24 réponses à ce sujet

[fcedric]

Hello, 

I don't know for you DAI Gamers, but since DAO/DA2 it appear we have lost many many things with Dragon Age Inquisition, at the functionality level i mean (of course DAI is a great game, better than the older one, but...)

We have lost the combos, and the tactics system (the tactics rows...) And we have lost Wynne Grrrr (hopefully we have Solas)

 

The old tactics system was perfect (the 12/15 tactics row), is was permitting many many things and action, and conditionnal actions Dragon Age Inquisition tactics system don't permit...

 

Examples :

tactic row  : more than 2 ally health <50%  -> regain (knight enchanter) / health grenade

tactic row 1 : Group of enemy > 3 -> launch fireball (ice storm)

tactic row 2 : Enemy use fire attack -> drink fire protect potion

tactic row 3 Fenris : Enemi brittle -> Fenris Mighty Blow 

tactic row 4 : Enemy rank >Normal rank -> crushing prison

tactic row 6 : Group of enemy >2 -> use fire/ice grenade

 

 

Tactic for Warden/hawke/fenris WARRIOR :

Enemy attack class Mage/Rogue -> attack 

 

More than this, with DAO/DA2, we could give priority to spells and tactics by placing upper... the system was better to  fine tune our allies... And of course with the old system, the IA was much much better when fine tuned...

 

With Dragon Age Inquisition, Bioware created a game which forgot the strategy aspect, it is Dragon Age for the dummies...

Common, give us the old system, we are not Dummies Bioware !!! We know what we do, all of us have the Bachelor/the Baccalaureate... If we liked Dragon Age, it was also because the tactics system permit to discover and re-discovers other side of the game by playing differently...

 

WE ARE NOT NUT !!!

[Arbiter156]

On the contrary I have found inquisition to be just as tactical as DA:O. Ok so we lack that tactic slots and I wouldn't mind having them back.

Last night I finally beat in your heart shall burn on nightmare and it was perhaps the most tactically challenging battle of the series for me. Having to use a combination of tactical cam and real time combat was refreshing. Better IMO than having your AI do everything for you, which was a little boring.

[Kage]

Yeah, the old IF-THEN tactic system is gone, we do not know why. But the general consensus is either people do not matter, or people are really disapointed on its absence. In any case, it is clearly a loss.

[fcedric]

It is a loss...

In DA2, it had been improved, and was permitting to sharp the IA comportment...

now, with the comportment in DAI, you only have 2 possibility

IA : Attack same enemy than controlled character

IA : Defend controlled character...

 

If you are a Mage/Rogue and put a warrior on defend, it will not attack until you been attacked...

 

With the old tactic system, your warrior (tank) will attack for example

Tactic 1 -> Enemi >Elite -> attack

Tactic 2 -> Enemi attack mage/rogue -> attack

 

For a Mage 

Tactic 1 -> Enemi attack from distance (with bow/crossbow)-> mage attack him

Tactic 2 -> PJ surrounded by 2 enemy or more -> mind blast/fire bomb/fireball/ice storm

 

For a rogue

Tactic 1 : If surrounded by 2 ennemi or more -> invisibility/ roll/dodge

Tactic 2 : Enemi attack PJ -> Invisibility

Tactic 3 : PJ beeing attacked by melee attack -> Parry

Now, the IA use invisibility directly, it don't understand it is an evade tactic, i'm not sure it will use Parry or the defensive warrior skill correctly

 

 

We have loss many many in this new tactic system... I think it have been better to give us the choice, like in DAO/DA2 ...

Pre built tactics set / and possibility to create a new one from scracth (inspired by the pre-built set)...

 

My opinion is Bioware think we are nut, we are nag (des bourrins)... They think we are too nut to understand the old system... And we just want to hit something and launch fireballs...

I think they don't know their customers... i'm sure 80% of the Dragon age players / customers are more than 25 years old (and all of them have the Bachelor or a minimum of general culture)... This is not Call of Duty, this is Dragon Age...

 

And another big functionality we have lost, and it is really a big loss, is the DAO/DA2 spells/capacity wheel... in DAO/DA2, all the capacity/spells can be usable at any time...

Now we are restricted to the use of only 8 spells/capacity... ????? What is this ??

I really hope they will correct this bug and add the Spell Wheel in the L1 button menu...

[idspisp0pd]

Yeah, from a pure design perspective, the change in DAI doesn't make sense to me. It's not as if DAO or DA2 forced the tactics system on casual players. It was just there if you wanted it, unobtrusively hanging out in the menus.

 

I can only guess there were some technical or time/budget constraints that caused tactics to get cut, because I can't think of another good reason. 

