98 réponses à ce sujet

[tmp7704]

While the nobility->heir thing is a legit concern brought up by the game, the same game also shows that it's not always a deal breaker. One such case is covered in the codex for the abandoned Villa in the Hinterlands (the one in the south-western part of the zone)

Heck, in DAO the player was actually given such option if they'd choose to put romanced Alistair under certain conditions.

[daveliam]

While the nobility->heir thing is a legit concern brought up by the game, the same game also shows that it's not always a deal breaker. One such case is covered in the codex for the abandoned Villa in the Hinterlands (the one in the south-western part of the zone)

 

That's really my point. 

 

I don't see why Josephine's sexuality would play a role in it.  Could it have been mentioned?  Sure.  But does it have to be attended to given what we know about nobility in Thedas?  Nope. 

[Br3admax]

Which is which?  The Amells or the Montilyets?  Both are impoverished minor noble families with tarnished reputations.  I see them as comparable.

No, they really aren't. The Montilyets aren't impoverished and they aren't publically shamed in Antiva. Compare that to the Amells whose entire family went magic and were publically shamed, especially considering what Leandra did, something Josephine obviously doesn't want to do. 

[Master Warder Z_]

That's really my point.

I don't see why Josephine's sexuality would play a role in it. Could it have been mentioned? Sure. But does it have to be attended to given what we know about nobility in Thedas? Nope.

Not really no.

That noble had a lover on the side, it didn't stop him from fathering children that led to the modern dynasty through his wife.

[Panda]

Someone's sexuality is not bound to duty, though Josie could be bisexual who decides only date men but that would leave players with lesbian character only one option so they would need someone else to balance that out.

 

All sexualities.. well almost none, worked out the way I predicted or wanted but there isn't much you can do OP, it's up to writers to decide.

[crimzontearz]

Well normally, I'd agree, OP, but this is the DA universe, and the rule is if a character is friendly with Leliana then sex will inevitably be involved and females who are not lesbians go bi.

Because Leliana enjoys sex. Sex with men. Sex with women... uh... what were we talking about?

and so it was that we discovered in DA4 that Solas = Dread Wolf, Flemeth = Mythal and Lelliana = the incarnation of the elven goddess of sexy sex, mischief and shoe/foot fetishes....which explains the above AND how she survived getting stabbed in the throat by the warden in some playthroughs.


Those of you who made her Divine....Let's just say that in 5 years from now the chantry is going to have skintight leather vestments for ceremonies...awesome shoes and yearly solstice orgies


Let's not even begin to talk about sunday school.....

[Wulfram]

Josephine has siblings, the Montilyet line is not in danger. And we have Sebastian as an example of a noble whose family took out of the breeding pool by sending him to the Chantry, so the notion that all nobles must have children is flawed.

Plus, the political advantages of a Montilyet having the Inquisitor wrapped around her little finger surely far outweighs the need for her to push out a few brats.

[Farangbaa]

Josephine has siblings, the Montilyet line is not in danger. And we have Sebastian as an example of a noble whose family took out of the breeding pool by sending him to the Chantry, so the notion that all nobles must have children is flawed.

Plus, the political advantages of a Montilyet having the Inquisitor wrapped around her little finger surely far outweighs the need for her to push out a few brats.

Human Inquisitor is also intended to join the chantry, not continuing the family blood line.

[KaiserShep]

Only if that means Cassandra is gay in this alternate universe you're building.

If she was, she'd definitely be my femquisitor's official romance option.

[Lulupab]

Because as a noble she has a duty to house and name.

She must produce an heir of the blood.

It's relatively simple.

 

Providing an heir is irrelevant. She can do it while romancing the Inquisitor.

 

So its ok if she romances a Qunari? nobles won't talk? what about a mage?

[LobselVith8]

You know, actually I think I do see this point as well. A bit.

 

And if you're playing an elven male, it does suck that you NEVER get any female elf options. Not unless you're gay and playing Origins.

 

It is unfortunate that this has been a consistent issue with an elven main character. I think it could have been interesting to see the dynamics between Lavellan and an elven character from another culture, like Tallis' viddathari, or perhaps someone who actually understood your cultural and religious beliefs in a way that no one else in Inquisition does, like Merrill.

[In Exile]

It is unfortunate that this has been a consistent issue with an elven main character. I think it could have been interesting to see the dynamics between Lavellan and an elven character from another culture, like Tallis' viddathari, or perhaps someone who actually understood your cultural and religious beliefs in a way that no one else in Inquisition does, like Merrill.

You mean like Sera, who actively loathes elven culture? Be careful what you wish for, particularly if it's a romance based on what amounts to cultural supremacism.

[Feranel]

You mean like Sera, who actively loathes elven culture? Be careful what you wish for, particularly if it's a romance based on what amounts to cultural supremacism.

