209 réponses à ce sujet

[Bizantura]

You can't even call the game by it's proper name.  You go on the devensive by anticipating being called a noob.  Very respectfull to the game it is not.

 

The demands put on story driven RPG's by the player community is getting severe.  Retcons made by the devs, for what ever reason, are barked at.  Making RPG sequels with real various meaninfull choises harder and harder to make without risk of severe consequences.  No sane compagny wants a repeat with free ending dlc a la ME3.

So the story/consequence part deminishes in favor of other things.  In DAI indeed in open world combined with a lot of optional fetch quests.

 

I respect Bioware for still willing to make story driven RPG's albeit different then their prior RPG's.  It would be much easyer for them to choose a playing style for their game with a thin story around it like so much other RPG's.

 

A other option I would prefer is using the same backdrop (Dragon Age) but a full self contained story/characters just for that particular game so no characters can be ported over to the next game.  That way severe consequences can be maintained in the game without ruining any experience in the next game.  It would make the keep obsolete and to many people expect sequels so I don't think they will ever do it.  So realistically I don't expect earth shattering consequenses in their games anymore.

[Sanunes]

DAI certainly has it share of incredibly frustrating flaws.  But I think OP is taking it a bit far.

 

I mean, I don't mind not every quest having a cutscene (though yes, a lot of them definitely feel like filler fetch quests).  I do think that for such a huge world, it feels rather empty.  SOme more fleshed-out side quests would go a long way towards fixing that.

 

I think that is my issue as well, unlike previous BioWare games the quests lost what I call the "BioWare quest wrapper" which is the conversation you had at the end of the quest.  Of course to me that proves that no matter what BioWare does people are going to prove that they make horrible games because with Mass Effect 3 people were talking about how much the hated having to go back to "start NPCs" for every quest.  I am not also very happy with the Inquisition Power system for it can make people feel obligated to do the side quests, but I also think its vastly superior to the EMS rating in Mass Effect 3.

 

I don't have it anymore, but I think I finished Dragon Age: Origins in under 10 hours, I guess that means that Dragon Age 2 is better then it too since I can skip all that content.

[SkyKing]

Optional maybe, but do they have to be bad as well? Can't we have good fetch quests that fit into the theme of the main quest we're currently doing?

EXACTLY!  And have a point to them! The ram meat fetch quest, end with a cutscene of the chef cooking and people lining up to eat.   The gravemarker fetch quest, maybe have the spirit appear and thank you, etc.  The mosaics fetch quest, never got one since no way to know where to look and by chance you won't hit all the areas, but if a locator they should have a point, maybe a trophy room where they would appear.  The resources are a joke, you need need tons of resources for a training pit for your massive army of 2 sparing soldiers or for the tower that is ALREADY THERE in the back corner of your keep to put in generic templar or mage npcs, and all the extra ones are used for nothing.  The pointless fetch quests of when you see a letter on a dead body, "err I died, can you deliver my enema to johnsons table on the other side of the zone?", no interaction with any npc, must be about 200+ of those types of quests and I can't think of a cutscene for them since no NPC interaction to begin with.  

[katokires]

So you cheated to beat the game quickly, and complain about the shortness? Sounds like your own fault. 

Again you have serious mental problems, a real illness it seems.
Which part of 150 hours playthrough did you miss?
Also I had another of 80 hours and other minors for total of 300 hours.

I'm not complaining about the game being short, I'm complaining about anything else but this 4 hours of main story being ****. (However I acknowledge that not all side quests are shallow, as I previously posted, we have around 18 hours of good side quests, I still hate them, but they are well made)

[Adanu]

Ok..  so your opinion is that you wish there were less content in the game.   Why?  How does that help the game?

 

Less bad quests, more main story and buildup for the Inquisition so you don't feel like you went from a to z and skipped everything in the middle fighting a war.

 

Frankly, I'm amazed people actually enjoy a game that's 70% filler and 30% actual Inquisition stuff.

[Iakus]

I think that is my issue as well, unlike previous BioWare games the quests lost what I call the "BioWare quest wrapper" which is the conversation you had at the end of the quest.  Of course to me that proves that no matter what BioWare does people are going to prove that they make horrible games because with Mass Effect 3 people were talking about how much the hated having to go back to "start NPCs" for every quest.  I am not also very happy with the Inquisition Power system for it can make people feel obligated to do the side quests, but I also think its vastly superior to the EMS rating in Mass Effect 3.

 

I don't have it anymore, but I think I finished Dragon Age: Origins in under 10 hours, I guess that means that Dragon Age 2 is better then it too since I can skip all that content.

