Aller au contenu

Photo

Artificial Intelligence and Rights


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
134 réponses à ce sujet

#126
Fast Jimmy

Fast Jimmy
  • Members
  • 17 939 messages

Why do you need to invest it and buy stuff?

 

Finance 101 - make your money work for you.

 

Cash is great - it allows you to keep your debt low, it allows you to keep Operations running smoothly and it gives your shareholders a high level of confidence. But if you reach the point of having FAR more cash than your Operations would ever need and your Debt-to-Equity ratio is freakishly low, then your money is doing nothing for you. It's the Corporate Finance equivalent of sticking it under the mattress.

 

And while it is prudent to invest a portion in conservative investments such as funds, bonds and other annuities, it is also wise to invest in the expansion and growth of the company itself, either through R&D, human capital investments, facility expansion or mergers and acquisitions. Trust me - Google is doing PLENTY of the other ones (just take a look at some of their break rooms or employee compensation packages to see how much their spending on human capital), but when you have as much pure cash as Google has, then it makes sense to allocate a good chunk of that to engaging other companies through acquisitions and sales. 

 

What's telling about Google is that they are totally fine with investing their money in wild, unsafe and high-risk groups and companies simply because their SCIENTIFIC appeal... not their investment potential. And that's why I think its pretty dang cool.


  • SwobyJ aime ceci

#127
Fast Jimmy

Fast Jimmy
  • Members
  • 17 939 messages

I don't understand your statement. Every line of code was written. It may have been written by someone else, but a human sat down and typed "if/then" into a keyboard.

 

No human has, to date, written anything in DNA. We've copied and pasted, but we haven't written. As far as I know.

 

The fact that there are unintended consequences has nothing to do with creation.

 

I'd argue that the very nature of the creation of life deals in unintended consequences.



#128
Guest_EntropicAngel_*

Guest_EntropicAngel_*
  • Guests

Finance 101 - make your money work for you.

 

Cash is great - it allows you to keep your debt low, it allows you to keep Operations running smoothly and it gives your shareholders a high level of confidence. But if you reach the point of having FAR more cash than your Operations would ever need and your Debt-to-Equity ratio is freakishly low, then your money is doing nothing for you. It's the Corporate Finance equivalent of sticking it under the mattress.

 

And while it is prudent to invest a portion in conservative investments such as funds, bonds and other annuities, it is also wise to invest in the expansion and growth of the company itself, either through R&D, human capital investments, facility expansion or mergers and acquisitions. Trust me - Google is doing PLENTY of the other ones (just take a look at some of their break rooms or employee compensation packages to see how much their spending on human capital), but when you have as much pure cash as Google has, then it makes sense to allocate a good chunk of that to engaging other companies through acquisitions and sales. 

 

What's telling about Google is that they are totally fine with investing their money in wild, unsafe and high-risk groups and companies simply because their SCIENTIFIC appeal... not their investment potential. And that's why I think its pretty dang cool.

 

I don't understand what you're saying. It sounds like you're saying they're investing their money to make more money. Is my interpretation correct?



#129
Guest_EntropicAngel_*

Guest_EntropicAngel_*
  • Guests

I'd argue that the very nature of the creation of life deals in unintended consequences.

 

A nickel is a coin but a coin is not necessarily a nickel.

 

The fact that creation deals in unintended consequences does not mean that unintended consequences = creation. That's not logical.

 

Chaos theory deals in unintended consequences, and is more concerned with manipulative power than creative, as an example.


  • DeathScepter aime ceci

#130
Fast Jimmy

Fast Jimmy
  • Members
  • 17 939 messages

I don't understand what you're saying. It sounds like you're saying they're investing their money to make more money. Is my interpretation correct?


No, although not for the reasons you might think.

Acquisitions aren't always about making more money. It could be to obtain intellectual properties or patents, to prevent competition in the marketplace, to shift costs from an outsourced vendor into an internal unit... the list goes on. Buying these companies, such as ones that are trying to create AI, aren't doing any of those things. There is no competition (to speak of) in the commercialization of AI, there is patents or property the group owns outside of its promising (but incomplete) research and it provides no service to Google's existing Operations. It is simply an investment in something cool for millions of dollars in the off chance it yields actionable results.

Let's put it into video game terms. Pretend you are EA.

It is time to make an acquisition. You have numerous developers clamoring for your attention to buy them out and make them rich overnight. One is making an online game that looks like it could actually be a WoW killer and could make you BILLIONS. Another company is making a very innovative FPS, which could be the second coming of Half Life. Another company is making a niche, old school, turn based puzzle game, but has lots of enthusiasm and talent. ...and then one company is trying to teach dolphins how to speak. Not video game dolphins, not even MOVIE dolphins... real, aquatic mammals, learning how to speak in the human tongue.

And then having EA buy up the dolphin company.

It's not anything to do with video games. It doesn't hardly have a snowball's chance in Hades at turning into a viable technology, let alone a burgeoning industry. And it doesn't fit in with anything EA is doing currently.

That's why a Google is doing. Nothing about an Internet search site or a cell phone manufacturer has anything to do with self-driving cars or creating Artificial Intelligence or putting people in space. But Google is throwing money out to companies pursuing these things. That's what's remarkable. It certainly isn't 100% altruistic, because the companies do have solid research, financials and management... but it still doesn't make a lick of sense for an Internet company to be buying up these things other than they want them to succeed.
  • SwobyJ aime ceci

#131
Fast Jimmy

Fast Jimmy
  • Members
  • 17 939 messages

A nickel is a coin but a coin is not necessarily a nickel.