 

For me, the practical effect of the "streamlining" they did in DAI isn't to simplify gameplay. Instead, it forces me to do far more micromanaging to keep party members from doing stupid stuff. And how many more battles are there in a game this big, relative to previous ones? DAI needs a robust tactic system even more than the other two did, but instead they gutted it.

[Darkly Tranquil]

Agreed. It's a terrible design decision, especially since the companion AI is so utterly inept. Being able to set tactics commands would have allowed us to offset some of the worst blunders of the AI with custom routines. The simplified tactics wouldn't have been such an issue if the AI was smarter and the TacCam wasn't so awkward to use, but none of the companion control features work satisfactorily.

[Biotic Flash Kick]

The game is really easy so tact screens not needed

 

i've personalty solo'd the game end to end with a no spec warrior. 

 

i will say i do miss the tactics though.

I'd love for my party [if i use one] to move out of AoE instant of asking for me to input them

 

but it would help dual wield rogue allies insanely. 

[fcedric]

Yes i agree with you, the game is too easy, in DAO, playing in difficult mode was hard... When during your travel you fall on darkspawn event... with an emissary... and many many traps on the grounds... it was easy to be killed...

They should add more difficulty level, like in Diablo 3/Reaper of Souls...

[fcedric]

So we need two things to make a better DAI : 

- 1 : increase the difficulty (at least should be as difficult as the multiplayer) 

- 2 : The RETURN OF THE TACTICS ROWS 

 

Isn't it ? 

[Biotic Flash Kick]

even so DA:O you could stack defense and never die 
DA2 as a bloodmage you could have like 200% mana sustains if blood mage was active

 

you've never die even on nightmare solo

 

how about a hiked up solo mode?

you start at skyhold at level 8. 

enemies are fewer but they are stronger and smarter and give insane xp. 

no party what so ever.

 

i'd love a dark souls type play in dragon age 

[fcedric]

Dragon Age spirit is cooperation, between races, peoples...

Peoples which hates each other at the beginning of the game become the best friend at the end of the game because they had an adventure, and more than one time was near the death together...

It is the spirit of Dragon Age / Mass Effect...

 

On my side, i never played Blood mage, in all my game DAO and DA2... I am a good mage, not an evil one 

I just got the trophy Bloodmage at redcliffes, but reloaded a save, and forgot this quickly, i didn't wanted to sell the soul of Connor...

 

But DAI Solo, why not... you can do it, now, without modification...

 

I just want my tactics rows, and a game more hard which push to use tactics ...

[ApocAlypsE007]

Yes i agree with you, the game is too easy, in DAO, playing in difficult mode was hard... When during your travel you fall on darkspawn event... with an emissary... and many many traps on the grounds... it was easy to be killed...

They should add more difficulty level, like in Diablo 3/Reaper of Souls...

DAO difficult? HAHAHAHAHAHA very funny joke, you just don't know how to deal with mages it seems. Mana Clash to instagib them. If there isn't Mana Clash, Crushing Prison or even Forcefield make the irrelevant. The others? Use focus fire and you are set.

[Arvaarad]

DAO difficult? HAHAHAHAHAHA very funny joke, you just don't know how to deal with mages it seems. Mana Clash to instagib them. If there isn't Mana Clash, Crushing Prison or even Forcefield make the irrelevant. The others? Use focus fire and you are set.

Or the mass paralysis glyph combo + stack AoE. And even if something goes horribly wrong, I have 100000 mana and health potions on my belt.

Of all the rose tinted glasses people have about DA:O, combat difficulty is the rose tinted-est.

[fcedric]

DAO difficult? HAHAHAHAHAHA very funny joke, you just don't know how to deal with mages it seems. Mana Clash to instagib them. If there isn't Mana Clash, Crushing Prison or even Forcefield make the irrelevant. The others? Use focus fire and you are set.

 

Very fun hahaha, when you fall on this event and you are lv8.. with an Emissary on the right, 6 Gemlock archer in front of you, 2 hurlock behind you, 10 wolf traps on the map (3 at your feet), and an hurlock Elite at 1 meters from your tank...

Sten or Alister trapped,

your rogue, trying to disarm the 3 traps at their feet,

you order the entire team do don't move (the arrows in their chest),

you as mage, trying to kill quickly the emissary with an LV8 staff (your rogue, is trying to disarm the masters traps (need 20 cunning + expert trap/lock knowledge) ...

