduil already had somewhat of a disrespect for her own people as she hunted them down for sport.

 

Now the arguments against this is going to be her belief in Andraste.  But one does not exclude this other. In fact, it might bolster it.

 

Let’s assume for a moment that Sera is in fact Andruil. We all know that the Elven gods were not “all powerful” nor were they the creator. In fact after DAI it is suggested they were just really, really powerful Mages or demi-gods mistaken for “gods”. 

 

We also now know that the fall of the old Elves was not due to humans but their own infighting hinted at because they gods would no longer answer them due to The Dread Wolf locking them away.

 

We know that at least Mythal was alive and well for many, many years previous to DAI. We also know that The Dread Wolf (Fen'Harel/Solas) recently awoke as was in a weakened state.

 

Is it possible that Andruil recently awoke as well? It is possible when she awoke and saw the havoc and destruction of both magic and the disappearance of the Eleven gods caused Thedas she felt horribly guilty and ashamed and took on a different persona? Is it possible she discovered the truth about the fall of the ancient due to infighting and she decided to reject everything about her previous life as Anduil up to and including worshiping the human creator/god?

 

If this is true and she inherently knew the conclave was destroyed by Eleven magic, did she join the Inquisition with ulterior motives? Did she think that Elven magic once again was threatening the fabric of the world and she wanted to stop it? Did she take the guise of Sera as to keep her true indemnity a secret?

 

What do you think?

Sera is so low-key, I think she's probably just an elf with an attitude. Low-key. Loki. Norse god of tricks and making fun of people. Hah, Gaiman'd.



#104
Unpleasant Implications

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Well thats, wow. Now this is a fan theory I can get behind.
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#105
Guest_StreetMagic_*

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Thing with Andruil though is she no longer is the Huntress. She got bored of that and went after the forgotten ones... and then went crazy in the void. And I don't think Sera is crazy like that.

 

Her being an Arcane Archer is an interesting spin though.



#106
AutumnWitch

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I wanted to add this. This is how I think Andruils essence became Sera. Its from another thread I replied to but addresses Sera's/Anduils origin.

 

Ok this is the short, short version. During the blights it turns out the Grey Wardens were not REALLY killing the arch-demons. What they were doing is when they "took in the soul" of the arch-demon they were only taking the curse/blighted part of their souls. In essence they were cleaning the Eleven gods from Mythal's curse. The real soul of the Eleven gods escaped probably in spirit or wisp form. They were very weakened in this state and had to take over other  bodies (sort of how Flemeth does). However, Flemeth/Mythal all this time assumed they were dead by the Wardens hands. However, when Morrigan did the ritual in DAO, Flemeth discovered they were not truly dead. So she woke Solas/Fen'Haral to help her track them all down again and perhaps lock them  back up or really destroy them. Its my theory that  Flemeth helped Fen'Haral when he originally locked them away. Most likely because she knew how power hungry they were becoming. This would explain all the statues of the Dread Wolf in Mythals temple.

 

 

This also explains supports my theory that Sera is in fact Adruil reborn. The girl who was Sera died in the orphanage in Denerim but when they killed the Arch-demon, Andruils weakened spirit found Sera's body. This is why Sera is so much bigger than the Dalish and so forth.


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#107
Lady Nuggins

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That is a really interesting theory, for sure.  It does make some of those details stand out.

 

But I like thinking of Sera as representing something entirely different: somebody who the entire world has spit upon her entire life.  I see her conversations with Solas as heart-wrenching, because he seems to be clumsily attempting to reach out to her.  And what would Sera think, if she knew who he was?  She'd probably hate him even more.  The elven gods weren't there for her when she was an orphan, and they certainly weren't there for her whenever some stuck-up Dalish called her "flat-ear."  She hates "elfy" stuff for the same reason that she hates nobles: because all they've ever done is look down on her for not having the privileges they have.  

 

What I see underneath all of Sera's whimsy isn't some dark secret, it's just a hurt child who has managed to survive the awful hand she was dealt by being sarcastic and bitter about it all.  


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#108
Unpleasant Implications

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I wanted to add this. This is how I think Andruils essence became Sera. Its from another thread I replied to but addresses Sera's/Anduils origin.
 
