27 réponses à ce sujet

[nuclearpengu1nn]

Hi, I'm trying to figure which spec I should go for my rouge. Which spec offers more dmg/dps? 

[Bhaal]

Look for older topics there are lot of discussion on this subject.

[Matth85]

Assassin

[EngineerEd]

Assassin offers the highest DPS, at least on single targets, of any class in the game.

 

Tempest has the best focus ability in the game and is the most survivable rogue with flask of frost and flask of lightning.

 

Arguably artificer has higher DPS than Tempest with a well built party (excluding thousand cuts exploits of course).

[zeypher]

Highest burst DPS is assassin, Highest sustainable damage IE skills is Artificer, you can literally just keep using skills one after other. Tempest is not something i liked.

[Celtic Latino]

I'd go Tempest. Flask of Frost helps ease some of the squishiness while it's upgrade allows you to act as an aggro/dodge tank

[Zenthar Aseth]

It depends entirely on what kind of enemies you're facing and how your gear is optimized.

 

Tempest generally offers the best damage in boss fights, thanks to TC. Tempest can also do more damage in trash mob encounters thanks to FoFrost and FoFire. FoL helps you kill a couple of enemies before they have the chance to do anything at all, thus making the encounter instantly easier.  FoFrost also lets you keep doing damage without the need to stealth or reposition, as does FoL, so there's very little downtime.

 

Assassin is actually less gear dependent, as you get autocrits when exiting stealth and also 50% AP. Hidden Blades lets you take down almost any single target very fast, especially when combined with MoD. It being a ranged attack shouldn't be underestimated either. So greater burst, if TC isn't taken into account, but sustained DPS can be less than Tempest, depending on encounter. 

 

Both are really good and capable of doing all the damage you'll ever need.

[TheInvoker]

Assassin is based on stealth and its CD

Since Stealth CD doesn't reset on kill made in stealth (i hope this is a bug) when you kill someone in stealth you have to wait the CD of stealth or kill someone else to reset it. 

This is not easy since assassins build critica/flank damage and not critical chance. So your sustained damage will be very low

But there is a good synergize between Mercy Killing (always crit vs stunned/sleeping enemies) and Pitch Grenade. Enemies will remain stunned for 10s! Not like 3s form sleep upgrade. Honestly i don't know what Comatose adds to Knockout bomb.

 

Assassin has big burst but DPS is not burst in my opinion. DPS is more sustained damage and tempest is better. I can't speak about artificer because i never tried

He can spam abilities more having a high critical chance but you also need much staming to spam them. It's not only about CD

[EngineerEd]

Well, you gain 10 stamina with every critical (twin fangs=2 hits=20 stamina, one auto attack animation=2 hits=20 stamina, flank attack=2 hits= 20 stamina).

 

I never find myself worrying about stamina as a DW Artificer. As long as you build up to 50% critical chance, which is very easy with t3 schematics, you get 100% critical chance from flanking position, and essentially you never run out of stamina unless you use death blow (still bugged, sadly).

 

DW Artificer has the highest sustained DPS from my experiences with the three specializations, unless you consider using bugged thousand cuts on 32 second cooldown (Flask of Fire cooldown) as a factor into DPS.

 

 

Also, Assassins don't have "very low" sustained damage. Lower than Tempest and Artificer, sure, but compared to any non-reaver warrior or any mage it's still very high.

[zeypher]

well mod, hidden blades, flank attack twin fangs generally get something to 50% then its deathblow time to finish them off. Even dragons, a well controlled max burst on a assassin will absolutely wreck a dragon without using any focus abilities.

[Slapstick83]

I regretted my choice of Tempest, simply because it adds abilities that don't do anything except allow you to use other offensive abilities, and you can only slot 8 abilities. Having 2-3 slots removed without adding anything in terms of offense/damage was unrewarding for me, allthough flask of fire was good. I haven't played assassin, so I can't really compare, but I found the lack of skill slots due to flask skills quite "bleh"

[TheInvoker]

Well, you gain 10 stamina with every critical (twin fangs=2 hits=20 stamina, one auto attack animation=2 hits=20 stamina, flank attack=2 hits= 20 stamina).

