21 réponses à ce sujet

[Zalignor]

I am currently about 20 hours into a Nightmare playthrough completely without mages. I've done it on Hard before, but reading about Nightmare everyone seems to think at least one mage (perhaps even two) is mandatory? So far I'm totally fine, though.

Playing as a dwarf archery rogue, I usually take Cass, Sera and Blackwall with me. Although Blackwall kinda sucks, so will perhaps sub him for Cole. I usually play RPGs as kind of a wuzzy Good Guy, so this time decided to stay true to a different character and be a stubborn, magic hating dwarf.

Has anyone completed the game on Nightmare without using mages at all? The only time I use a mage is to unlock the magic barriers when needed (I bring unlevelled Vivienne with proper staff type).

[Exalus]

The only requirement for nm is a single tank able to survive long enough for everyone else to kill. so yes it is very much doable and not really too much harder than with a mage but i have not tried it myself as i do find some joy in having a mixed party.

[Bhaal]

After getting specs, there were a lot of times i didn't have mages in my party (to experince new banter). Warriors survive just as good without barriers. However for pre-skyhold barriers a bit essential actualy.

[ashwind]

Pre-Skyhold would be quite a challenge (the final battle in Haven) but after Skyhold, well.... you can even solo most fights if you like. (yes in Nightmare). So mages are not really necessary especially later. 

[Zenthar Aseth]

There are no requirements for Nightmare, really. It's not that difficult, and the game has quite a few things you can abuse in fights/in general to make it easier.

[Zalignor]

Seems like we all agree here. Nice with a thread like this, for a change... 

[Kage]

Yeah, barrier is very good since it basically gives you X seconds of invulnerability. But warriors are so tough, it is not so good on them.

It is pretty important on mages to defend themselves if attacked, since they dont have many "escape" mecanisms. (Fade step for melees only)

 

However, if you do not have barrier, you dont have a mage. So your warriors can just tank the damage, and rogues can just enter ALL MIGHTY stealth and avoid all damage incoming from any enemy. Which is much better than having some seconds of invulnerability.

 

Not to mention the dps of mages specced into spirit is not so good.

 

The only thing I would miss, is the combowombo mayhem. Mages are the best ones to set up combos with paralyze, freeze and sleep (weakness+shock).

[SFTH]

Very possible. I'd probably go for a tank + 3 archers approach. I played DA2 nightmare this way as well. Too bad all the class-specific stuff kinda forces you to have all classes, or often go back to camp to switch.

[Xhaiden]

Yep, its pre-Skyhold thats the hard slog on Nightmare. Post Skyhold when you have access to tier 3 schematics things go back to Normal so to speak thanks to how overtly powerful crafting is. Especially if you're using gear dependent classes like Warrior or Rogue who benefit immensely from crafted gear.

[sergel02]

This gives me some comfort actually. I've been trying to decide between mage and rogue, and was leaning mage because of party set ups and how essential barrier is (I want to take Cassandra, Cole, and then cycle through the rest, so I might not have a mage who can use barrier if I play a rogue). 

[Zalignor]

Having played on for a bit longer now, I've reached Skyhold after a surprisingly easy fight in Haven. As I conscripted the templars, I found Fiona battling me and she was a walk in the park (when siding with the mages, the behemoth caused a lot more trouble).

I am now totally convinced the mages aren't at all mandatory. Quite the opposite. When trying a team of myself (archer rogue, as stated before), Sera, Varric and Cassandra it's way to easy, even though it's Nightmare. As long as we don't fight more than 5 mobs at a time, there is never the least bit of a challenge. Cass gets pumped with guard and the rest of us (at about level 14-15) have the abilities to both disappear and stun if needed. Not fun. So Varric is of the team sheet, subbed for a 2h-warrior (mainly Blackwall, since I brought Iron Bull for an entire PT before).

[zeypher]

Thing is we need mages for the energise parts, thats it. I carry a mage and a rogue because of that.If i didnt not have that requirement i will just run with 4 warriors.

[Zalignor]

Yeah. The energize-shite is tiresome. But I usually save them and do a swipe all over the zone I'm in and then cut the mage again.

[Xhaiden]

This gives me some comfort actually. I've been trying to decide between mage and rogue, and was leaning mage because of party set ups and how essential barrier is (I want to take Cassandra, Cole, and then cycle through the rest, so I might not have a mage who can use barrier if I play a rogue). 

 

Once you get past Skyhold and can craft Guard on Hit gear you can toughen Rogue up a bit. Plus you can get a neigh endless supply of rare Tier 3 leather in Emprise from the fat snoflours running around on the ice next to the first village. They can drop stacks of up to 10 at a time. So you can craft some solid armour for a rogue once you have access to Emprise.

[teks]

That rare tier 3 leather is available even eaelier at exalted plains. Northwest of the starting point next to the water.

[Biotic Flash Kick]

if you can solo the game on NM with a 2hander

you can beat nightmare without mages 

[zeypher]

Honestly preferred setup with good dps and survivability for me is Iron bull as SnS, Cassandra as SnS me as a 2 handed warrior and Varric.

[Biotic Flash Kick]

fine ill answer more seriously.

 

find the heal over 10 seconds masterworks + walking fortress masterworks

they are life in the most literal sense because you will heal health from taking guard damage. 

 

have cass be the party buffer/debuffer horn of valor / blessed blades / war horn

make her SnS and stack her with: walking fortress / guard on hit / heal over time master works.

 

then blackwall same thing masterworks but more vanguard than battlemaster 

 

and rogue give bow becuase AI cant do fug all with daggers

 

then be a rogue or reaver and win.

 

2handed champ solo is cake on nightmare

[Zalignor]

Honestly, I thought Nightmare would be a much tougher challenge. I almost feel a little disappointed. I don't like setting actions-barriers ( ie not crafting, only use melee or always run without potions etc) for myself within the game just to get att challenge. Lets just hope they tweak the difficulty as we go forward.

 

I still have a great time playing the game, because unlike some people I do feel there is noticable differences to both my world (through different World state) and the way my actions matter to it. But I'd be nice with a really tough challenge, more so when one invests some 100 hours in a playthrough. Might as well be 150 h and hard as hell. 

[StrangeStrategy]

fine ill answer more seriously.

 

find the heal over 10 seconds masterworks + walking fortress masterworks

they are life in the most literal sense because you will heal health from taking guard damage. 

 

have cass be the party buffer/debuffer horn of valor / blessed blades / war horn

make her SnS and stack her with: walking fortress / guard on hit / heal over time master works.

 

then blackwall same thing masterworks but more vanguard than battlemaster 

 

and rogue give bow becuase AI cant do fug all with daggers

 

then be a rogue or reaver and win.

 

2handed champ solo is cake on nightmare

 

Are they, though? I heard that masterwork (Heal upon taking damage) only activates when your health takes damage, not guard/barrier.

[Xhaiden]

That rare tier 3 leather is available even eaelier at exalted plains. Northwest of the starting point next to the water.

 

Both zones become available at the same time...
 

[Biotic Flash Kick]

Are they, though? I heard that masterwork (Heal upon taking damage) only activates when your health takes damage, not guard/barrier.

Nope. you heal more the listed percent and heal through guard.

actually healing through barrier is even more insane since barriers can be bigger than 1/4 of total health.

 

full guard is 1/4 your total health. 

 

barrier can be like 2000. So if an enemy hit your barrier for 3/4s and you take no damage/battle ends you are going to heal up nicely.