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Bioware's Cutscenes quality among the worst currently?.


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#26
Fast Jimmy

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:devil:


If Casey's plan was ultimately to wind up in the unemployment line, then he is diabolically successful.

#27
Inquisitor Recon

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IATW - I Am The Walrus

Shut the f*** up Donny.


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#28
B.A. Broska

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If Casey's plan was ultimately to wind up in the unemployment line, then he is diabolically successful.

 

I though Casey left of his own volition? Not sure why he would leave if he did not have a plan for the future or another job lined up? Early retirement? Asked to leave as part of an EA re-structure? Or just grown disillusioned with the video game industry and the harsh abuse leveled at him by the fanbase?


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#29
Fast Jimmy

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I though Casey left of his own volition? Not sure why he would leave if he did not have a plan for the future or another job lined up? Early retirement? Asked to leave as part of an EA re-structure? Or just grown disillusioned with the video game industry and the harsh abuse leveled at him by the fanbase?


He left (of his own volition apparently, but who knows with these things) to pursue his own projects this summer. As of yet, he hasn't announced what those other projects might be, where he might be working on them or what role he would be playing. Six months of nothing is, to me, a one way ticket to the unemployment line.

Maybe the EA golden parachute was really nice, who knows.

#30
Fishy

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I agree. The animation and ''cutscene'' in every bioware game are very awkward. That probably because they refuse to use motion capture. For instance they still have that ridiculous animation when a character  will ''twist'' his body to look at something or someone  behind him.. Like ''twisting his body'' and each time his head stop it's does a ''Little bump'' that look so unrealistic. Don't get me on  facial animation . Now if you were close to me I could mimick the animation to you and you would understand lol.

 

They really need to evolve and start using motion capture.


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#31
spinachdiaper

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cut scenes are for JRPGs and namby pamby Action games



#32
K_O_513

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It seems my influence has spread farther than I initially thought.


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#33
Guest_TrillClinton_*

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Bioware is prone to reuse animations from other titles. It cuts out a lot of overhead and reduces the time to work on them. Let us be realistic, animations and modelling have never been bioware' strong point. To make it worse, they are using a system that allows the user to create a character. Which means combination of small graphical structures to make one thing
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#34
NeonFlux117

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Dragon Age 3 sucked nut. 


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#35
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The fact that you think they're all the same tells me you have no idea what you're talking about.

 

The effects are subtle, but there are differences.

 

Consider the cutscene with the Turian during the beginning of Mordin's recruitment mission. In this scene the camera basically moves around the talking characters. You would not have seen this in ME1 outside of very story-relevant missions.

 

DA is even more drastic. I'm not certain, but I don't think there's a single cutscene in DA O where the camera moves at all. Meanwhile, in DA I at about the 1/3rd mark, you have a tremendously, brilliantly choreographed scene that I won't spoil, but involves a large party of people trekking over a lot of terrain. This blows anything in DA O out of the water, and quite possible anything in any Bioware game ever (possible exception of CGI scenes).


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#36
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I am tiring quickly of Bioware's animations. DAI's facial animations seem a step back from the previous two games, with the dead eyes staring straight ahead and everybody only able to move their mouth after too much botox Frostbite.
 
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With CDPR using mocap for everything I find this sort of sillines ^ to become pretty unacceptable.

 
IS CDPR using mocap for Cyberpunk? That should be your metric, not a game with a set protagonist.
 

I agree. The animation and ''cutscene'' in every bioware game are very awkward. That probably because they refuse to use motion capture. For instance they still have that ridiculous animation when a character  will ''twist'' his body to look at something or someone  behind him.. Like ''twisting his body'' and each time his head stop it's does a ''Little bump'' that look so unrealistic. Don't get me on  facial animation . Now if you were close to me I could mimick the animation to you and you would understand lol.
 
They really need to evolve and start using motion capture.

 
http://www.engadget....ture-explainer/

Mocap is prohibitively expensive, not even considering the fact that Bioware has four different character models. Eight really.
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#37
Kaiser Arian XVII

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Now enjoy  the glory of Jedi Knight II in comparison:

 



#38
A Crusty Knight Of Colour

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I'll ignore technical glitches and talk a bit about one of my more favourite subjects to rant incessantly about. I still don't understand the hubbub with cinematic storytelling tbh.

But if you're going to do it, might as well do it right.

The problem lies in the fact that they're placing so much of the player's engagement with watching the game's cinematics, along with higher expectations in cinematography and animations that comes with technology like mocap.

BioWare also refuses to expand their storytelling techniques beyond cinematic clips or half ass written entries (I had a blog detailing and comparing this to an example of non-cinematic storytelling in New Vegas on the old BSN).

But BioWare games and DA:I in particular is much larger and longer than say, Last Of Us or a Telltale game. Yet people expect the same level of quality and polish, or better. Which is unreasonable in my view.

That said, BioWare can get away with less technically proficient/demanding cutscenes and choreography if they engaged the players more mechanically in dialog ala Deus Ex: Human Revolution or Alpha Protocol. Maybe I should pitch my Intent Wheel concept again? IDK. I feel like with the DA:I, there were shades of it but unlike AP or DE:HR there was no feedback and you never felt like most of your dialogue choices branched the conversation at all beyond designated choice points.

Which is by design if I read Gaider's blog correctly. It can work amazingly well when you are playing a text based game and you have the room to fill in the gaps with your imagination (for a contemporary reference, SRR and Dragonfall are very good at doing this despite similar flaws in their dialogue design), but in a highly choreographed and cinematic game, the room just isn't there.

