76 réponses à ce sujet

[Sylvius the Mad]

Many of DAI's quests involve walking to a marked spot on the map to retrieve an object.

What if there wasn't any such marker?

Imagine how much more engaging a quest like Memories of the Grey would be if, instead of being shown the locations on the map, we instead had to question people about what they'd seen and piece together the clues.

[Thiefy]

Hell no. It was bad enough trying to find the elfroots and minerals with the search function prior to the patch that let their dots show up on the map.

 

So glad they put that in there. (Thanks Bioware)

[ShadowStrider 7]

I'd say (with an educated guess) that most of the flaws in this game are due to the fact of the Multi console release. The graphics are worse than I expected and seem to have been dumbed down. Menus were not well thought out and quests were not well thought out. This could have been game of the year had it not been for the fact that they developed it for too many consoles. A game of this scale should have been "next gen consoles" and PC only. 360 and PS3 are the past.

Back on topic: I agree with your post. Not having quest markers for some of the quests would have presented a challenge that many would have enjoyed.

[In Exile]

Many of DAI's quests involve walking to a marked spot on the map to retrieve an object.

What if there wasn't any such marker?

Imagine how much more engaging a quest like Memories of the Grey would be if, instead of beong shown the locations on the map, we instead had to question people about what they'd seen and piece together the clues.

I agree. I would still leave it in as an optional toggle (the dreaded word) that triggers when you've gathered all clues.

I do like it, however. Finding areas using the map (Western Approach!) was a highlight.

[RShara]

I might just cut my throat right away if there weren't quest markers.  I'd never be able to find anything and just be wandering the map going wtfwtfwtf

[Ryzaki]

If there was no markers I'd returned the game.

 

If people don't want them there should always be the option to tog them off. But if they weren't there this game could blow raspberries.

[DaemionMoadrin]

The current quest design relies heavily on the markers, without them you'd be screwed. To remove the markers you have to design the quests differently, similiar to BG1/BG2.

I would like that. It is currently impossible though because the majority of gamers doesn't want to find clues and puzzle out the location.

[Sylvius the Mad]

The current quest design relies heavily on the markers, without them you'd be screwed. To remove the markers you have to design the quests differently, similiar to BG1/BG2.

Which is why I'm not merely asking for the ability to turn them off.

We could turn them off in DAO, and I can think of only one quest that didn't work without them (Crosscut Drifters).

We could turn them off in DA2, and the levels were so small and linear that it didn't matter.

But we should be able to turn them off, and the quest design should allow that to be a viable playstyle.

[dekarserverbot]

The current quest design relies heavily on the markers, without them you'd be screwed. To remove the markers you have to design the quests differently, similiar to BG1/BG2.

I would like that. It is currently impossible though because the majority of gamers doesn't want to find clues and puzzle out the location.

 

so once again we have to suffer because those lazy jerks? I'm tired of games being dumbed down, tutorial heavy and easy button mashers (God of War anyone). Games should be hard, challenging and immersive, not just baby's food

[DaemionMoadrin]

so once again we have to suffer because those lazy jerks? I'm tired of games being dumbed down, tutorial heavy and easy button mashers (God of War anyone). Games should be hard, challenging and immersive, not just baby's food

 

We're in the minority here.

 

A long, long time ago, when I played DAoC, the quests there consisted of talking to NPCs who pretty much told you a short story. You then had to read it, understand it and extract the necessary information. For example: Meet the ghost next to the fallen tree by the lake. There was no quest marker, there wasn't even a map. You had to explore the zone, find the lake, then run around it until you found a fallen tree... and of course, there was no ghost, because it only spawns there at night.

I liked those kinds of quests because you had to think.

 

Then came WoW and one of the first quests I got during the beta was: Go and kill 10 wolves. There were a few lines about needing the pelts and that was it. Not only did I have a map, a mini map and a quest marker. I also had an arrow which always pointed in the direction of the wolves and a path marked before me. To me this felt like someone chewing my food for me.