Ok this is the short, short version. During the blights it turns out the Grey Wardens were not REALLY killing the arch-demons. What they were doing is when they "took in the soul" of the arch-demon they were only taking the curse/blighted part of their souls. In essence they were cleaning the Eleven gods from Mythal's curse. The real soul of the Eleven gods escaped probably in spirit or wisp form. They were very weakened in this state and had to take over other  bodies (sort of how Flemeth does). However, Flemeth/Mythal all this time assumed they were dead by the Wardens hands. However, when Morrigan did the ritual in DAO, Flemeth discovered they were not truly dead. So she woke Solas/Fen'Haral to help her track them all down again and perhaps lock them  back up or really destroy them. Its my theory that  Flemeth helped Fen'Haral when he originally locked them away. Most likely because she knew how power hungry they were becoming. This would explain all the statues of the Dread Wolf in Mythals temple.
 
 
This also explains supports my theory that Sera is in fact Adruil reborn. The girl who was Sera died in the orphanage in Denerim but when they killed the Arch-demon, Andruils weakened spirit found Sera's body. This is why Sera is so much bigger than the Dalish and so forth.


So the Archdemons sort of work like Cole, then?

#109
AutumnWitch

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So the Archdemons sort of work like Cole, then?

 

yes...this is why Solas is so fascinated  by him. There are only handful of "beings" like this that exist. I have not ruled that Cole is not in fact another Eleven god but I can't construct that argument yet. But it there is some evidence supporting this as well.



#110
AresKeith

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I think this theory is people reading too much into things

#111
Helmetto

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(Writing my thoughts on the matter as I go, excuse inconsistencies)

 

The fact of the matter is, Sera's just not introspective enough for us to really know for sure that she's a walking elven goddess.

 

I've read somewhere that Sera couldn't hide how she felt or thought no matter how hard she tried, and I agree with that statement entirely, as there are dozens of times where she's stayed true to that assessment. Of all the companions, I think she's the few who don't have a hidden agenda on their hands. Thus, I don't think Sera is tricking anyone - at least, not intentionally.

 

There are just too many hints that suggest, however, that Sera is much more than what she is; she is perhaps much more sketchier than Solas of all people. In fact, she practically is so nonexistent that our poor ambassador can't find word on her - yet somehow, Vivienne still can and has, if her banter with Sera is any indication:

 

Sera: "I bet you left a trail."

Viv: "Whatever are you on about now dear?"

Sera: "What you use to be. Wherever you're from. Little People will know about you."

Viv: "We all have something we use to be, haven't we dear? Dumb things we would rather let die than have known? By all means, escalate, but I will answer in kind, armed with painful history I am sure is better left to your own sad memory."

Sera: "She's friggen evil she is."

 

So, this begs the question: How is it that Vivienne knows things that even our spymaster Lelianna and ambassador Josephine can't track down? All the information that we know about Sera, is made from little things that she has mentioned or observations made by our Inquisitor. If Vivienne knows anything about Sera, then why hasn't she told the Inquisition? I imagine that if it's about "hey by the way your elven Red Jenny gal is a walking old god that use to murder elves for fun", the Vivienne would probably tell the Inquisitor about it. And if it's something trivial, then why would she even hold back that information at all? It's not in Vivienne's best interests to stick her neck out like that for Sera of all people. It's not like it's any use to even have blackmail on Sera, either, because why does she even need to blackmail someone that for her, it's child's play to simply manipulate? There's been banter where Vivienne pretty much waved a note about some baron Sera really wanted to arrow, and she only hesitated because it was from Vivienne. I think its safe to say that Vivienne could have her wrapped around her finger if she actually wanted it.

 

In this conversation, Vivienne is more annoyed that Sera would reveal her background to people, and when she threatens retaliation, Sera backs the **** off. This is weird, considering that Sera has come forward with bits of her past, such as Lady Emmald, but only toward the Inquisitor. Even more sketchy is that a "noble" picks up someone off the street, especially an elf. I dunno about you, but I imagine that there'd be, you know, plenty of other orphans running around that weren't blatantly elven during the blight. Like that one kid who runs around delivering messages in DAO.

 

On top of that, Sera being from Denerim must have at most been before the Warden's final battle with the Archdemon; I found it peculiar that she hated darkspawn, yet hunting Dragons gave her an adrenaline rush. Wasn't the Archdemon, you know, big ass scary looking dragon? Didn't it come to Denerim too? You can try and pass it off as Sera wanted to copy the Warden, except, you know, she didn't really even remember him when she was talking with Inky about it.

 

I also think that Sera is more unnerved by magic than even "normal people". We've met and encountered "normal people" during DAO and the only time people shat themselves was when Blood Magic came up. If Sera is an indicator of how "normal people" respond to mages, then how the hell were they ever welcomed at Redcliffe and even allowed to stay long enough for Fiona to go over to Orlais to chat up Inky and back? Redcliffe is a prime example of magic gone wrong, but they still housed the mages. 

