29 réponses à ce sujet

[robertthebard]

So I was plinking around in some caves on the Storm Coast this morning, and suddenly found myself all alone against 5 or 6 spiders on my rogue. I go to the tactical cam so I can see what's going on, and my party decided that the best way to help me was to huddle in a corner hiding? I don't recall having this issue previous to the last patch, and I've been through the area twice before, although I do remember them getting stuck at a ladder once. Even taking control of each party member and attempting to move them to where the combat was actually at resulted in my PC moving to where the NPCs were hiding. It's going to make getting through these caves extremely interesting, and some of the later quests will indeed involve going through them.

[Feranel]

Any terrain where you have to even do moderate platforming to pass your party will just sit there with their thumbs up their butts.  That cave in particular has multiple parts where you need to jump over a rock to pass, and there is no way to get through without doing that. Therefore, your party will stand way back and watch you get slaughtered by spiders.  It's been like that for me on every toon since release.

 

Have fun!

[robertthebard]

Yeah, Nightmare is supposed to be hard, and for the record, I didn't get killed, since when I switched to try to get them, it seemed like my PC just teleported to them, which ended the combat. I even tried "pulling" the spiders to the group, to no avail. Wound up just using the quick travel to the camp, and coming here to see what's up.

[Spitfire]

I'll inject my opinion quite honestly and bluntly - the ai in DA:I is NOT at a AAA release quality. It really is that simple.  They are both predictably AND unpredictably awful at the same time, not to mention that their constant fidgeting ouside of combat was enough to give me a nervous facial tic.  I've been in standby mode for almost a month hoping that Bioware will release that 'miracle' patch.

[In Exile]

So I was plinking around in some caves on the Storm Coast this morning, and suddenly found myself all alone against 5 or 6 spiders on my rogue. I go to the tactical cam so I can see what's going on, and my party decided that the best way to help me was to huddle in a corner hiding? I don't recall having this issue previous to the last patch, and I've been through the area twice before, although I do remember them getting stuck at a ladder once. Even taking control of each party member and attempting to move them to where the combat was actually at resulted in my PC moving to where the NPCs were hiding. It's going to make getting through these caves extremely interesting, and some of the later quests will indeed involve going through them.

It's elevation. The camera goes insane when it has to deal with it. Same with the pathfinding.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Forbidden Oasis is terrible for this. I was trying to close a rift at the bottom of a hole, and my characters kept running out of the cave and resetting the rift. I must have killed that Rage Demon 6 times.

[Sartoz]

So I was plinking around in some caves on the Storm Coast this morning, and suddenly found myself all alone against 5 or 6 spiders on my rogue. I go to the tactical cam so I can see what's going on, and my party decided that the best way to help me was to huddle in a corner hiding? I don't recall having this issue previous to the last patch, and I've been through the area twice before, although I do remember them getting stuck at a ladder once. Even taking control of each party member and attempting to move them to where the combat was actually at resulted in my PC moving to where the NPCs were hiding. It's going to make getting through these caves extremely interesting, and some of the later quests will indeed involve going through them.

LOL!!

Been there.... pathfinding in this game is more difficult because of the jump feature.  That cave in the Storm Coast is a perfect example of different pathing levels because when you jump on a rock you are effectively on the second floor or sometimes 3rd.

[Octarin]

I'll inject my opinion quite honestly and bluntly - the ai in DA:I is NOT at a AAA release quality. It really is that simple.  They are both predictably AND unpredictably awful at the same time, not to mention that their constant fidgeting ouside of combat was enough to give me a nervous facial tic.  I've been in standby mode for almost a month hoping that Bioware will release that 'miracle' patch.

 

You sir just made me laugh so hard, I woke up the cats in the other room! 

[AlexMBrennan]

It's going to make getting through these caves extremely interesting, and some of the later quests will indeed involve going through them.

Not really - you can go around, and never have to take the ladder that broke the AI in this case at all.

[robertthebard]

Not really - you can go around, and never have to take the ladder that broke the AI in this case at all.

Some of the quests actually involve going into the caves. While I can skip the majority, that doesn't change the fact that the path finding for the party is abysmal, which is the point of the post. There's also the problem that, despite there being two ladders in this particular cave, the issue I'm discussing is actually between them, and not on them. My reference to the ladder in the OP is in regard to running into that issue once on one of my other playthroughs, where I likely did just go around, after I figured out that the NPCs weren't going to be able to solve the riddle of the ladder.

[DarkAmaranth1966]

Jump over a pebble in the Hinterlands and you loose your party. I don't even try those caves until I have my KE specs and at least have spirit blade - best way for my mage to be ranged and melee both and, you do need to be both when you have to solo all those spiders and, a couple of deep stalkers. Eventually your mates do teleport to you, but that's after you kill all the spiders and deepstalkers.

 

I know it's AI pathing being wonky but, I pretend it's my mates telling em "Uh uh, no way Boss, we aren't going in there." then, deciding five minutes later "Oh, alright if you insist."

[devSin]

I'm pretty sure the cave you're referring to is broken. It's a problem with the level more than the pathfinding.

