There are only 3 out of 9 companions that are gay or bi. If you look at gay male romances in the series, it's only 1 out of 17 (that's 5.8%).
This is what kills me every time. When people say that there are way too many or even an overwhelming amount of gay/bi characters. I wish they would actually take a step back and look at the numbers.
In the 'Females Everywhere?!' thread I actually made a count of all the lesbian and bisexual women in the series - by my calculations, there are fourteen, and that includes the dead appostate Ritts was passing time with. Meanwhile, I count eleven gay or bisexual men, including Dude On Balcony At Fancy Party #1 and his boyfriend Dude On Balcony At Fancy Party #2. It's possible that I missed a couple, but out of hundreds of characters with speaking parts across three games, it doesn't really seem like a lot to me.
Guest_TrillClinton_*
The homosexual stuff catering to 4% of the population
Citation or it didn't happpen. Also no, Will and Grace do not count.
Oh, okay. Fair enough. I'll stop.
Seriously, I wasn't trolling the thread. I was trolling the guy who told me that I'm not "a real homosexual" in response to my very serious (no sarcasm) question as to how he was defining 'gay agenda'. I just wanted to know how he was defining it so I could engage in a discussion with him where we are talking about the same thing. In response, he insults me. At which point, it became clear to me that he was just trolling too. The fact that he called SnakeCode an SJW was just icing on the cake.
So I'll refrain from responding to him in order to allow the conversation continue here. I can't guarantee that I won't chime in again if I have something to say, though.
After I say this:
There are only 3 out of 9 companions that are gay or bi. If you look at gay male romances in the series, it's only 1 out of 17 (that's 5.8%).
Citation or it didn't happpen. Also no, Will and Grace do not count.
Guest_TrillClinton_*
Based on the 2013 NHIS data [collected in 2013 from 34,557 adults aged 18 and over], 96.6% of adults identified as straight, 1.6% identified as gay or lesbian, and 0.7% identified as bisexual. The remaining 1.1% of adults identified as “something else[]” [0.2%,] stated “I don’t know the answer[]” [0.4%] or refused to provide an answer [0.6%].
Interesting statistics. Where was this taken from? Geographically that is?
Also in terms of the way bioware handled it. I do not think including gay characters is shoving the idea down your throat. The expression of their sexuality is only apparent if you do actually go for it
In the 'Females Everywhere?!' thread I actually made a count of all the lesbian and bisexual women in the series - by my calculations, there are fourteen, and that includes the dead appostate Ritts was passing time with. Meanwhile, I count eleven gay or bisexual men, including Dude On Balcony At Fancy Party #1 and his boyfriend Dude On Balcony At Fancy Party #2. It's possible that I missed a couple, but out of hundreds of characters with speaking parts across three games, it doesn't really seem like a lot to me.
Yeah, it's a bit higher for companions because that's the primary way that the romance function takes place, so in the first two games, most of the LGB (no T) characters were companions because, otherwise, how would we know that they were LGB (or T, frankly).
DA: O - 7 companions (not counting Shale or Dog) - 3 straight men (Alistair, Loghain, and Oghren); 2 straight women (Morrigan and Wynne); 1 bisexual man (Zev); 1 bisexual woman (Leliana); 0 gay men; 0 lesbians
DA 2 - 9 companions (including both twins and Seb) - 3 straight men (Varric, Carver, Sebastian); 2 straight women (Aveline and Bethany); 2 bisexual men (Fenris and Anders); 2 bisexual women (Merrill and Isabela); 0 gay men; 0 lesbians
DA: I - 8 companions (not counting Cole) - 3 straight men (Varric, Solas, Blackwall); 2 straight women (Cassandra and Vivienne); 1 bisexual man (Bull); 0 bisexual women; 1 gay man (Dorian); 1 lesbian (Sera)
The numbers are not terribly inconsistent across the games. In fact, there have been the same number of straight men and women companions in all three games.
The big difference is that there are just finally gay and lesbian companions in the series.
I've always wondered why Aveline get categorized as being straight. Sure she gets married to two guys but Hawke can only romantically kiss her as a woman.
I've always wondered why Aveline get categorized as being straight. Sure she gets married to two guys but Hawke can only romantically kiss her as a woman.