I believe what people didn't like about ME3's fetch quests was how Shepard basically had to be a creepy stalker and listen in on people's conversations to get the quest.  Then show up laster and go "Hey, I got the stuff you were looking for" to the "WTF" of the quest giver.

 

Actually DA2 had something similar where Hawke would find an item, and just instinctively knew who to give it to back in Kirkwall

 

DAI had more standard fetch quests, where the questgiver would bemoan the lost such and such and would you pretty-please return it to me if you should happen across it?  The problem is, there's not much in the way of story-based sidequests or conversations in said quests.  It all feels kind of soul-less.

 

I mean, compare DAI to a game like BG2, which has largely the same format.

[Farangbaa]

Less bad quests, more main story and buildup for the Inquisition so you don't feel like you went from a to z and skipped everything in the middle fighting a war.
 
Frankly, I'm amazed people actually enjoy a game that's 70% filler and 30% actual Inquisition stuff.

As if the main story is any shorter than DA:O, or any Mass Effect game.

[x2seeybir]

Again you have serious mental problems, a real illness it seems.
Which part of 150 hours playthrough did you miss?
Also I had another of 80 hours and other minors for total of 300 hours.
I'm not complaining about the game being short, I'm complaining about anything else but this 4 hours of main story being ****. (However I acknowledge that not all side quests are shallow, as I previously posted, we have around 18 hours of good side quests, I still hate them, but they are well made)

U mad or nah?

[x2seeybir]

As if the main story is any shorter than DA:O, or any Mass Effect game.

I have an 10 hour Origins pt and an 11 hour ME1 pt. There is no way you can do that in inquisition without eleet h@x0r skillz.

[hong]

U mad or nah?

Don't you understand? He's played this game for over 300 hours, so you should believe him when he says it's boring.

(He's just a poser though. The REAL pros grind multiple alts to level 90 (or 100, now) in WoW, and THEN say that it's boring.)

[Zered]

The game has it flaws, agreed. Is it a bad game? Hell no!

 

That said I would rather the side quests to be more like Origins, with cutscenes and stuff. Even DAII side quests seemed interesting, The Crestwood demo had cutscene integrated banter. That would be so much better then what we have now.

[Giubba]

Nope they are not. You need to do quite a few of them to build up your power level to unlock main quests.

Completely false. Usual misdirection by notorious hater.

There are multiple way to accumulate power

[x2seeybir]

Don't you understand? He's played this game for over 300 hours, so you should believe him when he says it's boring.(He's just a poser though. The REAL pros grind multiple alts to level 90 (or 100, now) in WoW, and THEN say that it's boring.)

Eye dun undrstnd eye haz mentill issyews.

[rapscallioness]

I liked some of these letter quests, though. They were like little short stories, and I wanted to know what happened. There was this one villa in...Emerald Graves--I think. Onterre. Anyway, it had this interesting little story delivered through torn diary entries of a young child and family that realized the child was coming into their magic. The extent they went to to try and contain that magic, or "make it better"--make it go away actually.

 

It was a sad story. The child ended up being decieved by some demon and killing their whole family.  Then there was Arcane Horror...

 

There was a smaller letter quest following some guy that was researching the rifts. He thought after awhile that he could do something to stop them. He gravely mistaken. There two camps I had to get to to see what happened. He wrote he was gonna give it try. I ran to the next marker hoping I could stop this fool before he got killed.

 

Alas, I found a letter saying what he tried did not work. At all. And that we were all Doooomed. Then the last line said, "Just going to lie here for a bit." That letter along with his corpse..face down azz up.

 

lol!, but aww.

 

Point is, I did like some of them. They were just little stories in the world. Mind you, I don't do a vast majority of the side/fetch quests, but I have no problem building power just from the war table and closing rifts.

 

What I think is going on is that people would like more visual representation of things. Some of the complaints abt ME3 were that they never Saw their war assets do anything.

 

This is not surprising because it is a visual medium. A visual representation of things has a much bigger impact on alot of ppl. However, the question is how does the studio do all this and yet still keep things within the parameters of their resource budget? I love cinematics, too. I'm not gonna lie. lol! I far prefer seeing a close up of npc's faces when I'm talking  to them (heck, seeing my own face while in convo, too), but they are demanding as far as resources go---from what I understand. I don't really know what the trade offs are, or what's going on.

[sandalisthemaker]

I really enjoy DA:I, but I will agree with you one thing:   The lack of cutscenes bums me out. They really do help me feel connected to what's going on, and their rarity in DA:I just feels off after Origins and DA2.