In general, the characters should be pretty good about keeping close to you, but they can't make height transitions (not on purpose, anyway), so if the only way to get somewhere is by jumping, they're not going to be able to follow. They can use ladders, however, and they move very quickly if they can find an alternate path, so they shouldn't ever be too far away (and they'll teleport beyond a certain distance).

[AlexMBrennan]

Some of the quests actually involve going into the caves. While I can skip the majority, that doesn't change the fact that the path finding for the party is abysmal, which is the point of the post. There's also the problem that, despite there being two ladders in this particular cave, the issue I'm discussing is actually between them, and not on them. My reference to the ladder in the OP is in regard to running into that issue once on one of my other playthroughs, where I likely did just go around, after I figured out that the NPCs weren't going to be able to solve the riddle of the ladder.

Going into the cave, yes; going through the cave (which requires using the ladder), no. You can get to the darkspawn quest location by using the north cave entrance without using the ladder. 

[robertthebard]

Going into the cave, yes; going through the cave (which requires using the ladder), no. You can get to the darkspawn quest location by using the north cave entrance without using the ladder.

The problem I ran into is that the corridor makes a sort of Y shape, with the right arm curving around behind the wall where the left arm dead ends. Instead of coming around the corner, they go to the dead end and hang out. No matter how I tried to manually negotiate it, that's what I ended up with. After the last time that I got boxed in, I just 'ported out. The hard part of Nightmare isn't supposed to be getting your party involved in the fights.

[devSin]

The problem I ran into is that the corridor makes a sort of Y shape, with the right arm curving around behind the wall where the left arm dead ends. Instead of coming around the corner, they go to the dead end and hang out. No matter how I tried to manually negotiate it, that's what I ended up with. After the last time that I got boxed in, I just 'ported out. The hard part of Nightmare isn't supposed to be getting your party involved in the fights.

You'll note that the spiders can't even find their way around the wall (the party and the spiders can actually hit each other through the wall if you let them fidget long enough). You have to manually move everyone to the other side of the cave (which is not easy to do until the spiders are dead). One of the entrances is also broken (you'll notice your party will get to the entrance and then just stop there).

It's a broken walk mesh (whatever data allows the engine to determine passable terrain isn't correct in this cave).

[Jazharah]

There's pathfinding or navmesh in this game!? O.o

I can't say I noticed...

/sarcasm

[Brogan]

Any terrain where you have to even do moderate platforming to pass your party will just sit there with their thumbs up their butts.  That cave in particular has multiple parts where you need to jump over a rock to pass, and there is no way to get through without doing that. Therefore, your party will stand way back and watch you get slaughtered by spiders.  It's been like that for me on every toon since release.

 

lol

 

and this after 3+ years of coding... 

 

What happened to this company?

[Feranel]

lol

 

and this after 3+ years of coding... 

 

What happened to this company?

 

Well, you never had platforming in any previous DA game, you couldn't jump.

[robertthebard]

Irony is defined as: Posting a topic about getting my party stuck in a cave, forgetting which cave it was, and then going in the next day and clearing it with no problem... Evidently, my party was just drunk yesterday.

[Etragorn]

Well, you never had platforming in any previous DA game, you couldn't jump.

And this was not a bad thing.

[Feranel]

And this was not a bad thing.

 

Not gonna argue that point, I kinda agree, mostly because it took me a while to mentally remap the "pause combat" key in my brain. 

[Gileadan]

Handling ground elevation is apparently a classic Frostbite 3 weakness, since I remember its presence in several Battlefield games which used different iterations of Frostbite. Even in BF4, a three-inch piece of debris on the ground can force you to jump or get stuck on it. DICE will supposedly patch it... some time... soon <tm>.

[JediMB]

Both pathfinding and rubberbanding/teleportation between party members are pretty huge issues in the game that seriously affect the tactical combat aspects.

 

Companions will often either fail to attack an enemy because they don't realize they have a clear line of sight, or they will ignore a Hold Position order and bounce straight up in a dragon's face.

 

Also, I often find myself getting teleported off cliffs (or even just slightly elevated parts of the floor in caves) as I activate an AoE ability to launch a surprise attack against an enemy group.

[Blade_RJ]

Any terrain where you have to even do moderate platforming to pass your party will just sit there with their thumbs up their butts.  That cave in particular has multiple parts where you need to jump over a rock to pass, and there is no way to get through without doing that. Therefore, your party will stand way back and watch you get slaughtered by spiders.  It's been like that for me on every toon since release.

 

Have fun!

 

Not really true, i didnt notice if it changed after patch, but vannilla game, i always had the AI team jump over stuff to get to me, like barrels, fences and some moderated elevation terrain.sometimes it was funnit cos i would see cassandra vault like a olympic atlete just so she could follow me

[Wompoo]

Same, or you get to a point turn around and find you only have 2 of 3 companions with you (the other has had an AI melt down and stopped functioning and stopped pathfinding)... if you click on it, hell there you are tele-porting half way across the map (who did the pathing/AI? Bethesda). If not that, for some reason they'll just huddle and ignore commands to attack even cuing an ability will see them go derrrr. Mobs will even port from one location to another or rubber band during a fight (and no these mobs have zero teleport skills), so bad pathfinding is not just restricted to the PC's companions ... seriously I need DA:O's tactics menu and select all returned, AI is painful at times or just plain poor.