Does she? I've never gotten a female Hawke past Act I, so I didn't know that. Damn. You learn something new everyday.
Does she? I've never gotten a female Hawke past Act I, so I didn't know that. Damn. You learn something new everyday.
I haven't either but yes, apparently a female Hawke can kiss Aveline after doing the disastrous date mission.
"Gay KISA" thread is a wishlist of what people want to see in the next game. "Straight" threads are usually about people demand more options because they feel like they're the majority and deserve more options. There is a thread a long time ago about wanting a female "kossith" for straight males and it didn't get locked. You don't demand your parents to buy you a toy, you ask them to buy you a toy.
... I don't evenI don't support bisexuality as I feel it's not right. You can be born gay, you're not born bi. That's just a choice for people who like to fool around and it's damaging to people who truly are born gay.
I never did the math, just feels inaccurate then I suppose.
I have no problem with being gay trans or whatever. I wasn't trolling when I said I marched in the gay pride parade. If I knew how to upload photos off my iphone I would prove it.
I do however truly feel there is a gay agenda and it isn't hard to assume that the writer at this point in his life being pressured from the gay community to represent the ideals of the gay agenda may have taken deliberate liberties in his approach to the development of the storyline. Also it does offend me that he referred to Dorian as "fully gay" and not "55% gay" because I don't support bisexuality as I feel it's not right. You can be born gay, you're not born bi. That's just a choice for people who like to fool around and it's damaging to people who truly are born gay.
I feel I'm entitled to my opinion on this but anyways I am going to go play my game now since I CAN'T have a meaningful discussion without being attacked like I am the bad guy when I can promise you I probably offer more support for homosexuals being treated normally than most people on here. I'm not going to go out of my way and look for Bioware threads to attack people who suggest otherwise though and that's where the problems lay
Wat
... I don't even
Yeah. I don't think there is much room for productive conversation with someone who doesn't think bisexuals exist. (Did you not see any at the pride parade, dude?)
I am going to be good and clamp down on my urge to deliberately derail the thread and go out and buy some bagels.
Sexuality is a much harder thing to nail down than a lot of people would like, and labels like gay, lesbian and bisexual are more about self-identity (based on identity concepts that didn't really exist until a little over a century ago, even though same-sex sexual relationships pre-date recorded history) than an objective behavioural description (you can be gay or bi even if you're a virgin, just like you can be straight even if you're a virgin). It's pretty hard to nail down exactly what percentage of the population is gay, straight, bi, or something else because these labels mean different things to different people and because it's often hard to get people to be open about their identity when they might face hostility because of it.
Notwithstanding all of that:
1) The same sex romances in Dragon Age aren't just for LGBT people. Some of us can appreciate a romantic pairing that isn't like one we'd be part of. Especially if it involves Dorian.
2) Given that, in most games, gays and lesbians get zero representation, is it really so bad if, in this particular case, they maybe get a little bit more than they "should"?
Not that this is why it is important to have LGBT characters in a game, but some of us straight men really do appreciate seeing people who aren't like us and who are too often treated like they don't exist given first-class representation in a work of fiction aimed at a broad audience rather than being confined to niche genres.
Sexuality is a much harder thing to nail down than a lot of people would like, and labels like gay, lesbian and bisexual are more about self-identity (identities that, in the real world, didn't really exist until a little over a century ago) than an objective behavioural description (you can be gay or bi even if you're a virgin, just like you can be straight even if you're a virgin). It's pretty hard to nail down exactly what percentage of the population is gay, straight, bi, or something else because these labels mean different things to different people and because it's often hard to get people to be open about their identity when they might face hostility because of it.
Notwithstanding all of that:
1) The same sex romances in Dragon Age aren't just for LGBT people. Some of us can appreciate a romantic pairing that isn't like one we'd be part of. Especially if it involves Dorian.
2) Given that, in most games, gays and lesbians get zero representation, is it really so bad if, in this particular case, they maybe get a little bit more than they "should"?
Not that this is why it is important to have LGBT characters in a game, but some of us straight men really do appreciate seeing people who aren't like us and who are too often treated like they don't exist given first-class representation in a work of fiction aimed at a broad audience rather than being confined to niche genres.