I definitely don't like those kinds of quests because all that's left for me are the simple mechanics of running there, killing stuff, looting and running back. And that gets boring real quick.

[Captain_Obvious]

No i definitely prefer quest markers.  In ME3, they had a bunch of fedex quests that didn't say anything other than "search for x in x".  The journal didn't update to confirm you had collected it or provide any other info.  So, I made a paper journal to keep track of where I searched, those that I had collected, when i had found them, who to take them back to.  All of that is fine and dandy, but does not make sense when integrated with a video game.  I'm saving the galaxy, and have to check my handwritten notes to see if I found the Rings of Alune or which planets I searched before reapers drove me out of the system?  It was silly, and it did not complement the dynamic the game established.  I think playing private detective inquisitor doesn't fit this type of game.  

 

Games I like should be fun, engaging, and creative.  So far, DAI fits the bill for me.  I don't like "hard" games.  I play games to have fun.  Once it's hard, it's work, and I'm not going to waste time working at a video game.  

[Elsariel]

so once again we have to suffer because those lazy jerks? I'm tired of games being dumbed down, tutorial heavy and easy button mashers (God of War anyone). Games should be hard, challenging and immersive, not just baby's food

Games should be enjoyable. That means different things to different people. For example, I'm not into hard challenging combat but I do like immersion and story. I don't hate combat, but I don't care for it to be time consuming or hard to the point of irritation.

But that's just me and I fully realize others have different preferences. So, I'm in full support of a quest marker toggle. Choices for game play style are always good in my book.

[Octarin]

I'd say (with an educated guess) that most of the flaws in this game are due to the fact of the Multi console release. The graphics are worse than I expected and seem to have been dumbed down. Menus were not well thought out and quests were not well thought out. This could have been game of the year had it not been for the fact that they developed it for too many consoles. A game of this scale should have been "next gen consoles" and PC only. 360 and PS3 are the past.

Back on topic: I agree with your post. Not having quest markers for some of the quests would have presented a challenge that many would have enjoyed.

 

You will find that the majority of old gen console players who are having issues with the game agree with you completely. It shouldn't have been released on old gens. We could have waited. It would have been better than having a shite game and everybody blaming old gen console players for it. 

[Martanek]

If there was no markers I'd returned the game.

 

If people don't want them there should always be the option to tog them off. But if they weren't there this game could blow raspberries.

 

You a console kiddie? Too lazy to strain your brain, collect pieces of information and put them together? OMG. How far will current console RPG's go as to dumbing down their gameplay? Have we hit the ceiling yet? Too many questions at once with a simple answer to them:

Dragon Age:I: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ 

Dragon Age 4: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Dragon Age 5: Mass Effect: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

 

Yeah, I hate quest markers, they are a scourge of these so-called modern action RPG's (aka quest marker-based aRPG's). But hey, maybe I am just gettin' old and an old gaming generation has been replaced with a new one when I wasn't looking. 

[Ryzaki]

*facepalms*

[AlexMBrennan]

Have you seen this game's maps? They are kind on the huge side, so forgive me by not wanting to spend days to comb one of them to find a bunch of grey warden letters - the only item that stands out a little bit is the banners you can get for skyhold, the rest would be looking through a pile of rubble for a specific pebble.

[KBomb]

You a console kiddie? Too lazy to strain your brain, collect pieces of information and put them together? OMG. How far will current console RPG's go as to dumbing down their gameplay? Have we hit the ceiling yet? Too many questions at once with a simple answer to them:
Dragon Age:I: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Dragon Age 4: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Dragon Age 5: Mass Effect: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

Yeah, I hate quest markers, they are a scourge of these so-called modern action RPG's (aka quest marker-based aRPG's). But hey, maybe I am just gettin' old and an old gaming generation has been replaced with a new one when I wasn't looking.

Maybe you should step down from your soap box and realize that not everyone has the same level of expectations when it comes to enjoyment.