 

And given Sera's entire personality and lifestyle habits, I kind of get the sense that her relationship with "normal people" is not empathetic, but sympathetic. A Normal Person in Dragon Age is perhaps a farmer, a servant, a laundry person, someone who performs some sort of duty and just barely makes enough to get by, let alone spend coin at a tavern. To support that kind of lifestyle, one must have quite a bit of coin, and a steady supply of it, something that being a Red Jenny simply does not give. On top of that, I don't think moving from Denerim of all places to Orlais on a whim is exactly cheap.

 

In short, Sera has things going on that

1) Vivienne is not willing to be forthcoming with initially AND was within her ability to find out. 

2) Can't be found out about by asking around, even if its through a spymaster of incredible skill

3) Would interest a noble enough to cause her to be adopted (there's just no way that it's "out of the goodness of her heart"; if she's willing to lie about not being able to make cookies for the sake of pride, then imagine accepting the fact that you can't have kids and adopting someone who couldn't possibly resemble you enough for you to at least pretend that they're yours)

4) Allows her access to move around as she pleases (Though this might just be because of her connection to the noble, rather than any trait of hers)

5) Causes Solas and Cole to react curiously around her

 

She is very, very sketchy. If it weren't for her heart, I'd have a hard time trusting her.

 

EDIT: On top of that, it's even sketchier that a bunch of adults conducting somewhat illegal activities would even have Sera in the party. Like, kids squeal guys.


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#112
Fandango

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You’re not the only one who thinks something is going on with Sera, OP. I started getting the feeling something was up before finishing my first playthrough. It doesn't mean it's correct of course, but it is fun to speculate. A friend and I have been speculating about Sera for a while.

First I’m not sure that Sera is Andruil in the way Solas is Fen’Harel. While Sera doesn’t remember her parents, I think it’s possible she is a vessel for Andruil in the way Flemeth is for Mythal. Regardless, I don’t think Sera knows what is going on. She seems to be hiding from memories, fears her dreams could be real (something that comes up in the romance) and is antagonistic toward the elven “gods”. At times she seems to want the Inquisitor to reassure her that the elven “gods” aren’t real (her reaction when returning from the well of sorrows).

Here is a codex entry on Andruil that I think is important:
 

Spoiler

 
"Yet even a god should not linger there, and each time she entered the Void, Andruil suffered longer and longer periods of madness after returning." and "But Mythal's magic sapped Andruil's strength, and stole her knowledge of how to find the Void. After this, the great hunter could never make her way back to the abyss, and peace returned."
 
This text could explain why Sera doesn’t know what she is (whatever that is) where she came from, and her apparent loss of memory. She remembers being a child in the alienage but says she doesn’t remember her parents and doesn't care to remember where she was born.

"One day Andruil grew tired of hunting mortal men and beasts. She began stalking The Forgotten Ones, wicked things that thrive in the abyss." and "Mythal spread rumors of a monstrous creature and took the form of a great serpent, waiting for Andruil at the base of a mountain."
 
I think The Forgotten Ones may be dragons or like Flemeth take dragon form. The evidence for this is shaky but there is more ancient elven text that suggests the greater gods and their chosen could.
 
"His crime is high treason. He took on a form reserved for the gods and their chosen, and dared to fly in the shape of the divine. The sinner belongs to Dirthamen; he claims he took wings at the urging of Ghilan’nain, and begs protection from Mythal. She does not show him favor, and will let Elgar’nan judge him."  For a moment there is an image of a shifting, shadowy mass with blazing eyes, whose form may be one or many. Then is fades.
 
If true, it could explain why the game goes to lengths to enforce how much Sera enjoys hunting dragons. From her dialogue when you encounter dragons, to war table notes and this from her codex entry. I took a screenshot of it:
Spoiler

 
Yet even a god should not linger there, and each time she entered the Void, Andruil suffered longer and longer periods of madness after returning.
When you take Sera to The Fade and go to the area with the gravestones Sera’s specifically says that she is afraid of The Nothing. Which is strange unless you consider that The Nothing could be another way to describe The Void.
 
What evidence is there that Sera could be a vessel of sorts for Andruil? Andruil made Fen’Harel serve in her bed which doesn’t fit all too well with Sera’s preferences. I believe someone mentioned this earlier. And there's this quote by Cole:

"Fleet-footed and free, the arrow that caught the miller's sack, but no longer shot alone, a quiver in a quiver."
 