 

I never find myself worrying about stamina as a DW Artificer. As long as you build up to 50% critical chance, which is very easy with t3 schematics, you get 100% critical chance from flanking position, and essentially you never run out of stamina unless you use death blow (still bugged, sadly).

 

DW Artificer has the highest sustained DPS from my experiences with the three specializations, unless you consider using bugged thousand cuts on 32 second cooldown (Flask of Fire cooldown) as a factor into DPS.

 

 

Also, Assassins don't have "very low" sustained damage. Lower than Tempest and Artificer, sure, but compared to any non-reaver warrior or any mage it's still very high.

 

sure..because non reaver warriors are tanks and they are not supposed to do damage and mages are more into CC and if they do damge is more AoE damage not single target

And it's not only about "who has the best damage numbers"..but also how easy is to that damage.

Tempest has a very nice kit with flask of fire that lets you spam abilities with no CD and no cost and then flask of lighting that lets you perform about 10 attacks in the same time artificers can attack only once.

 

Bioware wasted a good chance to bring back a good character based on traps. I remember how fun it was in baldur's gate to set many traps in a place and then bring enemies in that place.I killed many dragons with this tactic.

Now i can place 1 single trap and the damage is low too. i can't kill even weakest enemies with a trap.

[Zenthar Aseth]

I regretted my choice of Tempest, simply because it adds abilities that don't do anything except allow you to use other offensive abilities, and you can only slot 8 abilities. Having 2-3 slots removed without adding anything in terms of offense/damage was unrewarding for me, allthough flask of fire was good. I haven't played assassin, so I can't really compare, but I found the lack of skill slots due to flask skills quite "bleh"

That's my biggest problem with Tempest. Have to leave out so many skills I'd like.

 

Have to choose between DB and SS. Can't take Evade -- which isn't strictly necessary, but it's really fun and useful. On a Tempest, I use FA and Flask of Frost to do the job of Evade. And forget about anything "extra", like Spinning Blades or Throwing Knives. 

 

10 slots would be so much better.

[EngineerEd]

Not going to get into a pissing match over highest DPS once again because it's been debated to death and it bears no interest to me.

 

I do agree that DAI missed the chance to create a trap-based class in Artificer instead just creating a ability-spam happy class so long as you get to the magical 50% critical chance.

[TheInvoker]

That's my biggest problem with Tempest. Have to leave out so many skills I'd like.

 

Have to choose between DB and SS. Can't take Evade -- which isn't strictly necessary, but it's really fun and useful. On a Tempest, I use FA and Flask of Frost to do the job of Evade. And forget about anything "extra", like Spinning Blades or Throwing Knives. 

 

10 slots would be so much better.

 

i didn't have any problem to take talents for tempest

tempest has 3 active talents like all other specializations

[zeypher]

All specializations have 3 active abilities.

[EngineerEd]

Tempest has 3 very useful active abilities though. Knockout Bomb takes a backseat to (oddly similarly named) Knockout Powder if you want a sleep ability, and Spike Trap just isn't very useful at all.

[Slapstick83]

Tempest has 3 very useful active abilities though. Knockout Bomb takes a backseat to (oddly similarly named) Knockout Powder if you want a sleep ability, and Spike Trap just isn't very useful at all.

 

I agree their usefull, very much so. However at the end of the day, I'm still only left with 5 slots for abilities that affect my enemy or myself in any meaningfull way. Flask of fire? Yeah, I can use other abilities a lot. Flask of frost? Yeah, I can stay in melee and use other abilities without fearing for my life much. Flask of Lightning? Yeah, I can use other abilities while enemies are locked in place. Useful? Yes! Fun? Well I have to rule out a bit of my arsenal, and instead I would have liked to have more in it. Not less. My 2 cents

[EngineerEd]

I agree completely, I didn't really mean anything by it, just pointing it out that none of the other classes use at least one of their abilities (many Artificers don't even use elemental mines).