 

Mana clash at lv8 very funny, crushing prison at lv 8 lol

you know perfectly DAO you are the Master of DAO

 

I know better than you DAO and DA2... but those events can occur at any level... this random event can occur when you are lv 8 or 10 and you still haven't access to mana clash, or crushing prison, or even the Templar specialization (anti mage power - i did 't remember his name) ... 

You need to be LV12 or15  ( i don't remember exactly) to access those spells/capacity...

 

Of course if you are lv20 because you cheated with "Traps are a Girl's Best Friend" quest, and leaving Lothering you are LV 25 those quest don't cause problems, but if you play regular, and tried to go in Denim to buy some Stuff and you still are LV8/9, and fall into those random events...  "the one with the wolves and traps for example) It is a bit more difficult...

 

[Jestina]

You pretty have to solo and be overgeared/overleveled in DA:I since your companions are incompetent and they've gutted the tactics system. With combat being so ridiculously fast now and over the top you need a solid tactics system in place.

[fcedric]

i want the old tactics system to fine tune my companions, and my character when i use a companion in battle, and if the difficulty can be increased it would be great...

 

Bioware can increase the difficulty of combat very easily, with two lines of codes... i don't understand why they don't do it...

It was the same with Mass Effect 3... the combat were too easy...

 

But if i want the old tactic system AND THE RETURN OF SPELL WHEEL, it is to be able to play differently...

To use different spells/capacity in battle without the need of changing spells before each battle...

 

It it not because i think the game is difficult (it is not) i want the return of tactics rows, it is to play DRAGON AGE like DRAGON AGE, and not like call of duty...

[Jestina]

The other thing I find annoying is they took out the ability to flip from a melee set to a ranged set...which you could do in DA:O.

[AreleX]

this is definitely the most disappointing thing i've heard about the game. would love an explanation for it.

 

the tactics weren't forced upon you at all. if you were casual, you didn't need them, and that's fine. if you wanted to take the extra step, you could, and i had a ton of fun in da2 trying to perfect companion builds and tactics. it was really rewarding to do, and test out, and play around with.

 

are ccc's gone, too? because that is up there with dark souls parry as 'most satisfying noise in a game'. absolutely orgasmic.

[frustratemyself]

...are ccc's gone, too? because that is up there with dark souls parry as 'most satisfying noise in a game'. absolutely orgasmic.

 

They are kind of there but are underwhelming. There is also a bugged one where shatter/rupture/basic combos detonated by Mighty Blow or Whirlwind cause only 1 damage or some other very low amount of damage. 

 

Lastpawn has created a compilation thread of stuff that doesn't work at http://forum.bioware...rk-compilation/

[thesuperdarkone2]

I miss the old games' tactics as they didn't have archers and mages run right up to enemies.

[fcedric]

The other thing I find annoying is they took out the ability to flip from a melee set to a ranged set...which you could do in DA:O.

I entirely agree... With my warrior, and my rogue in DAO, i was frequently switching between sword/bow... Usually Bow to stun all the enemies, and then i was switching to sword to approach them while they was stunned...

It was nice to have : Main weapon/secondary weapon

[Purplexd]

Dragon Age Origins is by far my favorite game of all time. That being said, anyone who thinks the combat was difficult is clearly not very good at it. I've had to find different ways to challenge myself because once you know the best talents/specs, the game becomes very easy. I've finished the game on nightmare without pausing a single time, or on a different run through I used pause but I never upgraded any gear, playing the whole game in tier1/tier2 gear on all party members. 

 

I do miss the tactics system, it's probably the thing I miss the most from DAO in Inquisition. I think that feature was one of the things that helped seperate Dragon Age from other games. But I also miss how every area you went to in DAO had it's own story. Some zones in Inquisition do this better than others, I liked crestwood and I definitly enjoyed the redcliffe area that was part of the mage quest. Too many zones in Inquisition felt like this... "Oh the Venatori are here? They're looking for an artifact? What does the artifact do? Who cares let's just get it before they do....." 

[TheBlackSwordsman]

While Inquisition is one of the best games i've played,i can't understand why they added so many features in customization,but taken out so many others in gameplay

[RVallant]

Didn't you know? Tactics are too hard for new-generation gamers. That's why they had be removed, we can't have gamers thinking for themselves and being clever in the game mechanics system.

 

Would I like them back? Yes. Will we get them back? Nah. Too hard for the developers I reckon; PR speak will call it 'a waste / inefficient use of resources'.

[Cheviot]

Maybe they thought that instead of spending hours trying to work out where to put a rule so it would actually activate, or labourously copying other people's rulesets, you could actually set off the rules in real time with the tactical mode in DA:I. If the game actually made clear that Follow can be used to keep ranged characters ranged, that'd be good.