[Sanunes]

I believe what people didn't like about ME3's fetch quests was how Shepard basically had to be a creepy stalker and listen in on people's conversations to get the wuest.  Then show up laster and go "Hey, I got the stuff you were looking for" to teh "WTF" of the quest giver.

 

Actually DA2 had something similar where Hawke would find an item, and just instinctively knew who to give it to back in Kirkwall

 

DAI had mroe standard fetch quests, where the wuestgiver would bemoan the lsot such and such and would you pretty-please return it to me if you should happen across it?  The problem is, there's not much in the way of story-based sidequests or conversations in said quests.  It all feels kind of soul-less.

 

I mean, compare DAI to a game like BG2, which has largely the same format.

 

I do agree that there are missing tying story at least a few of the side quests, but I think what really gives that feeling is at least to me the majority of the side quests are the same thing for they are closing the rifts, find the camps, and find the shards which really drags on after awhile.  I am going to use a fresh example for I am just working through The Emerald Graves and the quests involving the Red Templars and the Freemen do tie back into the main plot points of the area and there three or four that are from exploring the area, but the majority of the quests in the zone are what feel like exploration ones.

[Farangbaa]

I have an 10 hour Origins pt and an 11 hour ME1 pt. There is no way you can do that in inquisition without eleet h@x0r skillz.

Someone on here (themikefest) completed the entire Mass Effect trilogy in less than a day.

I really enjoy DA:I, but I will agree with you one thing:   The lack of cutscenes bums me out. They really do help me feel connected to what's going on, and their rarity in DA:I just feels off after Origins and DA2.

I'm fairly certain the amount of cutscenes in DA:I is about even to DA:O. There is just a lot more conversation going on in DA:I. If they had to make cutscenes for all of those the game would still be in development, for a long time.

[CronoDragoon]

I'm fairly certain the amount of cutscenes in DA:I is about even to DA:O. There is just a lot more conversation going on in DA:I. If they had to make cutscenes for all of those the game would still be in development, for a long time.

 

For one, the amount of character-related content in DA: I dwarfs that of Origins. There were virtually no cinematic dialogues in Origins, and "new content" for characters was essentially a new topic for conversation opening up as they stood rooted to the spot. I much prefer the way that DA2 and now Inquisition have adapted ME2/3's style of having important conversations contained within special scenes, instead of playing out as if it were simply the Investigate dialogue.

 

I may end up simply making a topic about this, but I really don't feel like the fetch quests are the issue in Inquisition. They are a good way to encourage the player to explore, and it's simply not feasible to expect story-focused side quests to replace them, as if those two concepts have an interchangeable budget. Rather, what Inquisition needed was a stronger main zone quest for all the zones, featuring a longer story that provided more branching opportunities.

 

Crestwood is the paradigm for what I mean. Crestwood's zone quest is incredible. It's long, it takes you around the zone a bit, it has plot twists and interesting characters (and side quests within the side quest, like that royal spirit). Had BioWare opted to do that "over the shoulder" cinematic conversation style and maybe included one or two more choices in the quest, it'd be the ideal example of what to do in every zone. Unfortunately, some other zones lack this. Emerald Graves comes to mind where the zone quest is, other than the choice about Fairbanks, pretty damn boring and blends in with the rest of the "letter" quests. Oasis and Hissing Wastes don't even have a "quest". Fallow Mire is pretty good, but it needed a bit more exploration of the beliefs of the Avaar, through meeting more members of the tribe or otherwise. Emprise has very good story content for the most part, though the whole freeing captured villagers could have been made more interesting (the trip through the Keep to ultimately discover Imshael is pretty good, but somehow I missed Michel outside the village so it felt abrupt). The Exalted Plains is pretty weak here...in fact I'm blanking what Harding tells you is the point of the zone, really. The Western Approach is weird, because it feels like Here Lies is the story quest there, but there's also the Tevinter guy who you can judge afterwards that feels like it's supposed to be the point of the zone. But it's never really developed through dialogue.

 

One point in which some sell Inquisition short is that they forget to take the Judgments into account. The Judgments serve as great cappers to whatever story quest led to you judging the individual, and they typically offer four different ways to express your opinion on the situation. They are all really the "end choice" of the particular quest they are associated with, which sort of undermines the argument that Inquisition's side quests don't feature RP opportunities.

[Rawgrim]

Completely false. Usual misdirection by notorious hater.

There are multiple way to accumulate power

 

I gave the game a 7 out of 10. That is hate, is it?