[TheInvoker]

I agree their usefull, very much so. However at the end of the day, I'm still only left with 5 slots for abilities that affect my enemy or myself in any meaningfull way. Flask of fire? Yeah, I can use other abilities a lot. Flask of frost? Yeah, I can stay in melee and use other abilities without fearing for my life much. Flask of Lightning? Yeah, I can use other abilities while enemies are locked in place. Useful? Yes! Fun? Well I have to rule out a bit of my arsenal, and instead I would have liked to have more in it. Not less. My 2 cents

i don't understand your problem

i could say: stealth?? yes and i can go flanking an enemy with other abilties or

knockout powder?? yes and i can attack sleeping enemies with other abilities

 

if you don't understand what flasks do,tempest is not for you

you use basic attacks a lot! after using flask of lighting you will ONLY use basic attacks for more DPS since abilities' animations are not the best.

you just like to press a button and see damage and only damage because you used an ability.

[Zenthar Aseth]

i didn't have any problem to take talents for tempest

tempest has 3 active talents like all other specializations

Tempest has: 3 flasks, 1 Focus ability. It'd be stupid to skip any of those.

For Assassin, you take Hidden Blades and MoD. KB is optional. HB in itself is an active, damage-dealing ability. Tempest only gets one in the form of TC, which is a focus ability.

 

So only two "essential" things for Assassin, four for Tempest.

[TheInvoker]

Tempest has: 3 flasks, 1 Focus ability. It'd be stupid to skip any of those.

For Assassin, you take Hidden Blades and MoD. KB is optional. HB in itself is an active, damage-dealing ability. Tempest only gets one in the form of TC, which is a focus ability.

 

So only two "essential" things for Assassin, four for Tempest.

are you joking or what??

Taking or not knockout bomb is YOUR choice. You can choose to not use a flask,and if you say "i can't because they are so good!" you are kidding me because you can't say "tempest is bad because it has so many good abilties that doesn't allow me to pick other abilities from dual daggers/subterfuge"

Just choose the best 8

you know you have to give up some and it's not important in which tree they are.

[Zenthar Aseth]

are you joking or what??

Taking or not knockout bomb is YOUR choice. You can choose to not use a flask,and if you say "i can't because they are so good!" you are kidding me because you can't say "tempest is bad because it has so many good abilties that doesn't allow me to pick other abilities from dual daggers/subterfuge"

Just choose the best 8

you know you have to give up some and it's not important in which tree they are.

Do you have problems with reading comprehension? I said that KB is optional, and doesn't make or break the Assassin class. You can choose not to bring a flask, but that would be stupid, because then you might as well go Assassin. You need all the flasks if you want the most out of your Tempest. You do not need KB to get the most out of your Assassin.

 

And where did I say Tempest is bad? Again, do you even understand what you're reading?

[TheInvoker]

ok so not taking a flask is stupid but not taking an assassin's ability is not.....oooooook

[Zenthar Aseth]

ok so not taking a flask is stupid but not taking an assassin's ability is not.....oooooook

Because all abilities are not born equal. How is this a hard concept to understand? Or are you of the opinion that BioWare's balance team succeeded in something no one else has ever done, and made a perfectly balanced game, where every class and every ability is precisely as good and completely balanced? Not only that, but created every class with just as many passives that do exactly the same things, and all the active abilities do the same thing... oh wait, right, that would completely ruin the point of specializations and classes.

 

To try and go half-speed so you can keep up, let me explain: Assassin is what it is (a really good specialization) because of two abilities: MoD and Hidden Blades, and three passives, IWNH, KITS and GITA. Tempest is what it is (a really good specialization) because of its active abilities, the flasks and the Focus ability.