To the point brought up by the OP, they have attempted to bring in more and more complex choreography and cinematic sequences with newer games. That's kind of undeniable. But that kind of thing doesn't come out in screenshots.
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#39
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That said, BioWare can get away with less technically proficient/demanding cutscenes and choreography if they engaged the players more mechanically in dialog ala Deus Ex: Human Revolution or Alpha Protocol. Maybe I should pitch my Intent Wheel concept again? IDK. I feel like with the DA:I, there were shades of it but unlike AP or DE:HR there was no feedback and you never felt like most of your dialogue choices branched the conversation at all beyond designated choice points.


The problem with AP and HR is that dialog is a combat-like system: it's there to be won, not to define your character. The existence of continuing fail states mean that they have some level of role-playing, but it's a piddly drop in the bucket compared to Bioware games.

The point of dialog in a Bioware game is not to convince a spec ops group's leader to take you into his confidence, or convince a man not to kill himself. The point of dialog in a Bioware game is role-playing. Case in point, reaction wheel (which saw too little use, but is a step in the right direction).
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#40
A Crusty Knight Of Colour

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I don't believe the two are mutually exclusive. The dialog setup in AP was pivotal to roleplaying in that game. And honestly, I wouldn't say it's a piddly drop in the bucket. The ability to roleplay Thorton in AP is on par with Shepard in the Mass Effect games barring gender choice/romance IMO.

 

And considering how flexible the ending is around your choices in AP, I'd say it's about the same overall.


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#41
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I don't believe the two are mutually exclusive. The dialog setup in AP was pivotal to roleplaying in that game. And honestly, I wouldn't say it's a piddly drop in the bucket. The ability to roleplay Thorton in AP is on par with Shepard in the Mass Effect games barring gender choice/romance IMO.
 
And considering how flexible the ending is around your choices in AP, I'd say it's about the same overall.


I base my opinion on the fact that there's so much dialog in ME and DA that has absolutely nothing to do with the plot, but fleshes out characters and allows you to take a stance on things. Guiding Garrus, for example (though that's tangentially related to the plot). Or talking to Mordin about the Genophage. That kind of thing doesn't happen in AP and certainly not HR.

In AP, there's a conversation with Westridge at the beginning where he tells Thorton about the dialog system, and tells him that each person likes certain types of responses, and that there are positive side effects to someone liking you. While it's to be commended for pointing out that someone not liking you is not immediately bad, regardless of that it very clearly puts the focus on dialog as a system of choice and consequence (and a system to "game" or manipulate), rather than dialog as a form of role-playing.

That's just my opinion though, no need to go spreading it around or anything.
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#42
A Crusty Knight Of Colour

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Brb, spreading your opinion on social media.


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#43
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Oh gosh, anything but social media.
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#44
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I agree. The animation and ''cutscene'' in every bioware game are very awkward. That probably because they refuse to use motion capture. For instance they still have that ridiculous animation when a character  will ''twist'' his body to look at something or someone  behind him.. Like ''twisting his body'' and each time his head stop it's does a ''Little bump'' that look so unrealistic. Don't get me on  facial animation . Now if you were close to me I could mimick the animation to you and you would understand lol.
 
They really need to evolve and start using motion capture.


Imagine how much extra time motion capture would add to their cycle. The two biggest resource hogs in bioware games in my opinion is voiced dialogue and save imports. Those two influence such a layer of permutations that bioware would have to draw the line.

I always wondered why I could not use my shep's historical or even class knowledge in my mission. I mean a mission that requires hacking a terminal should be equally accessible to my Shepard too right? I mean even VTMB let's me do that. The scope of these games if they are to be done right is just too big.

Not to mention, they also had to deal with inheritance of established systems while changing their technology. I am not defending them, just pointing out that bioware has a scope problem.

I think inquisition would have been more polished out if they kept their original vision of human only but it is still a fun product.
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#45
mybudgee

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I am beginning to like this thread...

#46
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:devil:


Is he married? I would be a good husbando

#47
A Crusty Knight Of Colour

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Oh gosh, anything but social media.

 

You could have prevented this. All you had to do was listen.

 

Don't call it a grave, this is the future you chose.



#48
Dutchess

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Imagine how much extra time motion capture would add to their cycle. The two biggest resource hogs in bioware games in my opinion is voiced dialogue and save imports. Those two influence such a layer of permutations that bioware would have to draw the line.

 

I could live with them not using mocap if their animations were more decent, but they can't even get walking right.

 

cPjXRWW.jpg

 

While exploring the female characters still run with femHawke's ridiculous hip sway and in cutscenes she reverts to Bioware's idea of a manly walk, with plenty of room for your huge, manly balls.

 

Screenshot%2B-%2B19.11.2014%2B%2C%2B23_0

 

Not sure what's manly or feminine about slouching.


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#49
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I could live with them not using mocap if their animations were more decent, but they can't even get walking right.

 

cPjXRWW.jpg

 

While exploring the female characters still run with femHawke's ridiculous hip sway and in cutscenes she reverts to Bioware's idea of a manly walk, with plenty of room for your huge, manly balls.

 

Screenshot%2B-%2B19.11.2014%2B%2C%2B23_0

 

Not sure what's manly or feminine about slouching.

 

Most definitely, I did mention that bioware animations are horrible. I think is is because of how much time they try to cut by reusing a lot of animations. I think I have seem some animations that I saw in jade empire in dragon age 2. They don't take as much care to their animation as compared to a studio like Naughty Dog. Their movements are usually freshly crafted and very fluid while bioware is lanky and stiff.



#50
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Now enjoy  the glory of Jedi Knight II in comparison:

 

 

Kyle >>>>>>> any other Jedi.


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