86 réponses à ce sujet

[rubynorman]

The only part of the whole soft/hard Leliana is that it shouldnt need be so ridiculous -- she was a BARD. Princess stabbity shouldn't be made hard or soft over ANY flipping *singular* choice this late in the game.  And if she is THAT wishy washy that she can't make a proper and ethical decision on her own, even within bardic rules of ethical on bardic terms, without going all mental?  She does NOT deserve to be ANY kind of Divine.  Besides that, I am still kind of pissed off that she wouldn't listen to me about Felix. I should have had the choice to send her packing when she decided to defy my direct order to leave Felix alone.  I was pretty much pro-Leliana since DAO but that sort of one-track-but-only-her-track mindset is a dangerous one, especially for someone in power.  After seeing that I should have been able to relieve her of duty.   I was actually so pissed off I walked away from my computer yelling at my husband about her.  LOL     In previous templar playthroughs I got a "hardened" Leliana despite always trying to buffer her and keep her straight, and I am 99% sure I spared the traitor also.   I have no idea what decision made her so ruthless in that playthrough. This one I often get options to treat her like a deviant kindergartener "No Killing. Goooooood Bard." but that one I just tried to be moderate and make the most responsible decisions for the inquisition.  *shrugs*   I am hoping for a softer Leliana this time around but despite my best efforts, I feel like I am babysitting a not incredibly intelligent serial killer as opposed to an extremely clever and cunning bard.

 

Wow, do you look at her face on that quest? Please think about how they have tortured her what she has endured for 2 years, I wouldn't stay the same if I were her. She's a human, not a rock.

 

Spoiler

[AnImpossibleGirl]

I actually kind of like Leliana as ruthless murdering psychopath. It's a nice change from the chantry sister my warden picked up in Lothering.

Just don't let her be divine.

 

 

I take it back. Let her be divine. Seems like that's what Thedas needs right now.

 

Don't take it back lol she's terrifying, I like it--don't get me wrong but not as Divine.

[CoM Solaufein]

Since my character in this game is cold and ruthless, those beneath her must be also. If Leliana wants to play the part of a spymaster than she needs to harden her heart and make the tough choices.

[I WANT YOU TO FUCK ME JERY]

Less crazy?
 
Hardened Leliana in DA:I has never been more sane or honest about herself.

Explains why Cole says she has violent, traumatic nightmares on the hardened path...

[Cratto]

Two play throughs.

 

First is with a softened Leliana (by a generally good inquisitor) and the second she's hardened (not an evil inquisitor but being Dalish cares less).

 

Hardened Leliana is a little scary and it makes when she talks about the HoF much sadder. As (head cannon) it gives the impression that the HoF is the only bright thing left.

 

Also I think my Inquisitor in this play through will be in trouble with my HoF because of it (more so than her banishment of the Wardens).

 

You'd think though that hardened is what she'd most likely become.

 

Though I think softened Leliana is probably more effective in her role (the war table missions don't change whether she's hard or soft so) she's still willing to use blackmail, assassinations and the rest when needed. But its not the first and only response.

 

In any case, as my HoF survived - I work hard to make Leliana not Divine - they deserve their happy ever after. 

[NotBeouwulf]

The only part of the whole soft/hard Leliana is that it shouldnt need be so ridiculous -- she was a BARD. Princess stabbity shouldn't be made hard or soft over ANY flipping *singular* choice this late in the game. And if she is THAT wishy washy that she can't make a proper and ethical decision on her own, even within bardic rules of ethical on bardic terms, without going all mental? She does NOT deserve to be ANY kind of Divine. Besides that, I am still kind of pissed off that she wouldn't listen to me about Felix. I should have had the choice to send her packing when she decided to defy my direct order to leave Felix alone. I was pretty much pro-Leliana since DAO but that sort of one-track-but-only-her-track mindset is a dangerous one, especially for someone in power. After seeing that I should have been able to relieve her of duty. I was actually so pissed off I walked away from my computer yelling at my husband about her. LOL In previous templar playthroughs I got a "hardened" Leliana despite always trying to buffer her and keep her straight, and I am 99% sure I spared the traitor also. I have no idea what decision made her so ruthless in that playthrough. This one I often get options to treat her like a deviant kindergartener "No Killing. Goooooood Bard." but that one I just tried to be moderate and make the most responsible decisions for the inquisition. *shrugs* I am hoping for a softer Leliana this time around but despite my best efforts, I feel like I am babysitting a not incredibly intelligent serial killer as opposed to an extremely clever and cunning bard.

So you want to kick her out because an alternate timeline version of her that will never exist disobeyed an order?

And by the way at that time she outranked you. You were not in charge of the inquisition till after Haven. She wasn't even being insubordinate.

This site is pretty ridiculous

[line_genrou]

I actually kind of like Leliana as ruthless murdering psychopath. It's a nice change from the chantry sister my warden picked up in Lothering.

Just don't let her be divine.

The only thing I find interesting in this outcome is that Morrigan who was "the cold ******" in DA:O learned how to love while Leliana who was so friendly became ruthless.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Explains why Cole says she has violent, traumatic nightmares on the hardened path...

 

Because that is what she has always been! What she has always felt like!

[Kage]

Leliana has to end being ruthless and a little crazy, it just makes sense and its the most appropiate outcome.

It does not make any sense to forgive Butler, not protecting scouts so much, etc. The sister could be spared yeah, but oh well.