I think the quiver in a quiver part may be significant. If Andruil is empty of most of her significant memories, as is Sera. But the arrow is Andruil's purpose. Stuck in the sack it can't tear a hole that opens the floodgates. Meaning perhaps that she isn't serving her purpose.
 
"She shook the radiance of the stars, divided them into grains of light, then stored them in a shaft of gold. Andruil, blood and force, save us from the time this weapon is thrown. Your people pray to You. Spare us the moment we become Your sacrifice" There is a brief image of an elaborate golden spear, glowing with unbearable heat. Then it fades.
 
Cole also says the following, which I think ties into her purpose.

"She hurts, but helping hurts more. She sees the strings that pull me, eyes like raisins in a stale cookie."

Also how would Sera see the strings that pull Cole? I don't think she is hiding being a mage. But I think the part of Sera that may be Andruil is capable of it.

There is more I'm forgetting, but I am sure this is already a mighty wall of text so I'll end it here.


What a fascinating read - I certainly think you're onto something there Banxey. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
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#113
MoonDrummer

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If Sera gets to be Andruil, I demand that Sandal is June, my maherial is Elgar'nan and my Lavellan is Sylaise.

Actually that would be werid my warden would be flemeths husband and my inquisitor would be sera'a sister. I I knew how to spell it I would make her the mother of halla.

#114
Drasanil

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yes...this is why Solas is so fascinated  by him. There are only handful of "beings" like this that exist. I have not ruled that Cole is not in fact another Eleven god but I can't construct that argument yet. But it there is some evidence supporting this as well.

 

Lol, seriously, this thread. Wanna bet Josephine is Sylaise while we're at it? I mean Sylaise was the hearthkeeper and Josephine spends most of her time next to a fire place! And she runs the inquisistions day-to-days! Sounds like the goddess of homemakers to me  :pinched:


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#115
dragonprince

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Is it not obvious? Flemeth was the mother that adopted Sera!

 

I have no facts, I just am really interested by this thread.



#116
Cassie's_Bedlam

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I've just come across this and I'm not sure what to think really.

 

The idea that Sera could be Andruil is an interesting one, the evidence that you've all brought up is kind of hard to fully ignore the possibility, we know from the myths that Mythal sealed away Andruil's memories so that could be a possible reason why Sera doesn't know she is Andruil if she in fact is and the way Cole and Solas react to her is strange. Her fear of Nothing could relate to the Void or it could relate to the Nothing after Mythal took her memories--the myth says that Mythal took away her memories of how to get the Void but we don't know if she accidently all Andruil's memories or not. She also keeps saying her head hurts when Solas attempts to probe her about the sky and looking beyond the breach which could be her old memories as Andruil attempting to come back or something--I actually don't know where I was going with that thought now.

 

The idea of Sera being an Arcane Archer seems more plausible in a way. She reacts too much about magic for it not to be some part of her, and Solas offers to teach her magic, perhaps not because she's Andruil, but because she actually does have magic. The Dreamer ability does seem to tie in with this theory as Sera seemed to be really upset about her dream, perhaps too upset for just a nightmare. Perhaps she had dreams in the past that have come true?

 

It's also an interesting point that Vivienne seems to know something about Sera that Josephine and Lelianna couldn't find. It's also strange that a noble would just randomly adopt Sera as most nobles seem to look down upon elves as a whole so why would a noble adopt an elf? 



#117
Helmetto

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I like how people's response to Sera being an elven god is not a counterpoint, but a 'Yeah, and Cole is the True Queen of Orlais.'

 

I don't think Sera is an elven god, mind, but there's something really funny going on with her, and I think we might be heading in the right direction in questioning parts of her that don't add up. 

 

Like, Sera seems to really want the Inquisitor to stay the same (if you choose to romance her anyway), and her "you're going to DIE" dream is a bit striking. I think the tarot cards kind of imply as to what's to come, and Sera's just hoping for the Status Quo to remain the same.



#118
Catche Jagger

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While I think this is a cool theory and I agree with others in thinking that there may be a bit more to Sera than we're being told, I don't think she's an elven god. We only have two elf companions, having both of them be secret gods would border on the ridiculous.



#119
Gab

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I'm not sure, but I think it is an interesting theory. The writers may not have even decided yet themselves, but there is enough in there for it not to look like a complete turnaround if it happens to be the truth.

 

The fact that Sera doesn't remember things, or the fact that her character prefers women now, etc, etc, doesn't really matter, I don't think. 