Dorian is pretty awesome.
+1 for everything else you said too.
InExile
Sorry, missed your previous post.
That's the point, friend.
Something as subtle and invisible as sexuality should be portrayed as such; not a blatant shove-down-your-throat behavior of in-game bisexuals, transsexuals etc which scream about their sexuality after a few sentences. As I said, I appreciate Bioware putting an effort to implement them, but they failed in delivering. As such, this, for me, is a disservice to people of various sexualites.
It just happens to be the content. Stop over-intepretating.
And yes,the 'I find the female LIs unattractive' argument can be dismissed, as there is nothing constructive there. However, 'I find the depiction of an x LI unrealistic and childish, because of A, B, C, D' then it's an entirely different matter, that points to the lack of quality of depiction.
You people should chill the hell out. Anytime anyone speaks about sexualities, people here get so extremely offended and ready to jump to the throats of anyone who speaks about it, sniffing ill-will in every word. It's unhealthy.
It's toxic.
Peace.
India
1/7 of the worths population
Billion dollar profit margin
Edit: just googled and it was 180 BILLION dollar profit margin
I give Juromaro another 18 hours before he comes back with an alt.
Seems probable. I've noticed that on the forum I mod on, that the more dramatically they flounce off, the quicker they come back. I won't pad my assertion with bogus statistics, but I would informally estimate that it happens at least 60% of the time. It reminds me a bit of when I was six, and I would run away from home, because I wanted the attention of my mother coming to find me.
All I can think of when I see this thread is how most of you are proving OP's judgements.
The homosexual stuff catering to 4% of the population and those millenials who found it trendy reminds me of all the money EA is losing in countries that have banned the sales of this game.
I have gay friends, I lived with one for a long time. Doesn't mean I have to accept it and forcing it down our throats (pun intended) while removing content that would cater to the straight male population will come back to haunt them. The best thing they could've done is left Dorians character as is without the random backstory that made him look like a victim. Up until that point he was not a victim and I loved his character, afterwards I couldn't help but feel his self centered pride was nothing more than a coping mechanism for his feeling of inadequacy. It's made me depressed thinking about it. It also makes the inexperienced in the situation player think "maybe this is why they are all so flamboyant" which only causes people to think less of gay people subconsciously.
Whoever was in charge of his story had ZERO understanding of homosexuals. Maybe not even a gay consultant to make sure it doesn't offend.
While I don't like how they handle the first gay character' storyline, the writer himself is gay, and that is very personal to him.
This is what kills me every time. When people say that there are way too many or even an overwhelming amount of gay/bi characters. I wish they would actually take a step back and look at the numbers.
I do however truly feel there is a gay agenda...
No issue with your view, that's your view.
I think it may appear that way because any breadth of choice in representation in gaming is big news in the gaming press regardless of whether BioWare reference it quietly or more assertively.
I see no gay agenda, I see a desire for inclusivity and for people to have choices.
That's terrific in an industry that by and large lacks such equity.
I also see a huge load of entitlement being shared by some less broad-minded gamers, you just need to look on Twitch and youtube for those.
Hurt about not having a bevy of exclusive hot characters in boob armour to bang.
Those unpleasant views misrepresent other gamers who are just tired of hearing about or debating LGBT issues yet again,
and to those individuals it surely looks to be an agenda that is being stirred up.
I think those topics are not being debated because of an agenda, but simply because in our society they remain a hot topic - a forum allows for it.
I might add that tolerance and intolerance are not simply two different opinions, which may cause an apparent (and justified) basis for
what type of points require moderator intervention and those that do not.
Of course it's more complex that that and the range of views on this topic is not binary, it has many shades of opinion.
So posts on the topic rarely end well because we're back into a topic with deeply held emotional and/or moral (not logical) views.
I would be nice if all could just be happy that many people get to play the game their way, and let that be the end of it.
Eh...there were smart "straight male gamer" threads? The ones who didn't started with "Why girls have more romance option?" or "Why is there so much gay stuff in this game?"? There were those who actually didn't whine that girls in DA:I didn't looked like hentai characters like they wanted? There were ones that didn't act as little butthurt babies? Really? Seriously?
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