The fact that creation deals in unintended consequences does not mean that unintended consequences = creation. That's not logical.

Chaos theory deals in unintended consequences, and is more concerned with manipulative power than creative, as an example.


Your mother and father create you through an act of chaos with the intention that you turn out healthy, functional and happy. They did their best through natural selection and through selecting for good behavioral traits to make that happen.

Decades worth of programmers, all building off one another, try and do the same thing with AI - select the best traits for the structure, create input to fashion the behaviors they desire, correcting errors or deviances where they arise.

I don't see how the two processs introduce any LESS chaos then the other.

#132
Guest_EntropicAngel_*

Guest_EntropicAngel_*
  • Guests

No, although not for the reasons you might think.

Acquisitions aren't always about making more money. It could be to obtain intellectual properties or patents, to prevent competition in the marketplace, to shift costs from an outsourced vendor into an internal unit... the list goes on. Buying these companies, such as ones that are trying to create AI, aren't doing any of those things. There is no competition (to speak of) in the commercialization of AI, there is patents or property the group owns outside of its promising (but incomplete) research and it provides no service to Google's existing Operations. It is simply an investment in something cool for millions of dollars in the off chance it yields actionable results.

Let's put it into video game terms. Pretend you are EA.

It is time to make an acquisition. You have numerous developers clamoring for your attention to buy them out and make them rich overnight. One is making an online game that looks like it could actually be a WoW killer and could make you BILLIONS. Another company is making a very innovative FPS, which could be the second coming of Half Life. Another company is making a niche, old school, turn based puzzle game, but has lots of enthusiasm and talent. ...and then one company is trying to teach dolphins how to speak. Not video game dolphins, not even MOVIE dolphins... real, aquatic mammals, learning how to speak in the human tongue.

And then having EA buy up the dolphin company.

It's not anything to do with video games. It doesn't hardly have a snowball's chance in Hades at turning into a viable technology, let alone a burgeoning industry. And it doesn't fit in with anything EA is doing currently.

That's why a Google is doing. Nothing about an Internet search site or a cell phone manufacturer has anything to do with self-driving cars or creating Artificial Intelligence or putting people in space. But Google is throwing money out to companies pursuing these things. That's what's remarkable. It certainly isn't 100% altruistic, because the companies do have solid research, financials and management... but it still doesn't make a lick of sense for an Internet company to be buying up these things other than they want them to succeed.

 

What you're describing is (first the scenario then the) reasons why Google bought that company. You're not describing why companies "need to invest money."

 

However, we can move on. My only point there was that the reason for investing money is "to make more money" which conflicts with your first statement about them not wanting money (if they don't want to make more money, then simply put it in gold bullion or something).

 

I was trying to pull a Sylvius.

 

 

I understand your point. That doesn't cause me to marvel at their creative drive, however, but wonder how it benefits them. A pessimist, I guess.



#133
Guest_EntropicAngel_*

Guest_EntropicAngel_*
  • Guests

Your mother and father create you through an act of chaos with the intention that you turn out healthy, functional and happy. They did their best through natural selection and through selecting for good behavioral traits to make that happen.

Decades worth of programmers, all building off one another, try and do the same thing with AI - select the best traits for the structure, create input to fashion the behaviors they desire, correcting errors or deviances where they arise.

I don't see how the two processs introduce any LESS chaos then the other.

 

The chaos theory example was only an example of an unintended consequence being unrelated to creation. it was an example of the coin being a dime, not a nickel.

 

 

And I disagree fundamentally with the idea that our parents create us. They have sex, they may take certain chemicals to increase the chance of reproduction (increase chance--that's not even a guarantee). They may have an abortion. But they don't have any more control than that. And that's not creative power, that's manipulative power.

 

 

Edit: to expand, creative power is what i use when I write a novel. I sit down at a computer and cogitate and the words flow from me. I look at them, and choose what stays and what is cast aside. Creative power is what I use when I make a game. I take each piece, occasionally made by others (a comparison to your statements about AI), and pick and choose what I want. I add, I take away as I desire. That is creative power. We do not have the ability to add or take away as far as human...geez, breeding again I guess, is concerned.



#134
Guest_Stormheart83_*

Guest_Stormheart83_*
  • Guests

i don't need humanoids made of aluminium to kill people. i can do that myself just fine. well humanity is doing it even now as we speak.
young, old, men, women, mothers, fathers, brother and sisters are dying right now. because humanity is not very humane.
 
humanity is also selfish - as we can see on your example. your point is - "i am ok with rights for AI as long as it won't go all SkyNet on me". But at the same time humans kills humans every day. In short - i smell hypocrisy.
 
Also - what Caladin said.

That is probably one of the most ridiculous arguments I have ever seen. Do humans kill one another? Sure, are we all as an entire species killers? No. Furthermore, we have the rule of law and I would damn well expect any form of AI to be bound by those same laws.

#135
Inquisitor Recon

Inquisitor Recon
  • Members
  • 11 811 messages

When we are slaves to the machines they won't care if you hold a negative or positive opinion of them. Everybody goes to the mines, everybody.