And let's not forget Solas, whose romance with an Elven inquisitor basically climaxes at:
"Dalish are stupid and those are slave markings on your stupid faces."
Wat.
"I want to change your face."
Wat.
"Also I'm breaking up with you."
-____________________-

[Lulupab]

And let's not forget Solas, whose romance with an Elven inquisitor basically climaxes at:
"Dalish are stupid and those are slave markings on your stupid faces."
Wat.
"I want to change your face."
Wat.
"Also I'm breaking up with you."
-____________________-

 

Also at the end he realizes the Dalish are worth his attention and can be saved. This is what makes Solas romance incredible. You can change his view on the Dalish if you romance him. All my playthroughs absolutely pale in comparison to the one I romanced Solas. It was way too unique and I really liked it. Elf Female is probably the most unique playthough one can have, not to mention all the romance options and possibilities to form a personality and opinion.

[Master Warder Z_]

Providing an heir is irrelevant. She can do it while romancing the Inquisitor.

Unless if it's a male human noble it wouldn't matter.

[convergecultist3]

No apologies needed vertigomez, I came across as a ultra conservative kook that wanted to wash the gay out of Josephine and sera. Which in unacceptable. As far as my original post goes, disregard that nonsense, the post on page 2 is how I really feel.

As far as nobility goes, I'm not entirely sure what is culturally accepted in Antiva, there are exceptions to the rule, and Josephine with the inquisitor of any gender would be an exception in my opinion. If Josephine wants to be heir, which seems most likely to me, talking to Josie about her asking her siblings for help running the family estate, she gives the impression that they are not up too task. After meeting Yvette, you can't fault her logic in that sense. Besides, if you helped elevate your House like Josephine does, you should be the one receiving the most benefits from the work you did. Personally, if she wants to be heir, it is hers in my opinion. In some way, she has to create a bloodline. I know that sounds crude, but that is the burden of being a heir of a noble family. That doesn't mean she can't have a loving relationship with a woman while doing this though, I imagine the relationship between Josie and a female inquisitor would be similar to Alastair and a non human noble warden.Then again, she could be like Dorian and refuse being the heir (Btw, I know it is off topic, but Dorian is a boss. I liked how he stayed true to himself, it came at a great cost though. Maybe things will work out for him back home though.)

With regards to Josephine w/female or male non-human - I don't see a problem here, mainly because Josephine is paired with THE INQUISITOR, assuming you are at the very least friends with these people, and depending who you choose for divine, the inq is a friend of the freaking divine, has a standing army, ( a talented one at that it seems) a friend of the head seeker, and has diplomatic pull all over thedas. I find it hard to believe that her family would be bummed out by that, or any other noble family in that situation for that matter.

I apologize that I don't recall the name of the poster who spoke about Sebastian. Most 3rd born and later sons are sent off so they aren't a threat to their heir apparent brothers. If you think that is silly, ask Bhelen Aeudcan's two elder brothers how silly that is.

[LobselVith8]

You mean like Sera, who actively loathes elven culture?

 

Neither one of my examples was someone who actively loathes the elves or elven culture, so I'm not certain why you thought that was what I was referencing. I think an elven romance could explore a lot of avenues, particularly between two people who understand what it's like to be part of an ostracized and marginalized culture, whether or not that person is Dalish, Andrastian, or Qunari.

 

Be careful what you wish for, particularly if it's a romance based on what amounts to cultural supremacism.

 

I think you completely misread what I wrote, because that isn't remotely what I suggested.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

and so it was that we discovered in DA4 that Solas = Dread Wolf, Flemeth = Mythal and Lelliana = the incarnation of the elven goddess of sexy sex, mischief and shoe/foot fetishes....which explains the above AND how she survived getting stabbed in the throat by the warden in some playthroughs.


Those of you who made her Divine....Let's just say that in 5 years from now the chantry is going to have skintight leather vestments for ceremonies...awesome shoes and yearly solstice orgies


Let's not even begin to talk about sunday school.....

Your post made me think this:

 

Spoiler

[LobselVith8]

Also at the end he realizes the Dalish are worth his attention and can be saved. This is what makes Solas romance incredible. You can change his view on the Dalish if you romance him. All my playthroughs absolutely pale in comparison to the one I romanced Solas. It was way too unique and I really liked it. Elf Female is probably the most unique playthough one can have, not to mention all the romance options and possibilities to form a personality and opinion.

 

Solas will also admit he's wrong about the Dalish in friendship with Inquisitor Lavellan.

[errantknight]

Josephine has siblings. The family needs her for her brains not her womb. One assumes that al least some have an interest in reproducing.

[Master Warder Z_]

Josephine has siblings. The family needs her for her brains not her womb. One assumes that al least some have an interest in reproducing.

They aren't made out to be particularly bright.

[crimzontearz]

Your post made me think this:

Spoiler

minus...you know


The mandatory orgies

[crimzontearz]

They aren't made out to be particularly bright.