I am certainly for options and toggles, but to insult others for not wanting to spend countless hours playing "Where's Waldo" is just ridiculous. Playing without markers does not a genius make. It is more about patience and priorities. If you wish to spend two hours scanning an immense forest for a bottle of wine, then great. Toggle that **** off and call it a day, but don't pretend you're smarter than those who have kids to care for, school work to complete or a social life to maintain and would rather not waste time.

[Thiefy]

Lol at the kiddos who think that wanting quest markers = lazy gamer.

 

It must be because I'm a WoW player and can't stand a challenge, right? 

 

I like challenges just fine, and I've still got my original copies of Space Quest and Kings Quest on 3½ floppy A disks. I played the crap out of them as a kid without this thing called 'google' and beat them just fine.

 

The difference between this specific game and the games you "real gamers" are referring to is the sheer size and immensity of it all. The world is HUGE, the items in question are generally tiny as crap. You just end up spending literal hours upon hours circling an area looking for something. You might consider that fun but I consider it a waste of time.

 

It doesn't remove 'the challenge' from the game, it cuts the bull**** out.

 

Oh yeah, and then theres the fact that the quests with the giant purple areas around quest markers already do that. So kind of a moot point since they have both quest types in game.

[Darkly Tranquil]

They would need to redesign the quests to do it (and there would be far fewer of them since each one would require more development and take a lot longer to complete). It...might actually be an improvement over the 101 generic fetch quests we have now. Hard to say, depends how they implemented it.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Have you seen this game's maps? They are kind on the huge side, so forgive me by not wanting to spend days to comb one of them to find a bunch of grey warden letters - the only item that stands out a little bit is the banners you can get for skyhold, the rest would be looking through a pile of rubble for a specific pebble.

You do realise that without the quest markers we'd be given better instructions, right?

Instead of just telling us there are two in the Fallow Mire, it should tell us where we might find someone who might have more information. And that person could give us more clues, or maybe that person will be dead and we'll go through his belongings for clues. Or maybe it's a trap, and this guy's information will be unreliable.

I'm describing a situation wherein the quest is deeper and more engaging, not just one in which we get the same shallow quest with vital information denied us.

[TheJediSaint]

I never leave Skyhold without my GPS.

[RShara]

You do realise that without the quest markers we'd be given better instructions, right?

Instead of just telling us there are two in the Fallow Mire, it should tell us where we might find someone who might have more information. And that person could give us more clues, or maybe that person will be dead and we'll go through his belongings for clues. Or maybe it's a trap, and this guy's information will be unreliable.

I'm describing a situation wherein the quest is deeper and more engaging, not just one in which we get the same shallow quest with vital information denied us.

 

That's not what the OP is asking for.  He's talking current game, with no quest markers.

[Ryzaki]

That's not what the OP is asking for.  He's talking current game, with no quest markers.

 

Sylv is the OP.

 

You do realise that without the quest markers we'd be given better instructions, right?

Instead of just telling us there are two in the Fallow Mire, it should tell us where we might find someone who might have more information. And that person could give us more clues, or maybe that person will be dead and we'll go through his belongings for clues. Or maybe it's a trap, and this guy's information will be unreliable.

I'm describing a situation wherein the quest is deeper and more engaging, not just one in which we get the same shallow quest with vital information denied us.

 

And some people don't want to have to dig all around a large map looking for the two trees the amulet was left by. Some of us don't find that fun.

 

That said quest markers being toggable is fine. But gone completely? No thank you.

[Thiefy]

You do realise that without the quest markers we'd be given better instructions, right?

Instead of just telling us there are two in the Fallow Mire, it should tell us where we might find someone who might have more information. And that person could give us more clues, or maybe that person will be dead and we'll go through his belongings for clues. Or maybe it's a trap, and this guy's information will be unreliable.

I'm describing a situation wherein the quest is deeper and more engaging, not just one in which we get the same shallow quest with vital information denied us.

You should probably reword your initial post then. Right now it reads that 'quest markers make it too easy and everything else is fine otherwise', as opposed to 'the quests should be reworked to be more engaging and interactive'. i.e. less collect the shards/bear hides and more like the mini story arcs in DA:O.