[Iakus]

I do agree that there are missing tying story at least a few of the side quests, but I think what really gives that feeling is at least to me the majority of the side quests are the same thing for they are closing the rifts, find the camps, and find the shards which really drags on after awhile.  I am going to use a fresh example for I am just working through The Emerald Graves and the quests involving the Red Templars and the Freemen do tie back into the main plot points of the area and there three or four that are from exploring the area, but the majority of the quests in the zone are what feel like exploration ones.

Two quests that I think worked very well was Crestwood and Fallow Mire.  They had central goals that gave you a reason to keep pushing forward.

[Rawgrim]

The Crestwood area was pretty well done. More actual quests than fetch quests.

[cronshaw]

Is it possible to create a "DA has too many fetch quests/WoW/Skyrim/grrrrr"

sub-forum?

[DaemionMoadrin]

EXACTLY!  And have a point to them! The ram meat fetch quest, end with a cutscene of the chef cooking and people lining up to eat.   The gravemarker fetch quest, maybe have the spirit appear and thank you, etc.  The mosaics fetch quest, never got one since no way to know where to look and by chance you won't hit all the areas, but if a locator they should have a point, maybe a trophy room where they would appear.  The resources are a joke, you need need tons of resources for a training pit for your massive army of 2 sparing soldiers or for the tower that is ALREADY THERE in the back corner of your keep to put in generic templar or mage npcs, and all the extra ones are used for nothing.  The pointless fetch quests of when you see a letter on a dead body, "err I died, can you deliver my enema to johnsons table on the other side of the zone?", no interaction with any npc, must be about 200+ of those types of quests and I can't think of a cutscene for them since no NPC interaction to begin with.  

 

Yup, that would have been better. Also, if I help the refugees in the Hinterlands through all those quests, then I want to see that reflected in the world. People should stop whining about the poor refugees once I helped them.

The mosaics are displayed in your throne room, at the entrance and above, close to Vivi. You only get a codex entry for each, by talking to Gatsi once you completed one. Not worth the effort and the codex doesn't even tell you all that much about the history.

 

I liked some of these letter quests, though. They were like little short stories, and I wanted to know what happened. There was this one villa in...Emerald Graves--I think. Onterre. Anyway, it had this interesting little story delivered through torn diary entries of a young child and family that realized the child was coming into their magic. The extent they went to to try and contain that magic, or "make it better"--make it go away actually.

 

It was a sad story. The child ended up being decieved by some demon and killing their whole family.  Then there was Arcane Horror...

 

There was a smaller letter quest following some guy that was researching the rifts. He thought after awhile that he could do something to stop them. He gravely mistaken. There two camps I had to get to to see what happened. He wrote he was gonna give it try. I ran to the next marker hoping I could stop this fool before he got killed.

 

Alas, I found a letter saying what he tried did not work. At all. And that we were all Doooomed. Then the last line said, "Just going to lie here for a bit." That letter along with his corpse..face down azz up.

 

lol!, but aww.

 

Point is, I did like some of them. They were just little stories in the world. Mind you, I don't do a vast majority of the side/fetch quests, but I have no problem building power just from the war table and closing rifts.

 

What I think is going on is that people would like more visual representation of things. Some of the complaints abt ME3 were that they never Saw their war assets do anything.

 

This is not surprising because it is a visual medium. A visual representation of things has a much bigger impact on alot of ppl. However, the question is how does the studio do all this and yet still keep things within the parameters of their resource budget? I love cinematics, too. I'm not gonna lie. lol! I far prefer seeing a close up of npc's faces when I'm talking  to them (heck, seeing my own face while in convo, too), but they are demanding as far as resources go---from what I understand. I don't really know what the trade offs are, or what's going on.

 

Yes, those are normal side quests and I really liked doing them, especially the haunted villa. A fetch quest would be something like "get 10 elf root for the elven trader". If you can do it quickly, without having to step out of your way then I have no issue with it. If it makes you run around for hours, then something is wrong.

DA:O clearly had lots of fetch style quests, too... but since the world was much smaller, you never had to deviate from your path to do them. Marking 5 doors in Denerim was no problem because you walked past those anyway. Same for delivering the letters.

In DA:I those quests send me across huge maps and that costs time, for which I don't even see a proper reward in the end.

 

Yes, all those quests are optional. But do you know at first which one is important and which one isn't? Which one gives a good reward and which won't? So yeah, maybe for a second or third playthrough you can skip a few of them... but then, there is not much replay value in this game, so why would I play it again? For the few hours of predictable main story?

[The Mad King]

 

DA2 > DAI

 

There's a good doctor downtown, you should get yourself checked.