There's been enough references to bow/staffs combined, madness, memory loss and Sera's dislike of nothingness and her not even remembering her childhood. Her background is the most mysterious of all the other characters, once you see the epilogue.

 

And there's no reason why there would not be more elven gods on the rise, it appears to be the time that something has stirred them up. Dread Wolf and Mythal know that there is something coming and so it would be no surprise that other gods are awakening. A god that is prone to madness and memory loss, two of Sera's main traits in the story, awakening could be the first of many. Who knows how long it will be before the rest follow?

 

I still feel as if the Maker and Andraste will turn out to be a red herring and the question of gods, or demi gods, lies between the Old Gods, the Forgotten Ones and the Elven Gods. The Chantry have got it wrong, the silence from the Maker, and the blight, came from elsewhere.


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#120
eternal_napalm

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I didn't like her at first. Now she is my romance <3
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#121
Stinkface27

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Played this game through once and didn't keep Sera around much because I love Varric and he was a permanent fixture in my party. Now I'm playing it again and noticed interesting banter between her and Solas. I kinda halfway formulated this theory and now I'm feeling very excited to read that others are speculating the same things and fleshing it out. (Good effort, you guys, for putting those massive posts together with all the screenshots/pictures and codex entries!)

Now to me one of the most telling lines of banter (haven't seen anyone post it yet? I could have missed it) was between her and Solas when she gets déjà vu...

 

Spoiler

 

The bolded to me seems like it could really mean what we suspect about Sera. I have tried but can't think of any other interpretation. Even if this is not true, it's great fun to speculate about :)


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#122
wickedgoodreed

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You’re not the only one who thinks something is going on with Sera, OP. I started getting the feeling something was up before finishing my first playthrough. It doesn't mean it's correct of course, but it is fun to speculate. A friend and I have been speculating about Sera for a while.
*snip*
Yet even a god should not linger there, and each time she entered the Void, Andruil suffered longer and longer periods of madness after returning.
When you take Sera to The Fade and go to the area with the gravestones Sera’s specifically says that she is afraid of The Nothing. Which is strange unless you consider that The Nothing could be another way to describe The Void.
 

 

Not really on board with this theory, but it is fun to speculate. I just came across the codex entry "The Empty Ones" (under Tales, 96). The name jumped out at me because of the way Sera describes what she sees in the Fade in place of spiders: "nothing...like little empty things...no point."

 

"...They called themselves the Empty Ones, for they saw themselves as worthless husks ready to be swept away by the Maker's hand. It is unknown what passed then, but over time, the Empty Ones grew to believe the Blight was to be the tool by which the Maker would end all creation. They preached it came from the Void, a place of nothing, and that returning to the Void was something to celebrate because it meant an end to all pain and suffering....There are tales of Empty Ones scouring the Deep Roads, searching for darkspawn, whom they saw as the Blight's prophets, in order to assist them in bringing about the next Blight."

 

So, yeah, they seem pretty delusional...but if the Empty Ones' beliefs are based on a grain of truth, and darkspawn really are creatures of the Void, then that could explain why Sera's codex entry makes special note of her violent hatred for them.


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#123
jeromefiefdom

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People seems to be overlooking a simple solution to how Sera could be Andruil. Unlike Flemeth who embraced her wisp, or Solas who is literally an old god, or Anders who merged with a spirit, Sera hasn't realized what she is. In a codex entry it is stated that Andruil lost her memories and that peace returned. What it doesn't mention is whether or not Andruil went back being her old self, or what the ¨peace¨ even was. So, my theory is thus: Sera is a vessel for an amnesiac Andruil that is influencing her behavior, while Sera retains her normal personality. Much like Keiran talks about having strange dreams and knowledge, it would appear that Sera has much the same abilities, just from a weaker entity. 


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#124
Violetbliss

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Honestly it's a fascinating theory, there are definitely enough parallells you could draw to make it true. I'm not sure myself, as some of those things like quiver within a quiver could mean she's simply now a follower of the inquisition. Also, her curiosity about the Chantry could either be just that or remnants from a past in religion, of sorts. 

 

I think it would be totally cool though, and that tarot card side by side comparison is just amazing. :D I think a good thing to keep in mind is like was said above, it can't be a coincidence that both Mythal and Fen'harel comes to the fore like this; I mean, the others ought to be out there as well in some form, unless they are truly dead or if the archdaemon theory is true. Though that still leaves some of them possibly freed.



#125
ctd757

ctd757
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I still hate Sera though she is annoying. Acts like elves are just stupid