The ball is testament to that

[Tayah]

As far as nobility goes, I'm not entirely sure what is culturally accepted in Antiva, there are exceptions to the rule, and Josephine with the inquisitor of any gender would be an exception in my opinion. If Josephine wants to be heir, which seems most likely to me, talking to Josie about her asking her siblings for help running the family estate, she gives the impression that they are not up too task. After meeting Yvette, you can't fault her logic in that sense. Besides, if you helped elevate your House like Josephine does, you should be the one receiving the most benefits from the work you did. Personally, if she wants to be heir, it is hers in my opinion. In some way, she has to create a bloodline. I know that sounds crude, but that is the burden of being a heir of a noble family. That doesn't mean she can't have a loving relationship with a woman while doing this though, I imagine the relationship between Josie and a female inquisitor would be similar to Alastair and a non human noble warden.Then again, she could be like Dorian and refuse being the heir (Btw, I know it is off topic, but Dorian is a boss. I liked how he stayed true to himself, it came at a great cost though. Maybe things will work out for him back home though.)

With regards to Josephine w/female or male non-human - I don't see a problem here, mainly because Josephine is paired with THE INQUISITOR, assuming you are at the very least friends with these people, and depending who you choose for divine, the inq is a friend of the freaking divine, has a standing army, ( a talented one at that it seems) a friend of the head seeker, and has diplomatic pull all over thedas. I find it hard to believe that her family would be bummed out by that, or any other noble family in that situation for that matter.

I apologize that I don't recall the name of the poster who spoke about Sebastian. Most 3rd born and later sons are sent off so they aren't a threat to their heir apparent brothers. If you think that is silly, ask Bhelen Aeudcan's two elder brothers how silly that is.

No disrespect meant I'm just using this post to try and explain my perception of the matter, I think Josie being bi isn't the issue it's that if she romances a female inquisitor or a male non-human there's nothing that accounts for that in the game.

 

The big thing about noble marriages is that they're supposed to be about inheritance and heirs which let's face it isn't going to happen with Josephine and a female inquisitor nor with a qunari or dwarf male inquisitor as far as we know either while there's a lot of scandal attached to elf-blooded children. Being with the inquisitor is useful only as long as the inquisition remains important, at the end of the day nobles care far more about family bloodlines, legacies and scandals than they do about heroics, so to avoid scandal and continue rebuilding her family Josephine would be expected to marry another noble. By the way she's the eldest and clearly the only one willing or able to take on saving her family which is why considering she's all about family that the matter of inheritance should come up with any non noble male inquisitor and possibly even with a Trevelyan (haven't played human and can't spell the name but anyway) too.

 

Having said it should come up I think there would be ways around it in that she could nominate a niece or nephew to be her heir down the track, it just feels like it should have been addressed considering how important Josephine's family and their future are to her. I also think a duel for her hand makes no sense in the context of how the nobility is set up in Thedas. It's far more likely Otranto would accept Josie having a mistress than duel a woman over a woman especially if that advantages him in the meantime. I can see two women dueling over a man as easily as two men dueling over a woman within the lore but when it becomes about an s/s option Thedas sees that as irrelevant as there's no concept of marriage between a s/s couple and so long as you do your duty for your family you can do what you want afterwards/on the side which is how Vivienne becomes the mistress of a Duke and why (hardened) Alistair could keep a non-noble female warden as his mistress if made king. (Thinking about Viv makes me wonder if the wife had someone on the side and if male what would his title be?)

 

Ultimately the way it is handled and the fact her status and family's future is not discussed makes me feel like most of Josephine's arc was written before races were added (as a duel would be an alien concept for pretty much everyone but a human noble and should result in defeat if Josie hadn't stopped it) and certainly more as a romance that was opened up to f/f content rather than being written with that in mind from the beginning which is disappointing to me as I vastly prefer Josephine to Sera as a character but her romance makes me feel like she wasn't really written for both genders. Or at least that's my opinion especially as it seems the lines are pretty much the same regardless of gender throughout.

 

Josephine has siblings, the Montilyet line is not in danger. And we have Sebastian as an example of a noble whose family took out of the breeding pool by sending him to the Chantry, so the notion that all nobles must have children is flawed.

Plus, the political advantages of a Montilyet having the Inquisitor wrapped around her little finger surely far outweighs the need for her to push out a few brats.

The better advantage to her family would be for Josephine to marry Otranto and have an heir and a spare while keeping the inquisitor on the side wrapped around her finger because long term the inquisitor doesn't have the same advantages as nobility and this way their legacy is continued (I would hate this outcome but it is consistent with the lore as it's been shown so far as with Alistair becoming king).

Human Inquisitor is also intended to join the chantry, not continuing the family blood line.

Sebastian and the human noble are younger siblings... spares if you will both of whom are born into religious families so to keep them from plotting the overthrow of older siblings and strengthen ties to the dominant religion so the family has more chances of the heaven not hell destination they're sent to the chantry. At the time they're sent the family's breeding programs are perfectly intact and functioning as expected... until Seb's family is murdered anyway (No idea about human noble).