 

After all she's been through, and after being the left hand AND the spymaster of the Inquisition... What did you expect? To be all rainbows and sugar candy?

 

Leliana is very well written, and her growth is really interesting and believable.

[_Aine_]

I have to give them kudos on her though, despite how she was in two of my playthroughs so far (I am thinking my Keep saves may influence this somewhat?) I just watched a friends playthrough and it is a TOTALLY different Leliana.  I'm going to NOT load my Keep saves next time and see what happens.  

 

And, as for feeling sorry for her: Of course I feel empathy, as a human being.  In my own current life I have not had an easy one myself, and perhaps that is exactly why I expect *more* from her, not less.  It is also why I don't PITY here, she would resent being treated as a victim with kid gloves.  The old Leliana would *want* you to take her to task because she also had high standards for herself.  BUT, professionally, not personally: Cullen had the fortitude to create a "fail-safe" remove from power situation if he lost it while on our mission.  Leliana should have had the same.  It isn't about insubordination, it is acting rashly as an *individual* instead of as a team member.   Flashes of rage, even well intentioned, can undue a LOT of sensitive and cumulative work that you could work on for a long time to undo.  As a bard, she should be aware of this. MONTHS and even years setting up the perfect foil.  You have to be able to show restraint.  Be willing to kill yes, but also be willing to stay your hand.   She did not lash out at the subject of the crime at all, instead the son. An act meant to punish and antagonize without any positive effect for the Inquisition whatsoever.   She said it herself "Noone is innocent", so why should she be free from her own assessment?   To me, this means she would willingly accept her own lack of innocence in this decision made by her.   She would likely stand by it also, as she is free to do.  In fact, I would *expect* her to.  That does *not* mean my fem Inq would think it was the just action with the info they had before them.  Understandable? Absolutely.  Appreciated, not at all.  I had Dorian with me, and that was his friend.  Where would my *own* empathy be, ignoring that fact and acting so rashly?   

 

Given what I just saw of a friends save (about mid way in) I was shocked at how different. Right down to the tone of voice. She was a cold, cold woman in mine.  VA did a fine job.  

[dekarserverbot]

I rather like hardened Leliana, and am tempted to make her Divine in my canon playthrough, because the Chantry kinda does need a bit of cleaning. She's like an angel of death, and the best part is that she's totally on your side.

 

ANDERS TO THE RESCUE!

[rubynorman]

I have to give them kudos on her though, despite how she was in two of my playthroughs so far (I am thinking my Keep saves may influence this somewhat?) I just watched a friends playthrough and it is a TOTALLY different Leliana.  I'm going to NOT load my Keep saves next time and see what happens.  

 

And, as for feeling sorry for her: Of course I feel empathy, as a human being.  In my own current life I have not had an easy one myself, and perhaps that is exactly why I expect *more* from her, not less.  It is also why I don't PITY here, she would resent being treated as a victim with kid gloves.  The old Leliana would *want* you to take her to task because she also had high standards for herself.  BUT, professionally, not personally: Cullen had the fortitude to create a "fail-safe" remove from power situation if he lost it while on our mission.  Leliana should have had the same.  It isn't about insubordination, it is acting rashly as an *individual* instead of as a team member.   Flashes of rage, even well intentioned, can undue a LOT of sensitive and cumulative work that you could work on for a long time to undo.  As a bard, she should be aware of this. MONTHS and even years setting up the perfect foil.  You have to be able to show restraint.  Be willing to kill yes, but also be willing to stay your hand.   She did not lash out at the subject of the crime at all, instead the son. An act meant to punish and antagonize without any positive effect for the Inquisition whatsoever.   She said it herself "Noone is innocent", so why should she be free from her own assessment?   To me, this means she would willingly accept her own lack of innocence in this decision made by her.   She would likely stand by it also, as she is free to do.  In fact, I would *expect* her to.  That does *not* mean my fem Inq would think it was the just action with the info they had before them.  Understandable? Absolutely.  Appreciated, not at all.  I had Dorian with me, and that was his friend.  Where would my *own* empathy be, ignoring that fact and acting so rashly?  

 

Given what I just saw of a friends save (about mid way in) I was shocked at how different. Right down to the tone of voice. She was a cold, cold woman in mine.  VA did a fine job.  

That man isn't Felix anymore but a husk. He never wanted to be a husk. She's putting him out of his misery. You're mad at her because she can't make decisions on her own. She did make them, but you have the choice to stop her and guide her to a less violent path. And the only time in an unreal future, you can't interrupt her decision, you have a big problem with her. That's a bit contradictory, isn't it?

 

Also, Not Beouwulf made a valid point. She was outranked you in that situation; and the situation itself has never exited except in the memory of Quizzy and Dorian. Should we stop using all of the companions because the can become a bit crazy if they are exposed to red lyrium or they can turn on you if something happens ? The Inquisition can make bad decisions and he/she is still the Inquisition, why can't Leliana when she's out ranked you? Maybe the Inquisition shouldn't be the leader and just be a foot soldier if she/he can make terrible decisions.

 

To be honest, I don't think anyone is qualified enough to replace her in the main story timeline. In conclusion, it never happens to the Leliana that you are talking with in Skyhold after the quest, you can't blame her for that. It's like telling her " In my dream, I see you not obey my decision and make a terrible mistake after 2 years of torturing and being taken blood, flesh, skin alive. You shouldn't be the spy master lest that." or " You should get a "fail-safe" to replace you when we fail and the world is doomed"